PSA for members of Planet Fitness - men can enter the women's locker room

the consistent need to belittle other countries and refuse to examine the ugly faults within is another habit I sometimes LOL at as well

 

I dont see how this thread proves that. Considering we are, you know, examing the issue.

You brought up Iran btw

 

"examining" apparently entails creating a long sideways tangent about how men could use this as an excuse to invade bathrooms--because that's apparently how American men think and act when it comes to successfully approaching women (I find that sadder than what anybody thinks about transsexuals, though that itself is a tragedy and a half).

I brought up Iran, you brought up the belittling.

 

No you didn't, if you meant that you would have said that.

Why would somebody want to go to PF anyway? Join a real gym where you are not kicked out for exercising with some level of intensity.

 

Yeah, well, it's the internet.

 

where people are most comfortable expressing their inner thoughts.

and where I'm more comfortable expressing my LOLs at them.

 

I think they should just let the market determine if this is a good policy or not. If women end up not wanting to share facilities with trannies and other men pretending to be women then let them stop going to that particular gym and if enough do so they'll change the policy. If the majority of women don't mind sharing facilities with trannies and other men pretending to be women then why do we care?

 

I dont really regard trolling as people's true thoughts

 

A pretty good post, Bobby, but calling transgender people "trannies" is similar to other insulting words, words that attempt to place those that they are directed to on a lower level that "everyone else." I could give some examples of similar words used when insulting other minorities, some of which would get me banned, but I'm sure you can think of those words as well. I'm sure you didn't intend to be insulting. Just thought you might like a heads-up. Ain't cool, bro.

If anyone is wondering why I have an interest in this topic, or why I might know more about it than some of you do, it's because I'm quite close to someone who came to the conclusion that he was a male trapped in a woman's body, this after years of internal struggling over why he was unhappy in his skin. Since he figured out that he is transgender, accepting it, started hormone therapy, and came out to his family and friends, he's easily the happiest I've ever seen him. These are human beings, people. Sure, different than most of us, but it's a very difficult thing to learn about yourself. The consequences are immense. The decision to change your gender is NOT taken lightly. Those of you who use words that reflect bigotry may do so unintentionally, like you have here Bobby, I'm guessing, but the rest of you being deliberately insulting are no different than someone who uses very insulting and bigoted words to describe those who are of a different gender, like women if you are a man, or if you direct those words at people who are Black, Latino, Chinese, or Japanese, as an example.

Bigotry in all its forms is wrong. "Humor" at the expense of those a different race than you are, or a different gender isn't funny. You are simply displaying your ignorance for everyone to see.

 

Well, this for starts.

 

"Men pretending to be women"

I think that said it all.

 

"Trannie" is merely a shortened version of "transsexual", it's an accurate description of people who struggle with transsexualism. I'm not going to play the PC game where "transsexual" is appropriate but a shortened version of the same word is not. It's nothing like a racial slur, or slur of any kind and it does not reflect "bigotry".

I have the utmost sympathy for anyone that suffers with mental illness or physical handicap and I know things can't be easy for someone who has to deal with transsexualism. That said, I don't think you can expect society as a whole to play along with delusions even though it is the nice thing to do. If you are biologically female, you'll never be male. You can pretend that is the case, you can take hormones to try and simulate being biologically male, but you'll never be male. I have had some friends both male and female who have gone through it/are going through it and as their friend, I just want them to be happy so I play along for the most part, but I certainly don't expect everyone to.

I also get the semantic game that people try to play using "sex" and "gender" trying to make it seem like a female really could become male but it's nothing more than a game. Biology says that it is currently (and in all likelihood will always be) impossible. Even if a man mutilates his body in order to make it look female, he's still male. Even if a man takes on the traditionally female gender roles and dresses in a traditionally female fashion, he's still a male.

 

Honestly we are entering a place in this society where you literally can put the puppies in the oven and call them biscuits

Interesting - it is basically near 1984ish double speak
They are male but not men . . . .. well .. . kinda
There are no definitions just kind of vague generalities subject to change on a whim

Rocket River

 

Imagine you work up in a woman's body. How would you feel? Because that's what a transgender person feels. Whatever you want to call it, it's their reality and there is no known way to change that.

Do you have absolutely no ability to empathize with people who are different from you? Are you only able to judge people with your narrow minded and unsubstantiated thinking that's rooted in 18th century science? If that's the case, you have more in common with Islamic fundamentalist than you do with Deckard.

You call it a mental illness, yet the people who study mental illnesses don't. They disagree with you. So what right do you have to call it an illness - because your religious leaders call it that?

Please, stop being so ignorant.

 

Is this your assumption, or is this opinion based on personal experience?

Two things here,

1. I absolutely empathize with people who struggle with mental illness or physical handicaps....you know, like I said in my post.

2.Do you really think that it's "18th century science" to point out the obvious biological truth, that humans born male can't become female or vice versa? What century's science says that is a possibility?

We've been over this and I've quoted evidence to the contrary that you still reject. Transexualism is currently listed in the ICD and Gender Dysphoria is currently listed in the DSM. Don't be a fool and tie my opinion to religion when you know it's tied to psychology.

You are the one being ignorant here, most likely willfully so. It's pretty clear that to you this is an emotional issue and that emotion is clouding your judgement.

 

I thought the whole point of separated change rooms is because women do not want to see a stranger's penis, or women do not want their private parts to be looked at by a person with a penis.

isn't it more about how comfortable the women who uses the washrooms are with who they want looking at their boobs and vag, rather than which gender this trans person sees his/herself.

 

I'm probably one of the more socially liberal people I know, but if you have male parts, you should go to the mens restroom/dressing room. I don't care if you want to put a dress and 10 gallons of makeup while taking a dump in the men's dressing, you should still be in a men's dressing. Otherwise, we should just make all restrooms and dressing rooms unisex.

 

'Spic, Jap, Jew, Homo. Abbreviations can absolutely be slurs. It's not being a bigot to ignore the proper use, but it is rather insensitive and makes you look like a bigot. To be fair, I don't have any transgender friends, so if you really call your transitioning friends trannies to their face and tell them you're happy their mutilated bodies now match their delusional mental illnesses, and they are ok with it, I suppose I don't have a leg to stand on.

Being a transgendered individual in a locker room doesn't give you some magical pass to be a total creep, leering at others, exposing yourself to anyone and everyone, and generally making others uncomfortable. If you did those things and people complained, I'm sure that the gym would have no problem kicking you out, even if you weren't transgendered. This smacks of the same argument that was trotted out for decades to disparage gay men and lesbians; are you going to force them to use the opposite locker room because they might be attracted to the people changing in their locker room?

I can't speak for females, but I'd be rather surprised that any woman would have a problem with an obviously transgender individual who keeps to themself and follows standard gym etiquette. The next comment in this thread from a female that has serious qualms about it would be the first. It just seems more than a bit patronizing to read all these posts by men about how the fragile psyches of women will be shattered because they might accidentally catch a glimpse of a penis.

I also really doubt that any person is willing to present as female, lie to staff, and dress as a woman just to gain access to a locker room. It's not like you just walk up to the front desk, say you're transgendered and waltz into the women's room; the staff are human, and probably wouldn't let you in unless you were obviously presenting as female.

My personal belief is that there is a very strong biological component to gender dysphoria, and that sexual reassignment surgery is the easiest and most humane method of treatment, as suggested by current medicine. It's very interesting to me how the language used to disparage and belittle transgender individuals has flowed seamlessly from the belittling words used against gays and lesbians. Words like "unnatural", "mental illness", "against biology", "freak", "men pretending to be women", "women pretending to be men", would be right at home when discussing gay rights 10 years ago.

 

What a top-notch post. Bravo.

 

I wish I had made this post. Outstanding.