What ever happened to the people that thought that Miller was better then Franchise?

A.) I favored Jason Kidd.
B.) Miller's playing on one leg.
C.) Better than is silly. The better comparison is would the team win more games with player X than player Y. Last year and a lot of times this year the Rockets are riding SF's back like Houston did with Hakeem. This Rudyball just doesn't work as well with a point guard who isn't named Isiah or Magic or Oscar. We're doing better than last year, but I would attribute 100% of that to the addition of Ming and fewer injuries.

 

The Clippers have a messed up organization. They've been that way for a long time, and it doesn't appear to be changing anytime soon. You can't legitimately put all the Clipper's problems on Andre Miller.

I love Miller's game. He has an even better in between game than Sam Cassell. Also, Miller plays a lot larger than he is. One of these days he's going to land in the right situation, with the right team and he game is going to totally blossom.

On the other hand, right now I am a lil down on Steve Francis. After that Bobby Sura steal, I am beginning to think that he is destined to be just

flashy/ghetto/playground fabulous and that's all.

~ kountzer ~

 

They're desperately waiting for Jay Williams to become a superstar...

 

This statment reminds me of something, With baseball, 90% of it is 60 % mental.

But again, dont be decieved Steve may be 2nd or 3rd best in the league, imo only Kidd is better

 

Francis is averaging 6 rebounds a game from the point guard position. If that isn't large, I don't know what is.

 

Dadak is still around somewhere.

 

I've never been a proponent of losing Stevie Franchise. I love his game. But, I believe he'd play better at SG, than PG. Of course, he has always wanted to play PG, and that's why he balked at playing for the Grizzlies, when they already had Bibby.

If Francis was willing to move to SG, and let his friend Mobely go in trade, in order to achieve a championship, I'd trade Mobely for Miller in a heartsbeat. And it would be a good deal for LAC, too.

Juric is coming along, and will be a cheaper alternative, with Miller's contract coming up. Mobely has a cheap contract that LAC would love, and would give them a great backcourt. As long as they keep Odom, he would work well him too, since they are friends.

Imagine Kandi/Brand/Odom/Mobely/Juric. Unfortunately, I think that LAC will trade Brand and Kandi, too, rather than pay them. But, they would have the two rookies that could replace them. Now, if they start trading, I'd love to trade Cato and pics for Brand... but I'm sure others could provide better offers. But, we might have a chance on Miller, if Francis went along with it. We'd be a better team. Somehow, I don't see that happening...

... like Dream not letting the Raptor trade go through. If we had sweetened the deal, and gotten TMac, (as some insiders claimed) Christie and the 5/12, and taken Marion and Artest, we'd be in better shape. Of course, we probalby wouldn't have been in a position to get Ming, either, who will probably be the secret piece of the puzzle to take us to the championships for years. So, maybe it all turned out... but, the point is, players don't always do what's best for the team...

 

I don't know if Miller's in-between game is as good as Cassell's, but I do love his game.
At least give the man a full season on a NEW team before we make final comparisons.
I love Stevie, but he still makes the same idiotic mistakes he did years ago when he first entered the league.

 

I was never a big proponent of trading Steve for Andre Miller, but I am a HUGE fan of Miller's game. I honestly believe if he was in the right situation, he could make the players around him a whole lot better and enable a team to become consistently good. Thus far, Cleveland and LAC have been horrible situations. The Cavs simply had pathetic support talent (yet Miller racks up 11 APG, which is incredible), and the Clippers have a bunch of players playing selfishly due to contract situations. I honestly believe that Miller would have a ton of success if he were in a better organization and better situation.

That being said, it is lunacy to trade a player of Steve Francis's talents unless you get someone like Kobe or T-Mac in return. Steve's penchance for poor decision making and low bball IQ are well documented by myself and many others on this bbs. However, the answer is not to trade Francis, but to complement him with players that help mask his weaknesses which Cuttino and Moochie do not.

 

I am still and probably will always be a miller for francis guy. Francis drives me out of my gourd. Lately I am coming to think that it may be more of a coaching problem (i.e. a "player's coach" can't discipline a superstar). But, the problem the clipp's are having is too many good players and no superstars to lead. This forces Miller to be more of a scorer than he is. With Odom back, as the weeks go by, I think you will see Millers stats revert more to last years form. You usually don't get assists off Brand buckets, because he dribbles more than once before he makes his move. Kandi does the same. Piatkowski can't create his own shot.


It's like this, Remember the beginning of the season when steve was lighting everyone up. He stated (quite truly) that teams were allowing him to do that and locking down on other players. They wanted to see if steve could beat them, and knew that they could defense everyone else. It is very similar on the cloppers. Brand is going to get his, maggette or whomever their two guard is will do similar things that Cat would, but no one will carry them to a victory. Teams are forcing Miller to be that person. With Odom back, they can't put that much focus on him and he will likely blossum as a result. This will take a few weeks and as they change head coaches it will even get better.


I have come to respect Rudy for many aspects of his coaching abilities, my only point that I question ( and it is a major friggin point) is how he deals with superstars. I don't think he can unless they are muslim and convicted to their beliefs, or communist and convicted to the good of the whole. This being said, we need someone to get francis in check in his game, or get someone like Miller who looks for the good of the team.




I bet Miller would have no problem dropping it down into Ming 30 times a game

 

in an ideal world, do you really want your point guard averaging six rebounds a game?

maybe a two guard, but a point?

 

Yes, in an ideal world, my point guard would average 40 points, 20 assists, and 10 rebounds a game.

 

I have watched more than 10 of the clipper games this year and Miller is no steve francis. He is good but he's not a superstar point guard that many think he could be but he is a much better than average PG with great funamentals, but then again Francis isn't either but Francis is a superstar which is the difference.

Miller tries to take over games but doesn't have that magic that say Francis does to change the game. Francis might not ever have the court vision and the passing skills that Miller posesses or the dribbling ability that Miller has but Francis when needed can step up and make the pass or shot to keep the team in it or win it. Francis posses something special that most players can't do and that's make a difference and change the game when needed. His ability to take over is special. Miller doesn't have that, he will get you assist and points over a game but not turn it on and do it all in a quarter. That's one reason why he's not worth the max and francis is.

Also Miller doesn't seem to have that leadership to make his team better. He works hard but doesn't seem to get his teamates involved to get in it and play harder. He's very soft spoken and his attitude seems very laid back not the type to take charge.

What I like about him is his court vision- he sees players open and get's it to them fast even on the other side of the court, his driving- pretty good at getting inside. What I don't like about him is his finishing- misses way too many layups and gets way too many offensive fouls, lack of leadership IMO and doesn't seem to be agressive enough.

He is a good PG but he's not the type to be the star or leader of a team which is fine and good in many cases but as a player he's no Steve Francis.

 

how is he getting assists if he is the last one up the court. by god that has got to be one dominant player down low, and why wouldn't he get the rebound then?

 

A miller is nothing but M. Jackson 10 years ago, Franchies gets all the rebs is b/c of his god given talent!!

r u stupid??? tryin to compare Mark Jackson w. some Allstar STARTER???????

 

Francis a better player than A. Miller. Period. Why do we even discuss this?

As for Francis's numbers, I have to admit that in an ideal world I would rather my point guard put up 18 ppg, 3 rpg, 10 apg than 25 ppg, 6 rpg, 6 apg.

But that's pretty irrelevant now since I understand that Francis is not and will never be my ideal type of player. We have got to live with this fact.

 

yes I am stupid.

I liked mark jackson's game back in the day. Never brought up his name in this topic, but I loved his game.


Guess what fool, so did a lot of people. He could post up, rebound, run an offense, score and generally was a damn good player. Maybe even allstar.