Changes to the Rockets Front Office Management

Agreed. 7.5 mil a year for a center in today's NBA is absurd, unless your name is Shaquille O'Neal. And when you consider that Cato is a quality backup at best, there's no denying that this still ranks right up there with Moochie's contract as the worst decision this organization has made over the last few years.

Which is why I still can't believe how many people want to keep Cato when the Rockets have a decent chance to unload the guy this offseason! Ok, I'll agree that you shouldn't accept a bunch of scrubs in return for him, but if you can get some quality depth in an area where you really need it(i.e. the backcourt), then you pull the trigger.

Backup centers are no longer important in the NBA. Back when you had Dream, Patrick Eunuch, the Sadmiral, and Shaq all playing in the league at the same time, then of course you wanted a quality backup at the 5 in case of injury or foul trouble, but those days are long since over.

 

I don't think anyone needed a crystal ball to see that those picks sucked.

 

How about this.......Does anyone remember passing rasheed wallace for ...bryce drew , mirsad turkan and michael dickerson

Whatever collection of idiots was responsible for that draft day should be tar and feathered

 

I just want to say this complaining about the Rockets not trading Jefferson to get Griff is BS. I was a member when that happened, and on the boards. It was almost if not unanimously thought that it was a great deal at the time. Everyone was super happy and excited to land EG.

Now in retrospect maybe it wasn't the right deal, but nobody on this board had any different forsight than the Rockets staff did. But now since hindsight is 20/20 people want to bash the Rockets front office for making that deal. Looking back at history every team in the league would have dozens of different moves they would have made. It's not fair to judge your hindsight with the information available at the time.

Again most of Houston and judging by articles at the time most of the nation thought the Rockets made a great deal.

 

Well......they should have at least had him have one workout...

 

You are right. It amazed me no end that some people here actually acted like a 5 ppg backup center with 25+ million remaining on his contract in 3 years is a hot commodity in this league. Amazing really.

We are fans and get paid no money. They're supposed to be professionals and get paid loads of money. That's the difference. They should know better.

Fans having no clue doesn't excuse the managment having no clue.

When you are paid millions a year, you better have some clue and do the best at your job of scouting, evaluating talent. It wasn't too difficult of a job, was it?

In any other jobs with no guarantee contracts, people would have been fired long time ago for failing to reach the expectations and goals of your employers.

 

The difference isn't that fans didn't know because it's not their job, the difference is two years of hindsight. Also if fans don't know anything then why are they complaining about it now? They don't enough to analyze what they see. The professionals that get paid are the ones that should anazlyze it, and maybe they see EG in the future being a bigger piece to our puzzle than Jefferson would be. By your logic no fan should be able to contradict that because they don't know any better.

Also It wasn't just the Rockets front office, people who make their living covering sports, writing about sports, and anazlying such things all thought it was a good deal for the Rockets. Any time you analyze talent and try and predict the future it's a gamble. So comparing to other jobs where people would be fired isn't really fair unless that job is predicting roulette numbers or something like that. And with those odds the Rockets have done above average.

 

That is why....I repeat.....THEY SHOULD HAVE AT LEAST ASKED FOR HIM TO WORKOUT ONCE!!!!!!!!!! JUST ONCE.

Am I on everybody's ignore list?

 

Franchiseblade,

Im with you on this one. Hindsight is 20/20. I don't think anyone in the league had Jefferson ranked ahead of Griffin heading into the draft (lets keep in mind some pubs had Griffin as the top pick just a few weeks before the draft).

For someone to come along and single out our management and say they failed us because of the Griffin trade, is abosolutely ludicrous.

Also, we didn't draft Jefferson and then trade him. We drafted Jefferson for N.J. It is not a given that if the trade never went down, that we would have Jefferson on this team.

 

No way. I'm not ignoring at all. I agree a workout would have been nice, but I don't know that it would have changed anything. He could have had an exceptional workout, or his lack of experience and seasoning could have excused plenty of lapses.

 

Surely there have been some unfortunate losses of talent, but I wonder who is actualy pulling the trigger on the personnel moves. If it's Rudy then I hope whatever front office job he may land doesn't involve personnel acquisitions or contract negotiations.

 

As I've said many times, if "above average" is good enough for you, then yes, all is going well in the Rockets land. Everything is great. There is no problem. Nothing needs to change. End of discussion.

Maybe I just have higher expectations than you (well actually not that high, I just want playoffs). I wouldn't settle for anything less.

If my investment agent failed to reach my goal (i.e. earn a certain amount of money) in the stock market (a highly random job, isn't it), I would fire him straight away. No need to give a 2nd chance, let alone a 3rd, a 4th chance. I am not so generous and forgivable.

By the sound of you, I suppose you would wait your agent lose all your money before you reacting, right?

 

First of all, Cato is better than a lot of starting "centers" in the league. He is among the top 3 in rebound per 48 min. His total numbers aren't good because we need to give Yao the PT.

Second, I was not arguing that Cato's contract is good. You people need to read before you reply. I said his contract didn't look that bad now comparing to a year ago. The point is, I repeat, most people can't forsee the improvement of a player and thereby blindly bash the management.

BTW, the fact that Cato makes so much money and that he can be a good trade bait this summer is a sad testimony of how the league is so depleted in that position. That's why you have to give prop to the management for insisting to get Yao despite a lot of second guessing at the time.

 

like that local houstonian rapper t-2 said in his lyrics about kelvin cato. " cato needs to give the rockets their money back. " the rockets have made some bad choices. bryce drew mirsad turkan dan langhi jason collier ruining rodrick rhodes career

 

You misunderstand me. I didn't say the Rockets don't need to make better player personell decisions, I said that anybody complaining about the draft day trade that brought in EG is full of it, 99% of NBA staffs would have done the same thing on that draft day, and it's only with the benefit of hindsight that people are complaining about it.

Sure I think we can improve our decisions on people, but not as easily as you claim. I can name bad decisions made by every single team in the league. And while we are above average, I think it would be better encourage those making the decisions we have to improve their own scouting, rather than a whole sale firing of the lot, and hoping we can find people who would do a better job.

Which GM's and Scouts are available that you would want to hire after firing the Rockets staff?

What evidence do you have that they will do a better job than what we have now in the department of talent evaluation?

 

Name a good team that's consistently in the playoffs that has made as many bad decisions in recent years as the Rockets. Other than Portland and maybe Boston, you couldn't do it. The only teams you could point to would be the bottomfeeders of the league like the Wizards, Warriors(who could be better than us next season), Nuggets, Knicks, etc. And after four straight lottery seasons, that's who the Rockets are in the company of. Personally, I think "above average" is a generous euphamism for the current state of the franchise.

So basically, your strategy is to pat them on the back and tell them "good job" and hope they do better. What are we dealing with here, a bunch of grade schoolers?! These people are making a lot of jack to run a multi-million dollar professional sports franchise! If they're doing a sh-tty job, then you tell them to shape up or ship out! As the other thread stated clearly, give Rudy and his staff an ultimatum. If he's still here solely because of the two championships from 8 and 9 years ago(and don't tell he's still employed for any other reason!), then that's the standard he's got to be held to, not doing an "above average" job.

Like there aren't a thousand threads dealing with this subject? There are plenty out there that could just as well as this current group and likely a lot better.

Could they really do any worse? Six year contracts for Moochie and Cato. An eight year deal for Mo Taylor. Trading for an old, injury-plagued Glen Rice. Trading away Kenny Thomas. Drafting Bryce Drew, Mirsad Turkcan, Dan Langhi, and Jason Collier. Trading three first-round picks for Eddie Griffin without even working him out first. Drafting Bostan Nachbar and playing him a total of 77 minutes this season.

The only success they've had over the last five years is drafting Yao who was essentially handed to them, trading for Steve who was only available because he refused to play for Vancouver, and drafting Cat in the second round who has turned out to be a bad fit for this team in the long run.

Above average? I don't think so.

 

Very selective argument you are using there Dough ko. Look, I think the Rockets coaching and front office needs to be shaken up as much as the next person, but you just hurt your credibility when you make statemetns that are that unfair.

You are willing to penalize the Rockets for trading away Kenny Thomas, but you are not wiling to give them any credit for STEALING him away with the #22 selection in the draft? (Look at the forwards chosen before him, Quincy Lewis? ).

As its not like they just lost him for nothing etither. Posey is his equal, if not better, at a position where the Rockets weren't as deep. What were they supposed to do? Keep 3 PF's and play Glen Rice for 40 minutes a game? The Posey deal was a good deal for the Rockets.

Maurice Taylor was another free agent steal, he came over for cheap, played well, the rockets looked like they had their PF of the future, and then he tore up his knee. How is that the front office' fault?

Collier and Langhi were horrendous busts, of course, but really what did you expect? the 15th pick and a second round pick in one of the weakest drafts ever? Should they have held on and picked Joel Pryzbilla instead? (mike miller was ROY! Mike miller!)

"Could they really do any worse?" Yes. See Michael Jordan: Kwame Brown? Jared Jeffries? Juan Dixon? Hamilton for Stackhouse? Ouch.

 

Sorry but you are wrong. Dead wrong. Do you consider the Sacremento Kings a bottom feeder? Let's look at the draft where they selected Gerald Wallace, while both Jamaal Tinsley and Tony Parker were available to them. They clearly had two better options open to them, but they chose Gerald Wallace? The reason it doesn't seem as bad is because they are in the playoffs, but just looking at the player they got and considering what was available they screwed up.

Have you ever run a successful business? Been involved in one?

Nowhere did I say just pat them on the back tell them they are doing a good job and hope they somehow do better. But just firing the front office which may not have a 100% track record and hoping that after treating employees like that you will end up finding top notch quality people that still want to work for an employer like that is naive. The best would be to sit with the people who evaluate talent, and the coaching stafff, discuss what you need, what kind of system you want to run, and define the needs and where to look for the people to feel those needs, and then discussing how to develop the people you do find.

I've seen plenty of threads on a new coaching staff, but I haven't seen any showing who a better GM and scouting team would be. Please direct me to it if you know where it is.


Could they really do any worse? Six year contracts for Moochie and Cato. An eight year deal for Mo Taylor. Trading for an old, injury-plagued Glen Rice. Trading away Kenny Thomas. Drafting Bryce Drew, Mirsad Turkcan, Dan Langhi, and Jason Collier. Trading three first-round picks for Eddie Griffin without even working him out first. Drafting Bostan Nachbar and playing him a total of 77 minutes this season.

Of course when they drafted Cat they did make it to the playoffs. Also Cat in his current role may not fit the team, Cat off the bench might, or depending on what we could get in a trade with Cat as trade bait, that might still be a gread deal for us.

I'm frustrated we didn't make the playoffs too, but I won't let my frustration blind me into throwing out the baby with the bathwater.

 

Why would a team with Mike Bibby and Bobby Jackson need to draft a point guard? That's a weak example. What about all their other great moves? Like having the sack to trade the flashy, popular Jason Williams for the steadier, more mature Mike Bibby. How about taking a chance on Jim Jackson when no one else in the league would? Signing Keon Clark? And these are all moves they've made in the last two seasons well after they were already a title contender.

Meanwhile, there are a decent number of people on this board who think the Rockets(who BTW are nowhere close to contending for a title) should stand pat this offseason. I'm still waiting for your list of "above average" teams that have made bad personnel moves in recent years.