Is there anouther guard in the NBA that does as many different things as Steve? In only his second year in the league Steve has got to be the most complete guard in the NBA. We can all see parts of his game that need to be polished, but damn the man does more on the court than anyone. Jason Kidd can rebound get a lot of assists and plays D, but he has never been as good a scorer as Steve. He strugled in his first few years just to shoot 35%. Gary Payton can score, dish for the assist, and play great D, but he can't rebound and block like Steve. Kobe, Stackhouse and Iverson can all score but can't do the other things that Steve does. Steve can rebound, hand out assists, score, get a couple of steals a game and block shots! He gets close to a triple double every night. I am not saying he is the best guard in the game, but he does bring more tools than any other guard. And with his heart and desire to be the best I think in a couple of years he will be the best. ------------------
True that...Steve is the complete package. ------------------ ------------------ Hakeem: "Exit Suugar Lan"
He will become the best guard in years to come. Only his second year and look what kind of stats he gets. Amazing. ------------------ "Break off the block like Maurice Green" --- Steve Francis President of the Moochie Norris fan club.
Oh...and how could I forget. 2nd career triple double for Steve. You know there will be many more. ------------------
Can't agree more. The great thing is he has improved his all around skills remarkably since his inception in the league and he will continue the improvement trend. He might even be known as a great defender before too long ------------------ Sometimes you gotta do the next best thing!
Gary Payton, if anyone, is a better all-around guard than Steve. crash, you said he can't rebound like Steve, but he still averages 5 rebs/game which is still very good for a PG. He rebounds almost as well as Steve, but Steve has nowhere the defense of Payton; not yet anyways. He can't block like Steve? Not sure what you meant there because it's not like either one of them is going to come near a blocking title. Hehe. If you want to add some places where Steve stands above Payton, try FT% and 3PT%. Amazingly Steve's a better thief (steals) and has almost an identical number of turnovers. ------------------ "No Brain Grant, no trade." -- Typos are a b**** as ZRB is holding Rocket trades hostage while he seeks a brain. Conspiracy theorists say this would explain why Hakeem has yet to be traded...
Steve needs to start Trash talking like GP. ------------------ "Break off the block like Maurice Green" --- Steve Francis President of the Moochie Norris fan club.
I agree. Gary Payton is the better guard...for now. But Steve still does more things on the court than Payton. And look at Paytons first couple of years in the league, no contest Steve's first year and a half have been far better. ------------------
Speaking of Francis, look what I found on CBS sportsline: Francis is the first player in the NBA to get 250 rebounds and 250 assists this season. Unbelievable! ------------------ "Jop tvai mat!" - Arvydas Sabonis after Steve Francis sat on his head after a dunk
I say payton is still the best point guard in the league, with kidd and francis right behind him. Kobe is also a pretty complete guard(about 4 boards and 5 assists to go with 29 points) A case can be made for up-and-comer Baron Davis, who is being compared to Kidd. ------------------ President of the Charles Barkley fan club...Oh he retired? When?
Payton's stats might make him look like the best point guard, but his attitude and effect on that team cancels all that out. He is not a true leader. Steve WILL be. ------------------ "Rarely is the question asked: Is our children learning how to put food on their family while being put to death."
I concur with ZRB. While both Payton and Kobe have excellent stats, their attitudes also detract from their team. I feel that Payton does not know where the fine line is between motivating his teammates and berating them. ------------------ The Rockets will be the NBA champions. Believe.
Kidd was the most amazing rookie i have seen in a long time. sure he didnt shoot terribly well, but he was so DAMN GOOD overall. also did you notice that both Kidd and Payton are from Oakland area. thats just crazy!! my now EX girlfriend is from there, ans she hates kidd. thats because he is an ass, but also because he always finds a way to destroy his opponents. from back in the day when he destroyed her highschool to when he was at Cal, and even in the Pros he finds a way to win. Kidd is not asked to score he has never been. im sure if the team needs him to score he could up his averahes, but he dowes give his team whatever they need. weather its a rebound or assist, or steal. #1 Kidd Steve is damn good, but Kidd had a better start to his career. ------------------ Hanta-Force Paintball http://www.hanta-force.com
steve can't run a motion offense or fastbreak like Kidd. he is a complete package in box score and fantasy leagues, only. with time, he can learn. he's just now starting to get our transition going more consistently. but, he is not close to Kidd in several, very important ways...and in ways that we need improvement. his dribbling is spectacular, yet difficult. Kidd's dribbling is easy and flawless. That is why he runs a better fastbreak, and looks so fluid, while Francis bops and hops in circles without getting anywhere. I love Stevie, but he is not a complete package, yet.
Steve Francis is the **** thats it. Gary payton or women beater dont have **** on the Franchise.They're both borin to watch.Steve Francis has me screaming at the set at other players when he crosses them or does his crunck a$$ dunks on them. Gary Paton=Borin and he beats up his teammates Jason Kidd=Woman Beater Kobe Bryant= Selfish b*stard Tha Franchise=13 pts,12 ast,10 rebs, 250 ast and 250 rebs. ------------------
HP, I agree that Kidd is a very good point guard, but he really is having a bad season, for him.He has more TO's than Steve, has created a bad situation for the suns organization, and has "led" them to, basically, a .500 mark since their 7-1 start. I just dont think Kidd deserves so much credit for the suns success. Marion, Delk, and Robinson are a BIG part of why the suns are good. ------------------
tacoma: the question is not who's better. It is "complete package". Francis's dribbling is overrated. He dribbles too difficult...like he's always playing one on one. His dribble is turn-over prone. And that is a FACT. Stockton, Payton, Kidd, Magic, Isiah...those guys never turnover on their dribbles because it is much more effortless and easy and safe, the way they dribble. Hell, he's only the second best dribbler on the team, imo. Moochie is better. He doesn't lead a good transition team. Another thing about complete package. Francis has not proven he can create a score at the end of a game, yet. Not like Payton can, or Stockton. Come on guys, be a little objective here, and get you head out of the boxscores and Stevie's ass. Stevie is a spectacular shooter from all ranges, strong rebounder, and has great passing instincts. But his dribbler is turnover prone for a PG, he's not a consistent point man on transition like Kidd, and he has not shown Payton and Stockton ability to take over at the end and will a victory. He's not a complete package, yet. He needs to improve.
Meanwhile at http://bbs.clutchcity.net/ubb/Forum3/HTML/010801-4.html Oeilpere has posted new details about our trade situation and everyone seems to think that thread has died. Oh, Payton, Stockton and Kidd are better. But Francis will be as good as Payton is in a couple of years. Just don´t overestimate his talents because you root for him. ------------------ "Dream another dream, this dream is over... Dream another dream, this dream is over... Dream another dream..." - from the Van Halen song, "The Dream is Over" (Thank you, Freak). Fitting, isn´t it? [This message has been edited by Thanos (edited January 27, 2001).]
crash, "you know the NBA has been trying to stop that the last couple of years" Stop what. I'm not referring just to palming calls. Don't read me so simply. I'm referring to all the slips on the court from trying too much. I'm referring to simply losing the handle. I'm referrring to not being able to dribble the length of the court in traffic, effortlessly, without a bunch of spins and hops. Stevie has a problem with his dribbling by making it too difficult. He is a one-on-one move dribbler. They are dime a dozen. Protect the ball Stevie, and quit slipping. sheesh. He should only have like one dribbling turnover per 5 games. Not 1 a game! this is why he is not a complete guard, yet. Every guard can dribble. This one is dribbles dangerously.
If he could do as you ask then he would be down to about 2 and 1/5 turnovers a game. That would be exellent for a point guard. As for now I can live with 3.3 a game. Don't get me wrong he definitely has some room to improve and my point is he will but no other guard does the wide veriaty things on the court that Steve does. ------------------
