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[ANALYSIS] Post summer league critique of the youngsters

Discussion in 'Houston Rockets: Game Action & Roster Moves' started by codell, Jul 19, 2012.

  1. codell

    codell Contributing Member

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    Clutch, I didn't see a similar thread. If i missed it, please merge. :)




    Now that Summer League is over (for the Rockets anyway), would like everyone's thoughts (good and bad) on our youngsters.

    My observations are based on no Howard, no Bynum so take with a grain of salt as things may change of course.


    Jeremy Lamb - A-

    Offense - Lamb is indeed a flat out scorer. He can score outside, inside, on the break, you name it. Kevin Martin clone? Pretty close. He is a bit of a black hole, forcing some shots that in summer league he can get away with against lesser defenders. He had a couple of nice passes in traffic, would like to see more of that. As of now, would appear he is the default starter at SG. With Lin as his backcourt partner, it would seem there is a high probability that the ball will be dominated by the backcourt. If Martin was gone and we had kept Lee, it would have been neat to see Lee start and Lamb come off the bench in a James Harden like offensive role.

    I missed about 8-10% of the summer league games, but I don't recall seeing Lamb run off screens at all or spotting up looking for passes out of the post (double teams). This may not be his game.

    Defense - His body reminds me of Stacey Augmon. Wirey, skinny, long arms. Point here is, he can separate himself from the K-Mart comparisons if he puts the work in. IMO, no reason for him not to be a plus defender (ball hawk?) in time. Other summer league guards seemed to penetrate at will on him. If he improves on D, with long arms, he could not only be a good defender on other 2s, but think he could seem some time guarding 1s depending on matchups.

    Again, will be interesting to see how Lin and he co-exist in the backourt together if both play big minutes.

    Royce White - B

    Offense - In the last game against Chicago, someone had mentioned how much more effective he can be if he could draw double teams in the post. I think he is a long way away from that, but there is potential. He definitely has a knack for low post scoring (off of put backs mostly), but his moves appear to be limited. If he works on his post game (especially if he plays the 3), he could be a serious weapon. As far as an outside game, I saw zero mid range game from him. If he is indeed a 3, he is going to have to develop a respectable mid-range game.

    Defense - He can definitely hold his own down low and I think he will be a good rebounder. Guarding 3s out on the perimeter? Like Lamb, quite a few folks just drove right past him. Some have mentioned that his body type reminds of Charles Barkley. I think that is spot on. Barkley was a bit "pudgy" when he came into the league and really toned up as he entered his prime. Would like to see him tone up and maybe lose 10 lbs or so so he is a little quicker on the perimeter. For now, I think he has a chance to lead the league in fouls per minute.

    White definitely has the make of a leader and maybe even an enforcer type. Every great team needs someone like him.

    T. Jones - A

    Offense - I had no idea this guy had the ball handling abilities that he has. Saw him grab rebounds and take the ball up leading the break. Was very impressed with his ability to take his man off the dribble. Being left handed, he is obviously most comfortable going left. He will need to develop the ability to go right to keep his man honest. His jumper, well, its slow and ugly, but like White, if he can develop one out to mid-range, he will be fine. Had a couple of nice passes that I recall after facing up and taking his man off the dribble. Read some things that say he is a tweener. I don't agree at all. IMO, his future is at the 4, with spot minutes at the 5 depending on matchups. I think he is tough enough to handle the 5 on occasion, and his ability to face up and drive it inside could create a huge matchup problem at times against big plodding centers.

    Defense - Love his rebounding, especially offensively. Appears to be plenty strong and athletic, so despite being "undersized" (hey since when is 6'10" 252lbs considered undersized? lol), I think he can handle the 4 just fine. Like White, I don't see him being able to handle the 3 postion at all defensively.

    Not sure how effective he would be as a starter, at least, for the near future. I think he has the potential to excel off the bench next year. He reminds me of Roy Tarpley for some reason. Tarpley was a bit leaner, better jumper, but was super 6 big man off the bench for some of those great Mav teams of the late 80s.

    D. Montiejunas - A+

    Offense - Unlike most on here, I haven't see him play or even highlights. All I have to go off of is what I saw in summer league and I was impressed. I see folks sticking him at the 5 and I know he played there in SL, but I just don't see it in the regular season, not mainly anyway. He needs another 15 lbs or so to play there consistently. His offensive game, wow, way more diverse than I could have imagined, almost Scola like in that he is a scorer and can hurt you many different ways (much better range than Scola though). McHale is a perfect coach for him to work with. His release is very quick for a big man. His flat footed jumper worries me against long athletic big men. Wouldn't surprise me to see him averaging between 14-18 PPG if he is a 2nd or 3rd option this year.

    Defense - I like his hustle. Moves his feet real well and I like how he consistently flashed out when defending the PnR, although he got caught out of position a few times when doing this (no big deal IMO). Good rebounder obviously, he has a nose for the ball but he needs a bit more weight as he was pushed around battling for position, especially in the Sacramento game. I think his pride alone will eventually allow him to be a slightly above average defender, at worst.

    Overall, I love his attitude and confidence. He has a really nasty disposition and I think he is going to regularly get under people's skins (which can be a good thing). Also love that he is a lefty. I think he could be a real matchup problem for opposing 4s with his ability to work outside and inside.

    M. Morris - Inc.

    Offense - Not going to say much here because quite frankly, he didn't play as much as our "Big 4". He showed flashes of some decent offensive. He can obviously play/shoot outside and has adequate range. Made a few nice passes, but I don't think you want the ball in his hands creating his own shot or leading the offense. His future may be most effective off the ball spotting up mid-range or cutting to the basket. Curious as to why he didn't see as much time as some of the others as you would think the Rockets wanted to "showcase" him for a trade. My conclusion was he hasn't been serious discussed as part of a Howard/Bynum trade.

    Defense - I am going to let someone else grade him here. Nothing of note stuck out to me.

    S. Machado - B-

    Offense - If he is your starter, you are in trouble. I think he could carve out a fine career in limited minutes as a backup against lesser PGs. His outside game is solid, but I think most teams will play him straight up, not fearing his shooting or his driving. Was able to get by his man and into the lane a few times, but I don't see that happening much against legit competition.

    Defense - Not much observation here, but he does not appear to be either quick or athletic. Again, if Lin is injured and Machado has to guard starting 1s for big minutes, we are in trouble.

    I really think Morey may try to find a veteran point guard for 12-13 to backup Lin and keep Machado in street clothes or the D league to see if he can grow into a competent backup PG for 13-14 and beyond.

    Z. Dragic - D

    Offense - I may have missed it, but did he make any outside shots? He seemed to be more comfortable mid-range/inside. Didn't observe anything good/bad as far as passing.

    Defense - Nothing of note on my end.

    His future is D league fodder or bust. Like Machado, maybe Morey can find a veteran backup for Lamb as I don't see any other candidates to play the 2.

    G. Forbes - unk

    Offense - Nothing of note stuck out, but seemed to recall him being active.

    Defense - Again, nothing of note stuck out.

    Based on what he did at the end of last year, can this guy play 2 at all? lol I wish. Definitely a keeper it seems and should be in uniform every game.
     
    #1 codell, Jul 19, 2012
    Last edited: Jul 19, 2012
    4 people like this.
  2. Aceman2009

    Aceman2009 Contributing Member

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    I think machado game into hisown a little more in the last 2-3 games. i saw more of the great passing that people had talked about but only time will tell if he has what it takes.

    and this is the 12-13 season. last season was 11-12 so kinda late to get a vet pg. :p
     
  3. codell

    codell Contributing Member

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    Edited thanks.
     
  4. Bogey

    Bogey Contributing Member

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    The best part of Whites game was grabbing the defensive rebound and pushing the ball up the court and leading the break. Didn't see that mentioned.
     
  5. rkh-dog

    rkh-dog Member

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    I generally agree with your take on the young players. I noticed you didn't mention Royce White's passing/assist abilities. Having viewed all 5 games, I noticed that White was one of the only players with the ability to effectively pass the ball to the post. Too many players ignored the post pass or had turnovers if they attempted to pass to the post. He showed more playmaking/facilitator ability than any other big man. His post moves were frequently blocked by big men not much longer than him. That surpised me.
     
  6. heypartner

    heypartner Contributing Member

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    nice thread. I was at Vegas for Game 1,2,3...but still need to watch archives of 4,5 to contribute to this thread. I have to watch Breaking Bad now. Will contribute more on Saturday.

    thanks codell for making this thread!
     
  7. codell

    codell Contributing Member

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    ..I had you in mind buddy when I made it. :)
     
    #7 codell, Jul 19, 2012
    Last edited: Jul 19, 2012
  8. heypartner

    heypartner Contributing Member

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    Had to recover a bit, first. Flew home on Tuesday and went to sleep. Wed night after work tried to watch archive of game 4 and fell asleep again.

    Vegas, phew!
     
  9. codell

    codell Contributing Member

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    Yeah obviously White's passing was a joy to watch. McHale mentioned during the Chicago game that he felt White is much more comfortable passing than scoring.

    Anyway, sorry I left out White's passing. His handles/passing are his biggest asset by far, although he tries to make the spectacular pass a bit too often for my taste.
     
    #9 codell, Jul 19, 2012
    Last edited: Jul 19, 2012
  10. DAROckets

    DAROckets Contributing Member

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    Nice analysis,agree with most of it.The rookies all looked awesome ,really love the way all 4 bring a different set of skills .. That's what's so intriguing about letting them develop together.

    If it's just a young rebuild team I wouldn't mind having a spot for Machado and Dragic.. Both of these guy's need to really improve on shooting but did shine in other areas.Don't think either would be an NBA quality starter but a stint with the Vipers wouldn't hurt .

    ..btw Morris and Forbes were both extremely ill . That's why you didn't see Morris much.
     
  11. txppratt

    txppratt Contributing Member

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    jeremy lamb, machado, d-mo, rolls royce, and terrance jones should all get big minutes this upcoming season. (assuming no big trade)

    they all played excellent in summer league. i think jeremy lamb is the only one i'd give an A to. yes, they're young and we will have to struggle through some losses, but these players are a great young core to begin with.

    for summer league (against lesser NBA talent, mind you):

    lamb (A) consistent scorer, good decision maker. easily the best player on our team. he's got a sweet touch.

    motiejunas (B-) got pushed around alot by lesser talent, but showed some nifty moves. good effort and good at running the floor. nice outside shot. looking forward to seeing what mchale can do with him.

    machado (B) reminds me of ish smith. 3 pt range is questionable, but good mid-range game. all-out hustle. good passing and very quick - can get in the lane.

    white (C+) i know i'm being hard on him here, but alot of his buckets seemed to be poorly defended (maybe he just knows when to attack?). his passing is good... about 2/3 the time. a few questionable passes. but i like his court vision. good handles. good rebounding. but length is an issue, it seemed like he missed alot of shots that were well defended - he will have to adapt. i think he will.

    jones (B+) probably because i had no expectation for him. but what i saw was a hard nosed baller. good all-round game. good drive. he always seems to make the right play or be in the right spot. good decision maker, good rebounder. willing passer, good spacing.
     
  12. jtr

    jtr Contributing Member

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    D-Mo - I had seen a number of Prokom games, and his improvement over the last 12 months has been phenomenal. The man is committed. His speed down the court on the break is breathtaking for a 7 footer. The one thing I did not see in SL is his excellent passing out of double and triple teams. If he can get to the point in the NBA where the opponents have to double team him, his assist rate will sky rocket. He mentioned in an interview that he is having trouble adding another 6 kg (~14 pounds), so it may be a few years before he can man the 5.

    Lamb played in SL just like he played in college. A scoring machine. If UConn didn't play a ball hogging PG and SF he probably would have scored 25 ppg. I believe that he will be a very good defensive player in the NBA. His build and athleticism provides him with a great set of tools. His face may look sleepy, but he has a cold cold heart when shooting the ball.

    Jones is an interesting case. I was only mildly surprised at his performance in SL. That Kentucky team made it very difficult to judge his talent. But no matter what he may be a match nightmare for most PF's in the NBA. And I agree with your assessment - he is way to left hand dominant.

    Overall I was disappointed at the Rockets defense. But I guess that the played one v one on the offensive side too, and maybe the defensive schemes and intensity will improve with practice.
     
  13. ObamaFan

    ObamaFan Member

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    LOL how does D-Mo get an A+ with that stinker he had in 2nd game of the summer league haha

    Lamb and T.Jones played the best
     
  14. YourSecretLover

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    As long as White defends, rebounds, and hustles well than I'm happy. I'm not expecting much from hi in terms of scoring since we have plenty of scorers on this team(Lin,Kmart,Lamb, Donuts,etc.) I can't wait to see his passing skills with Lin and Parsons.
     
  15. leebigez

    leebigez Contributing Member

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    No team will double white until he prves he can score over bigger players. His passing is a plus,but he's a niche' player to me.

    Jones and lamb are what I expected. Both guys are naturals. Jones will never play the 5. He's closer to a 3/4 than a 5. Lamb is a throwback scorer. He can get buckets by the creation of seperation. He will be able to get a shot off because of this and in traffic.

    Do-Nuts also fell into a line of what I saw when he played. He's a very skilled 7 ft er. His upside is very,very high to me. The way the league is now, he will play a lot of 5.

    Morris is still a bum.
     
  16. jtr

    jtr Contributing Member

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    UHMMM, not Rocket science here. He was unable to run for a week due to back issues. The back to back was to much for his conditioning. You did see that he sat out the last SL game right?

    Have you ever contributed one piece of thoughtful analysis? Snide, shallow and stupid comments seem to be your modus operandi. I have to find out how to not display your posts. You offer the community nothing. Absolutely nothing.
     
  17. ObamaFan

    ObamaFan Member

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    LOL doesnt matter, he was well enough to play

    You cant give D-Mo a higher score than Lamb
     
  18. Carl Herrera

    Carl Herrera Contributing Member

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    Zoran's D looks pretty good to me. Got lots of deflections. Good runner in transition and good driver cutter. Not much of a shooter.
     
  19. JayGoogle

    JayGoogle Member

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    Don't think Zoran will be dleague fodder.

    Don't think he'll be starting material either, but I can see him being a depth player or a guy on some nights that will come in and just pester a guy or two.
     
  20. LewLLOYD

    LewLLOYD Member

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    This. ^^^

    I'm most interested in how well they mesh.

    As a unit, I think they have huge upside.
    Each is somewhat eccentric as a player, and together with their collective skillset, I think they will cause lots of matchup problems.

    They run well, they pass well,
    Love that Royce and Jones can and do incredible bringing the ball up the court.

    We've got a lights out shooter who has a floater and other tools,
    a bull with eyes in the back of his head who will drive right into you and find the open guy,
    an a big guy with handles and an endless motor.

    And I'm not considering DMo, who fits in beautifully, as a big who runs, and has great range.

    --
    I think Royce benefits least from playing in this group, but creates the most benefit for his teammates. True Royce needs to improve his outside shot, but did you see how he just drives through, or sometimes around people? I mean, he goes right through you once, and it must mess with your head. I can't wait to see him do this in the regular season.

    Can't leave Lamb, he'll shoot.
    Can't leave Jones, he'll get the rebound and run it up the floor.
    Dmo can draw out the other center, or he can post up pretty well.
     

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