I used to think Harden was miles better than WB but not anymore. Yeah, Westbrook is out of control at times but he brings it every night. I wish Harden had the same kind of fire Westbrook has for the game.
WB had a HUGE game tonight. He now joins MJ (1989) as one of the two players to have had 40pts, 10ast, 5reb, 5stl in a playoff game.
Westbrook has a good game and this thread gets bumped. He'll have a bad game and it'll get bumped. Back and forth...
Is this even a debate? When Russell Westbrook is playing his A game, he is the 2nd best player in the NBA. In these playoffs, he has been the best player on his team. Durant has not had nearly the impact on games that Westbrook has had. As for Harden, I think it's fair to say that he did not play well in this year's or last year's playoffs. But more than that, Harden doesn't yet have the game to be a great post-season player. He gets most of his points from the line and hasn't demonstrated against good competition that he can beat teams from the field. Enough has been said about his defense. There is also the question of leadership. He is aloof, pouty and doesn't seem interested in doing the things that leaders do.
A bad WB game still has more impact than a bad Harden game. Why? Because he plays hard even if he struggles offensively.
Lolzzzzz this is like when Paul George all of a sudden catches heat. Who cares? -A. CAPITAL A.end of story Westbrook wasn't offered, nor would Morey had taken him over Harden. B. Westbrook is Steve Francis deux. They play so much alike.
Russell Westbrook plays both sides of the ball. Even if he has an off night on offense, he will make an impact on defense and on the boards. James Harden is a great offensive player, but until he plays both sides of the ball, he shouldn't be considered elite in any way. Harden is the most overrated player in the NBA. He makes for a good sixth man on a good team, but other than that, he's a stat padder on a mediocre team. The Rockets really need to dump both him and Dwightmare if they want to win a title.
In fact at least Francis was averaging 20 plus 6 n 6 for decent to BAD teams, we tend to overrate here. So Francis was and would have with KD been far more a efficient player with a great team, as compared, to what Stevie had here year after year.
His stats and effirncy this year matched only I believe Lebron,and Jordan (during some of his games)....counting...STEALS. Oh he's 24 he sucks at defense, ok. We know, and he knows. Hes overrated? Lol
Morey was lucky that the Warriors refused to give up Klay Thompson for Harden that allowed the Rockets to pickup Harden. OKC did right dumping Harden so they can make sure to keep the more valuable Ibaka. Morey is a total joke. He says he's all about sabermetrics, but ultimately, he made no ground until he was gifted with OKC's leftovers and an over the hill former star who he payed a max contract to in Dwight Howard. There's no sabermetrics going on anymore...its more like desperation. Morey should be dumped along with Harden and Dwight if the Rockets have any hopes at a title. Comparing Harden with Westbrook is like comparing Derek Fisher with Kobe. Sure, you can look at some numbers that will make an argument, but the sniff test is all you need.
I hate these efficiency stat references. Westbrook's PER was higher than Harden's this year. Plus, Harden is only efficient because he has the stupid run into defender offense to draw fouls. The NBA really needs to change their rules so that fouls are not called if the offensive player initiates the contact. Harden has been living off of loopholes in the rules. http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/hollinger/statistics
WB certainly got some flaws but he's bringing it all the time even when his offense is off. That's the first trait you should look for a star. LBJ only got "it" after several failures in Cavs uniform. I'm hoping this year and last year JH can really learn from them. If not, he's just one of the many "stars" who failed...
Derek Fisher has 5 championship rings and has several significant playoff moments. It may sound like my comments are ridiculous, but Harden has a long way to go before he reaches Fisher status in the playoffs. And yes, Fisher plays both sides of the ball.
lol the nba should change the rules so that defenders don't need to be in a legal defensive position?
Westbrook has had some good games but he has also had some bad games. To his credit, he's gotten better as they have gone deeper into the playoffs. If you want to compare "apples to apples" they look at each of them's first 6 playoff games this year. In his 6 playoff games this season Harden had a FG% of 37.6%, a 3pt% of 29.6 % and turned the ball over 3.5 times per game. In his first 6 playoff games this season Westbrook had a FG% of 35.5%, a 3pt% of 20% and he turned the ball over 4.5 times per game. Apparently you can have a bad start to the playoffs and still improve in later games.
I agree, I think PER is a pretty good indicator of offensive contribution. But the players PER is only half the story. NET Per gives a better picture because it the difference between the players contribution (his PER) and his opponent's contribution (opponents PER). As a PG, Westbrook put up a PER of 25.8 this year while his opponent put up a PER of 16.3. That ends up with a NET PER of +9.5 which is very good. As a SG, Harden put up a PER of 24.8 this year while his opponent put up a PER of 13.9. That ends up with a NET PER of +10.9 which is very good. Based on the NET PER Harden has about a 10% larger advantage against his opponent than Westbrook does. The interesting thing to note is that Westbrook's opponents are posting an above average PER while Harden's opponent's PER is below average( average is 15).
Westbrook simply because he works hard and understands what he needs to do to win, even if that means selfish play.
