I am sure glad I am not living in one of these Muslim countries. I hope this country does not one day turn into a Christian country with similiar ideas. Mark Indonesia Reportedly Mulls Kissing Ban Feb 6, 2005 7:56 am US/Eastern JAKARTA, Indonesia (AP) Call it a kissing crackdown. Indonesia's government is considering a law banning unwed couples from pecking in public — and harshly penalizing those who do, The Jakarta Post reported Saturday. The campaign against kissing is part of a proposal of sweeping reforms to laws adopted by the country's Dutch colonial rulers in the late 19th century. The head of the panel that drafted the law said Muslim beliefs about decency had influenced its decision. Neighboring countries with large Muslim populations, such as Malaysia and Brunei, already enforce laws defining "khalwat," or "close proximity," a crime akin to adultery for unchaperoned meetings between Muslim men and women. Indonesia's revised laws would set environmental protection standards and punish human rights violations and terrorism, the newspaper said. But they would also impose penalties on unwed couples who kiss in public, while permitting police raids on the homes of those suspected of living together out of wedlock. p*rnography and public displays of "certain sensual body parts" would be outlawed and media, movies and songs censored. Penalties for law breakers would range from fines as high as 300 million rupiah (US$32,800; euro25,300) to up to 10 years imprisonment, according to the daily. President Susilo Bambang Yudhoyono and the legislature are expected to spend two years debating and revising the draft. Critics say the laws would let authorities restrict personal freedoms and muzzle the media. In recent years, Hollywood movies and TV programs have faced condemnation from religious leaders and government officials in the world's most populous Muslim nation who say such fare violates religious tenets on decency. Islamic conservatives — some of whom want to replace Indonesia's secular system with one bound by Islamic law — have been emboldened since the fall of ex-dictator Suharto in 1998. Link
yea, i sure hope america doesnt turn into a religious state,but i think it is a remote possiblity. but in regards to judging other countries laws and statutes, i would just say, "to each their own."
I don't think there's any chance the US will turn into a religious state. There are simply too many people (both religious and not) who don't think that's a good idea. I do hope (speaking as a non-religious person) that religious people have tolerance for non-religious people and (more importantly, IMO) VICE VERSA. As for "to each their own" that's fine as long as it's the will of the people. It's not okay when a few people in power impose their idea of morality on others (i.e. the Mullahs in Iran or Saddam Hussein). Let the people (or their elected officials) decide the law of the land and government's job should be to enforce it. If a law is old and outdated don't blame the government for enforcing it; blame the government for not representing the "will of the people" by having the law changed.
Point is not all people want this. Does majority always trump minority? Shouldn't there be limits? Mark
that our morals are wack. and we need to get over a lil bit of sexuality here and there in the public sphere.
So is a guy ripping of a girl's shirt when she doesn't want him to acceptable? I don't think it's as simple as just accepting a little harmless sexuality.
This is straight out of the Middle Ages. I wish this trashing of human freedoms wasn't as prevalent in some countries as it is. We're under pressure here in our own country, with assaults on our personal freedoms, but this is on a whole different level, and sadly similar to laws in other Islamic states. People in different cultures have differing ideas than us at what constitutes "democracy." We are getting ready to discover that in Iraq. Keep D&D Civil!!
This is a horrible incursion on personal freedom. What's next people not being allowed to marry someone they love?
Unfortunately, this is a line usually only pulled out when everyone's doing something an individual doesn't like. How about this: If we aren't citizens and they aren't doing something dastardly, maybe we should just butt out? If you're worried about subjecting a minority in the Indonesian population to the will of the democratic majority, how much worse is it to subject the Indonesian majority to the will of foreigners on the other side of the globe that know nearly nothing about who they are and what they want?
They have their country to do what ever they want. But I just would not want to live in a country that does not respect minority rights.
That's fine. I'm not sure that having a law that forbids kissing necessarily means they don't respect minority rights. We have laws on personal conduct in this country as well; does that mean the USA doesn't respect minority rights? Does that mean you don't want to live here?
They are talking about this as a first step to replacing secular law, as usual. Police raids in homes where people are suspected of living out of wedlock? C'mon JV. That's crazy. Would you support that here? Do you support sodomy prohibitions in Georgia because the state has backward views of homosexuals? Your assumption seems to be that any law passed in a democracy is a just law. I disagree.
I won't just do some kind of reality check and dismiss Indonesian laws out of hand. The country is overwhelmingly Muslim, conservative, and very foreign to me. If they feel that strongly about adultery, so be it. It isn't much different in kind from the vice laws we have here such as prohibitions against prostitution, drugs, gambling, public nudity, public intoxication, disorderly conduct, vagrancy (though I do have a problem with this law), and the like. In general, I support the State's right to pass laws to govern personal behavior that impacts the public good. I can see how an argument could be made that unmarried coupling hurts the public interest. Probably would be a lost cause in America, but hey maybe it works in Indonesia. So, yeah, in principal I'd support a Muslim country curtailing freedoms in the same manner we do here, even if we wouldn't dream of curtailing them here. I won't demand that the whole world act like they're Americans.
