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Only drafting bigs (keeping a good sg in Kevin Martin)

Discussion in 'NBA Draft' started by it's our time, May 22, 2012.

  1. it's our time

    it's our time Member

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    This is my first post (first anything) here on ClutchFans…so you know, take it easy on me.

    I have been an avid follower of the Rox for over 30 years and I try to keep up with all the players even if I can’t catch every game. Which means I am very well aware of why KM has very few supporters here in Clutch City (lack of defense, lack of hustle, injury concerns, bad attitude after failed trade, and even age…although he won’t turn 30 until half way through next season).

    So here is my question (basing it on KM being healthy this upcoming year).

    Since KM still has one year left on his contract (13million), what would you all think about drafting two bigs instead of 1) going with the best talent still on the board approach or 2) drafting a SG such as J. Lamb or Rivers if they are still available?

    Why the Rox would do this:

    1) If we drafted two bigs (such as Zeller, M. Leonard, or Fab Melo) then we could let Dally walk and our two bigs could go at it all day long in practice and both could get some good playing time during games. It seems to have become very difficult to net a good big in FA or trade so by the end of next year we could have possibly found out if we still need to be searching for our next center (we would of course re-sign Camby to a contract worth his value).

    2) We have twice the chance to hit on the big we all know that we need. Let’s face it, the history of the draft has shown that it is very difficult for a team to get it right if they only use one pick in one draft year for one position player (talking about mid to late first round picks).

    3) Even after all the other moves that Morey does before or on draft day (I hope :)), we would still have a very good SG in KM on the team (and hopefully his defensive flaws would be negated a little more with one of our new bigs and Camby behind him). Then before the trade deadline KM can show that he is worthy of another contract with the Rox or he can re-establish his trade value so we can get something of value in return. And if he just becomes dead weight because of injury or whatever he is still an asset of some kind because he is an expiring.

    Why the Rox wouldn’t do this:

    1) There aren’t two legit centers still left on the board at #14 and #16. Various mocks continue to show Zeller and M. Leonard somewhere around #14 and Melo is probably a sure bet to still be there.

    2) The Rox FO thinks that a J. Lamb/Rivers type SG has a MUCH BETTER chance of becoming a solid player (hopefully star) than one of the two centers still available. I have read many posts from you guys that talk about Rivers' tremendous upside at #14 so that may be enough to not go big.

    3) Morey HAS to use KM in a trade package. Obviously KM should be dealt if we are talking about getting a true star in return.

    4) It would be dumb to draft two players at the same position because .....

    Again my main question is: Should the Rox only go BIG (as in centers only) in this year's draft regardless of who is left on the board?
     
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  2. BimaThug

    BimaThug Resident Capologist
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    Best. Player. Available.

    Every. Single. Time.
     
  3. RealContender

    RealContender Rookie

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    I can't get over you calling Kevin Martin a "good SG."

    Nothing personal though. Welcome to the boards.
     
  4. Carl Herrera

    Carl Herrera Member

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    This is SO boring for fans to discuss!!!:mad:
     
  5. thething

    thething Member

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    It's not always this simple. Sometimes you have equal talents that play different positions. In that case, we gotta go big.

    But if the guard has even a slightly better chance of being a star, we should go that route.
     
  6. it's our time

    it's our time Member

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    Believe me, I didn't take it personal. I have watched KM's good games and his bad ones but overall I am not sure why anyone would not call KM a "good sg."

    Without using any advanced stats, when comparing all SG’s this year (a terrible year for KM) KM was:

    (players with minimum of 24 min/game – basically starters)
    4th with 17.1 ppg (23.5 in 2010/11)
    10th with 2.7 rpg (3.2 in 2010/11)
    4th with 2.8 apg (2.5 in 2010/11)
    8th with 0.7 stls per game (1.0 in 2010/11)
    4th with 89% FT% (while having the 3rd most attempts by SG’s @ 4.5 per game...down 4 attempts from last year)
    13th with 34.7% 3FG% (would have been 7th if he had simply shot his career average of 37.7%)
    13th with 41.3% FG% (would have been 7th if he had simply shot his career average of 44.3)

    Looking at the last two stats, I think it would only be fair to point out (as if we already don’t know this) that these numbers could be been affected by 1) having to adjust to the new rules on shooting fouls and 2) injuries. Taking this into consideration, even with all the negative things that went on this past year, KM would have been in the top 10 in every statistical category that SG’s are evaluated with.

    Just curious...I understand his defensive problems but how is he not realistically a good sg? I am sure that fans from other teams might even call him an above average sg. But again, this post really wasnt' about KM.
     
  7. it's our time

    it's our time Member

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    Again, I didn't want this thread to really be about KM but put it this way....

    If we took Lamb with the #14 pick and I told you that during his third year in the league he was averaging 24/3/3 and was in the top ten in 7 different stats...would you say that he was a 1) a good sg and 2) a good find at #14? I guess that is how I think about KM. He definitely has some issues that are exposed on the court but I think it would be hard to say that you would like to have 6 or 7 other sg's on your team before you would want a healthy Martin at your team's 2 spot. Just my opinion though.
     
  8. MorningZippo

    MorningZippo Member

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    Nobody claims that he isn't good at scoring. The guy can put the ball in the basket. They claim that we need more good 2 way players with high upside. Needless to say, those are extremely difficult to come by. Kevin Martin is what he is, and will only get worse as time runs it's course. It's not that he isn't a good sg, it's that he isn't in line with what our long terms goals need to be.
     
  9. DaDakota

    DaDakota Balance wins
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    I am really hoping more for a 6'9" PF/SF tweener.

    We need more of those.

    DD
     
  10. coachbadlee

    coachbadlee Member

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    Not. Working. Out.
    Two. Years. Straight.
    Need. To. Take. Chances.
     
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  11. CantBeRight

    CantBeRight Member

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    Well....
    We brang in KMart to compliment Yao...

    Why not?
     
  12. it's our time

    it's our time Member

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    Completely understand what you are saying.

    I guess with this particular thread I was thinking more along the lines of taking care of a major weakness the Rox have (Center) vice trying to take care of two weaknesses (C and SG) when we already have a sg that is pretty good at what he does (shooting).

    Besides I would think that this rebuild (or whatever the FO is calling it these days) is going to be done in multiple steps over at least 2 or 3 years. So why not go after the biggest weakness we have...which imo is the center position (again, that is with a healthy Martin onboard).
     
  13. jtr

    jtr Member

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    Uhmmm can we rule out PF's at least? Sullinger at 14 might be the best player, but his lack of athleticism and severe duplication on the roster might make it a good idea to pass on him.
     
  14. josephnicks

    josephnicks Member

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    whats not working out?

    patterson is still nursing an injury, youve seen how good he was when hes healthy, and morris didnt even play..

    BPA forever and always..
     
  15. dobro1229

    dobro1229 Member

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    someone needs to look up the thread(Im too lazy to do it right now) about the tiers in draft order that teams are now seeming to be using.

    Its always best player available, but if there are 2, 3, 4, or 5 players that rank on the same level as far as far as analytical talent is measured you take the best "fit" in that tier.

    This seems to be the way to go, and Morey himself has addressed drafting based on "fit" not need, and one of those factors is ability to thrive at a certain position on their current team.
     
  16. it's our time

    it's our time Member

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    I am not going to say that it hasn't worked out for the Rox to have drafted the BPA the last two years because I think that it is too early to tell with Patterson and Morris.

    However, I really don't agree with the BPA approach at all when we are talking about mid to late first round picks. And here is why. Let's say a PF is the BPA when it is time for the Rox to draft this year, and we indeed draft a PF, now we are left with having to address the center position with either a trade or FA signing. Why would we want to put ourselves in that position on purpose? Why not just draft a center who should be pretty close to the same talent level but maybe doesn't have quite as much upside?

    (granted we then have the 16th pick this year to address the center position but let's just say we only have one first round pick in any given year)
     
  17. RiceRockets

    RiceRockets Member

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    You guys have it totally wrong. It is best asset on the board always. :)
     
  18. RedNation

    RedNation Member

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    BPA that's not a sf/pf tweener :)
     
  19. coachbadlee

    coachbadlee Member

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    I think Kevin is done with Houston. I just hope we could at least get a pick for him.
     
  20. coachbadlee

    coachbadlee Member

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    That was mostly meant for Morris. BTW, he played enough to do better than what he did. His tweener status just sticks out too much. He is just not consistent.
     

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