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Name 10 defenders in the NBA that are worse defenders than Martin and Bud

Discussion in 'Houston Rockets: Game Action & Roster Moves' started by jopatmc, Dec 26, 2011.

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  1. jopatmc

    jopatmc Member

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    Two pages and only a couple measly attempts to find 10 defenders worse than Bud and KMart. I've made my point.
     
    #41 jopatmc, Dec 26, 2011
  2. ascaptjack

    ascaptjack Member

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    Just trade Martin for Iguodala.

    Sixers really wanted Martin from the Philly insider.
     
    #42 ascaptjack, Dec 26, 2011
  3. cbs1507

    cbs1507 Member

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    Just have Buddinger come off the bench and start T-Will in his place. Then maybe there will be better balance.
     
    #43 cbs1507, Dec 26, 2011
  4. acsorelle4

    acsorelle4 Member

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    Shane Battier.
     
    #44 acsorelle4, Dec 26, 2011
  5. jopatmc

    jopatmc Member

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    I'm for starting either TWill or Lee at the 3 and using Budinger to back up KMart. Having both of them on the floor together doesn't work.
     
    #45 jopatmc, Dec 26, 2011
  6. DaDakota

    DaDakota Balance wins
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    Sigh - the more seasons change, the more they stay the same.

    People with agendas...sigh...

    DD
     
    #46 DaDakota, Dec 26, 2011
  7. jopatmc

    jopatmc Member

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    Don't have an agenda with TWill. I still have my doubts. Don't know if he can put it together mentally. Not convinced he can be anything besides an energy player. Wasn't impressed tonight.

    I did say either TWill or Lee over Budinger. I'll take either one alongside KMart at this point and let Chase come off the bench backing up KMart. But I do know, we cannot compete with both Chase and KMart on the wings. We will get eaten alive defensively. Even when KMart is knocking down shots.
     
    #47 jopatmc, Dec 26, 2011
  8. Joe Joe

    Joe Joe Go Stros!
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    Thabeet, Hill, Brooks, Novak, J Taylor, Andersen, B Miller, McGrady, Von Wafer, Luther Head
     
    #48 Joe Joe, Dec 26, 2011
  9. jopatmc

    jopatmc Member

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    Almost half that list is not currently in the NBA.
     
    #49 jopatmc, Dec 27, 2011
  10. sealclubber1016

    sealclubber1016 Member
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    http://basketballvalue.com/teamplayers.php?year=2010-2011&mode=full&sortnumber=9&sortorder=ASC&team=HOU

    Weighted difference on defense Budinger was 2nd on the team. Only behind Lowry, just ahead of Chuck.

    Now stats aren't perfect, he's not a good defender, but if he was that huge a liability, and he played a lot last year, this stat wouldn't exist. There is a lot more to defense in the NBA than guarding people one on one.

    Kevin Martin is a train wreck though, his offense usually makes him a net positive, but just barely. If he were an MLE level guy i would like him, but he is grossly overpaid for his true value.
     
    #50 sealclubber1016, Dec 27, 2011
  11. jopatmc

    jopatmc Member

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    According to this Lee and Yao were 2 of the worst defender we had.

    Therefore,.......

    this data is useless.
     
    #51 jopatmc, Dec 27, 2011
  12. cod

    cod Member

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    Play him at the two and his height can be advantage on both ends.
     
    #52 cod, Dec 27, 2011
  13. iconoclastic

    iconoclastic Member

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    Aren't you the guy repeatedly stating that +/- was a practically meaningless indicator of player performance?
     
    #53 iconoclastic, Dec 27, 2011
  14. sealclubber1016

    sealclubber1016 Member
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    Yao only had a cup of coffee last year can't draw numbers from a small sample size. He was consistenly excellent when he played big minutes (he was +6.7 in 08-09)

    Courtney Lee isn't a good defender, his numbers have been consistenly average to below average. He plays good on ball defense, and as i said in my earlier post people often assume on ball defense is the be all end all and its not.
     
    #54 sealclubber1016, Dec 27, 2011
  15. Corrosion

    Corrosion Member

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    H.Thabeet ?!
     
    #55 Corrosion, Dec 27, 2011
  16. mylilpony

    mylilpony Member

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    Intangibled!
     
    #56 mylilpony, Dec 27, 2011
  17. daywalker02

    daywalker02 Member

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    At this point it's not only about Budinger's D. I trust my eyes more that that. Budinger did not go to the hole aggressively, played like a lamb instead of a wolf.....Man we had McGrady, Artest, Shane all playing more aggressively on Offense......and defensively
     
    #57 daywalker02, Dec 27, 2011
  18. GATER

    GATER Member

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    Another example of the "stats" not matching what someone views on the court.

    Budinger @ +7 was the only Rocket with a positive +/-. There were 5 Rockets (including Scola) worse than Martin's -4. Which tied Martin with Lowery and Dalembert.
     
    #58 GATER, Dec 27, 2011
  19. cod

    cod Member

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    Yao last year wasn't ready to play he was still limping the whole time.

    I think you mistook TWill's number for Lee who is directly under TWill.

    The worse def numbers on that page were Brooks and Taylor.
     
    #59 cod, Dec 27, 2011
  20. jopatmc

    jopatmc Member

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    And Chase's number is explained by who he played with and against. Don't justify one number without justifying the other number.

    To the poster that said Lee isn't a good defender, just a good on-ball defender, what do you think you do on the perimeter? And are you actually saying that Bud is a better defender than Lee????

    I agree with the poster that said play Chase at the 2.

    The problem is the 2 and the 3 are not the same positions. They may be the same in the offense but they are not the same in the defense. A 3 has to be bigger to match up with most other teams. "Small ball" lineups are gimmick lineups that only work during certain portions of the game, very limited portions of the game.

    The next problem is, Martin, Lee, Chase, and TWill are really all 2's. None of them are really 3's. Lee is really a 2 or a 1. Twill is a 1 or a 2. and Chase and Martin are only 2's. The only real small forwards we have on this team are Morris and Parsons. That's it. And both of those obviously lack experience and we really don't know if they can play yet.
     
    #60 jopatmc, Dec 27, 2011
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