It's speculation, but I've never heard anyone that scouted him or any scouting reports that said he was a very good ballhandler. All I hear he is a good ball handler for "a guy his size". At 6'9" that's really not saying much. Most of the stuff I read (sorry, I know scouting reports can be off, but its the only thing almost everyone has), says he is a little prone to turnovers if he is asked to be a point forward. I just don't see the comparison between Barry and Nachbar.
Doc Rocket! You, my friend, KNOW good basketball when you see it! Not many people do. Thanks for your thoughts! I agree! 100%! The only thing I can say is, wait three more years. Francis is still a puppy. I hope he can learn how to play the game the right way. We can't give him back to Vancouver.
Then the question is: would Steve accept the role of SG? If he wouldn't you would have to consider trading him. Trading a star of his calibur would be a gamble, but it can work (look at the Nets).
If the Rockets are going to make a choice between Francis and Mobley to trade I would rather them trade Francis. First the Rockets can get way more for him and he seems more temperamental than Mobley. Mobley plays better D and would probably handle losing Francis better than Francis would handle losing Mobley. And Francis moving to SG might piss him off a little more. The problem is there is no Jason Kidd out there to trade him for and Andre Miller is no Jason Kidd. Maybe a package of Francis, Griffin, and Rice for Garnett type of trade. Then bring in a scrub PG like Snow or Alvin Williams to distribute to our stars.
One of my favorite quotes... "Jason [Kidd] found me open even when I didn't know I was open." - Ray Allen, talking about his All-Star experience with Kidd. Jason would make Mobley an All-Star.
Steve's turnover stats kind of suck. But I still refuse to think that he cannot learn... About Miller: So he doesn not have a talented enough supporting cast to lead that team to a winning record? I guess the fact that Brand, Odom, Olowokandi will probably all get something close to the max means they have no talent? And Maggette, Richardson, Piatkowski, Wilcox, Jaric are players who shold not be in the league? Where exactly did Miller lead the USA in the world championships? Something to think about.
I think the reasoning is not that Miller would help win games with his shooting but instead with his ball handling, defense and decision making. Make no mistake watching Steve Francis at the end of the last several games has been like watching a comedy of errors. As if the game against Utah was not bad enough (and it was very bad) the game against Atlanta was just plain sickening to watch. Once again last night against Denver in the fourth quarter with the game close Steve Francis turned into one big mistake after mistake during the pivotal time during the game. In each of those games Steve Francis made turnovers and mistakes during the closing minutes of each game, not just one or two but one after another play after play. If not for the 3pt shooting of Posey we would have lost to Denver last night…period. Hopefully with someone like Miller running the point the ball will be passed around much better, we will not have wasted offensive possessions (particularly at the end of games when the score is close and time is running out), scoring chances for everyone on the team (including Steve) would increase because of better and smarter ball movement. After 3.5 years in the league Steve Francis still charges into the heart of the defense with no recognizable plan and still makes the same mistakes and costing the team valuable possessions by doing it. The last person I want making decisions at the end of games is Steve Francis. I don’t have a problem running a play for him to take the last shot but I don’t want him running the offense so he can make the same mental mistakes that he does night in and night out. BTW, my problem with Steve as a point guard has less to do with the number of shots or his passing and mostly centers around his decision making process and endless number of mistakes he makes at the end of games.
I am really suprised that many on this thread are down on Stevie as a PG or rather a smart floor general. I thought I thread like this with incur the wrath of Steve's loyalists. Anyway I guess many are seeing the light. Steve is a very likeable and hardworking young man; but that will not cut it. Like some gents/lady stated earlier on this thread, our beloved team's style of play is very very annoying and often times down right ugly. We win most time because of the superiority of the talent at our disposal but I will prefer we win as a coherent "basketball team". Coach Rudy is a "player's Coach" and a loyalist - I doubt if he will be interested in moving Stevie or The cat or even changing their roles. Heck I doubt is Rudy "puts his feet on the ground" as far as these are concerned or maybe they don't listen to him anymore. It does not good but I looks promising though with Yao as the "Queen". Go Rox!
Is it possible that Steve sometimes played poorly because Rudy always milks him too much? I mean the guy seldom gets any rest compared to his teammates. How can he always maintain a good play level if he averages 40+ minutes per game, especially if Rockets play 5 games in a week?
Andre Miller's last season at Cleveland, he averaged 11 assists per game on a very untalented team so I don't understand what your point is.
Not trying to disrespect or anything. I was wondering how does DocRocket know so much about the Rockets, and how does he know the insights. I'm new to Clutchcity and was wondering how he know all this. Thanks, I would really appriciate it if some could reply my message.
IMO, Steve is NEVER going to accept a 2-guard role on this team. In fact, his current play indicates such. To be content, he has to dominate the ball via dribbling, directing traffic, looking for his shot. He is NOT going to be happy coming of screens for jumpshots and cutting to the basket for backdoor plays. I've played with several guys with the same mentality as Steve and they wanted to win just as bad as Steve, but only if it was by their hand. Steve is so entrenched in his ego that if a teammate is gonna score, he'll insist that it will be off Steve Francis' assist. All the signs are there - Steve Francis is either very insecure about himself or just very much in love with Steve Francis. Either way, he's not gonna work out at the 2-guard for us.
I didn't think my point was that hard to understand. Miller has played with little talent around him and with a lot of talent around him. He has been in the league as long as Francis. He has played in the World Championships with very good talent around him (in contrast to Francis). No matter if Miller had good or bad talent around him, he has never managed to lead a team to a winning record. Francis has. And don't tell me that the team we had two years ago was really more talented than the Clippers are this year. I am not saying Miller sucks and I am not saying Francis is without fault. However, I am pointing out a fact, and that is that Francis has led a team to a winning/successful record (although not into the playoffs), Miller has not (so far), although he sometimes has and had very good talent around him. Do you understand my point now?
I think Steve plays 40+ because he wants to play 40+. All he wants to do is win, and he sees that the only way we do win (based on last year) is if he must play as much as possible. I think once he gets past his dramatic experiences from last year he will be more willing to share the ball, conciquently resulting in better decision making (meaning he will not force it anymore... I hope.)
Ok, I see your point now. Miller hasn't led a team to a winning record. He played on a piss poor Cleveland team that had absolutely 0 talent yet managed to average 11 assists/game. So far he's played 30 games with a team that has 0 chemistry with players looking to take the first plane out of town.. Steve Francis has been with the Rockets throughout his entire career. He and Mobley have been playing together for how long? Surprise, these two players take almost 1/2 the shots on the team. I know this might be a shock to you, but chemistry is as important as talent. As far as the World Championships, that was a disaster waiting to happen. That team was not built for international play. Whether it was Steve Francis or Andre Miller, it wouldnt have made a difference. The team had huge offensive liabilities.
Doc, you are right on the money. Steve is one of the top 10 or 15 talents in the game, but may now be the 2nd best BASKETBALL player on this team. I hate to say Bill Walton is right about anything, but he hit the nail on the head when he said Yao is mentally light years ahead of everyone else on the court. I think this year's team is very much like the early 90's pre-championship era teams. We could beat the un-beataBulls but get spanked by the bottom feeders. Asking Steve and Cat to change their mental approach to the game may be impossible to do as long as Rudy allows the team to freewheel and break plays without conscience. I would give anything to see the Rox deal Mobley for Eric Snow or someone of that ilk. Someone who can bring the ball up the court, get the team into the play, play a little d, and hit a shot when left open. Until Rudy sets some roles and has the players to accept those roles, we'll struggle to be a .500 team. Just my .02.
this seems reasonable: Houston trades: SF Glen Rice (9.3 ppg, 3.4 rpg, 1.3 apg in 28.3 minutes) PG Moochie Norris (4.9 ppg, 2.2 rpg, 2.6 apg in 19.7 minutes) Houston receives: PG Damon Stoudamire (6.0 ppg, 2.6 rpg, 2.9 apg in 21.4 minutes) Change in team outlook: -8.2 ppg, -3.0 rpg, and -1.0 apg. Portland trades: PG Damon Stoudamire (6.0 ppg, 2.6 rpg, 2.9 apg in 21.4 minutes) Portland receives: SF Glen Rice (9.3 ppg, 3.4 rpg, 1.3 apg in 30 games) PG Moochie Norris (4.9 ppg, 2.2 rpg, 2.6 apg in 34 games) Change in team outlook: +8.2 ppg, +3.0 rpg, and +1.0 apg. TRADE ACCEPTED
