Cato is out and Collier is starting!

How bout a stat sheet on how many rebounds squirt out of each Rocket's hands after they've touched them? Yao would lead that far and away. It's not all about stats. Rudy knows what he's doing here. Yao has had some impressive moments. In fact, it seems like every shot he's made has shown us something new. It doesn't mean he's ready to contribute substantively in the flow of the defense. Of the boards Yao's gotten he's aggressively gone after about two. The others have fallen to him because he's tall. He'll have twice as many per minute when he learns how to grab the ball and doesn't let smaller (and usually weaker) players grab it away from him. Don't get me wrong. I'm a huge Yao supporter. That's why I want to see him brought along at a reasonable pace. Cato's availability doesn't dictate how ready Yao is. I just really can't believe anyone is finding anything to complain about after last night. I'd say be patient, but even when things go great, they play as a team, Yao contributes and we win, it's still not good enough. Some people just like to be upset.

 

Well, our whole discussion here was predicated on Rudy saying the word familiar in a general way, right? So, in that sense, there is more than our opinions on the table here. My opinion is based in speculating what Rudy means by "Familiar" combined with my opinion of what we've been doing in the past 5 games. I've never really said anything about my personal opinion on what lineup is the best or most familiar. Your opinion is couched in disagreeing with Rudy, and indeed saying what is good and bad.

The difference is my opinion is couched in the attraction of describing games the way a scout would (as in, what is he trying to accomplish); yours is more about making coaching decisions (we should do this). It is a matter of taste which way you enjoy discussing basketball. (TV commentators even show this dichotomy)...so imso, our opinions are not really operating in the same context or same attraction to the game.

in short,

We have a fundamental difference of opinion in what our opinions are discussing....LOL!!!!!!!!!!

 

Agreed. You are taking what he (Rudy) is doing and saying and analyzing why that is happening, in your opinion. I am taking it and analyzaing why it shouldn't happen, in my opinion. It is confusing.

 

heypee:


oh, i understand what you're saying, hp. i was just pointing that out on an individual developmental basis. as to your point about the team, you're right about that, as well. they play basically as "units" and they learn chemistry with each other.

cato's unit, yao's unit, and the donut unit, right?

 

A Chinese reporter said Eric Zhang said Rudy said Ming probably will start at mid of December. (Do I make sense? )

I think Rockets more or less are facing the pressure from new sponsors. (Ming is a star, we pay money; Ming is a bust, we will leave). Just my opinion.

 

It's hard to imagine Rudy "folding" to that kind of pressure, though. I think Ming is farther along than many here, but don't think he should start until he proves he can.

 

I doubt that source too. Ming said recently, "Give me 40 games to adjust to NBA." It seems more realistic.

 

It's a terrible thing to say, but I wish we could trade Collier for a plate of sizzling beef and onions (schezuwan style, of course) and some crab meat and asparagus soup. Maybe throw in some schrimp chips.

He is useless and should never play. Either start Griffin at the 5, or plug in Yao. Collier is annoying and unwatchable. He is a great example of the dangers of having a mid or low first round pick. Collier should be made to carry equipment and teach Yao english. The Colliers of the world have guaranteed contracts, while Hawkins lives on the minimum. Damn.

There are draft picks that everyone knows, including the coach, GM, Owner, will be useless at best. I'm just afraid that Collier will scare the crap out of someone with his hockey mask or fall down on one of our important players and injure them.

For the long term health of the team, Collier should be placed on IR.

That's my completely objective point of view.

 

According to what you say, it is not really about Yao EARNING more PT, as many people here say. It's about Rudy FEELING the right match up. So, again, it really doesn't matter how well Yao performs, his PT depends on how the whole team performs. Am I understanding you right?

 

Is Yao really that bad that he is even a bench warmer to jason collier? I know he is new and a rookie ...but either you got game or you don't. This is pitiful that a number one pick cannot even start ahead of Collier.

 

Ming is outplaying Collier now. I think the point in starting Collier was to lessen the pressure on the big fella.

Besides, if he keeps playing at least as well as he did in Portland, Ming will simply make the Rockets play him more.

 

I think he just wanted to Keep Ming with the rotation he practices with and is most familiar.

It could be he didn't want him to get quick fouls against Rasheed and the starters and not have a chance to contribute against the Portland second unit.

 

Jay,

I agree. Rudy will always come up with some idiotic logic to explain how he sees the world different from everyone else! Yao can't learn on the bench. Colllier won't even be on the team next year! Dumb!

 

Yes Yao is better than Collier. If I had his size I would be ten times better than Collier. He doesn't seem anymore interested in being better than what CATO used to be. "USED TO BE"

I really think we need to step back and understand just how hard it really is to win a game in the NBA. None of us here (to my knowledge) have played or coached in the NBA. I think Heypartner has really touched on how much of a chess game the NBA really is. Heypartner you really seem to have a good understanding or foresight to see Rudy playing that chess match. Rudy may not be the best at coaching but I see a lot of positives in the way Rudy calls the game. No one likes to watch four guys standing while one is dribbling around to jack a shot up. Rudy said lastnight on 610 radio that the Rockets have been doing less of the one on one and have been moving the ball around more.

Rudy is playing the game just like a chess game. You don't play chess off of emotions, you play off of calculated decisions. It does appear that he has units that he wants to develop chemistry within. Why start Yao? If Rudy would have started Yao could it have hindered the stableness of knowing that he is going to be playing in a certain bracket of the game with the same set of players that he has been practicing with? I think so. With Yao and the rest of the team you can not throw caution to the wind and say, "We should start Yao because he is the number one pick". "We should play Yao 25-30 minutes a game because e needs to learn how to play in the NBA". I trust that Rudy, his staff, the team and Yao are doing what is best for the long-term chemistry with the team. Rudy knows how to win and play the correct match ups on the floor. Yao is not ready to be the player everyone wants him to be. Have patients and trust in the Rockets.

It is really difficult to win a NBA game. If you have ever played chess you know what I am talking about.

Heypartner, JayZ750, dwmyers, verse, keep up the Opinions and debate, I enjoy reading them and learning from them.

 

<blockquote><hr>Originally posted by Easy
It's about Rudy FEELING the right match up. So, again, it really doesn't matter how well Yao performs, his PT depends on how the whole team performs. Am I understanding you right?<hr></blockquote>
Yeah, I'd agree with that. There's no mistaking that that is how Rudy brought along Griffin last year. Even with the Nov/Dec injuries, Terence got bumped up in the rotation ahead of Griffin, while Griffin was fed minutes based on match-ups. Then, Rudy keeps him in the game based on his performance.

I actually started a thread last year that showed minutes per game for Griffin whenever he made more than 1 basket. This was like Mid-December. I did it because Griffin was shooting around 29% with several 0-fer nights. He averaged around 23 minutes per game on all nights he made at least 2 baskets. The other games were around 14. That is very similar to Yao's minutes.

I believe Yao is getting minutes based on his performance. Even still though, that 3rd quarter lineup against Portland probably wasn't supposed to be on the court that long with zero substitutions, but there was no way Rudy was going to bench that awesome defense they were playing....so, pretty much no one but 5 players got minutes in the 3rd quarter, as we whittled down the deficit.

 

Actually, in this instance, it is. The clumsy oaf who shoots better than anyone else on your squad is your best shooter. I'm saying that outside of Kalvin Cato, Yao is clearly our best rebounder, awkward or not.

I can understand people saying he could rebound better. I've taken exception through, to people who overinterpret his awkwardness as being a poor rebounder.

He's not a poor rebounder. He's a good rebounder who could improve. How hard is that to understand?

 

dwmyers, I agree with you.

I think Batman's comment was out of the line. Pointing out how many rebounds Ming almost got but didn't as his NEGATIVE is like saying that a missed shot that bounces off the rim is WORSE than an air ball.

 

Easy and dw: Out of line? Whatever. I really wasn't criticizing Yao. I was responding to the posting of stats showing he was our second most effective rebounder, as an argument that his presence was a boon to our defensive lineup. I referenced the boards that squeezed out of his hands because it doesn't show up on the stat sheet like FG% does. And I'm not talking about boards that he and another player were fighting for. I'm talking about boards that were clearly his and someone came and poked them away. Easily. This will absolutely change, but he needs time. If there was a rebounds "made" versus rebounds "attempted" stat, it would provide a more comprehensive picture than the rebounds/minute stat. I think Yao's gonna be a great rebounder. I also think he's gonna be an all-star and has a shot at defensive player of the year eventually. But right now he's a drag on our defense. He might be five games away and he might be a year away. Last night on 610 Rudy said next year might be more like his rookie season. And Rudy, contrary to what some people on this board might think, is Yao's biggest supporter. He is going to bring him along at a pace that most benefits Yao. And eventually we'll all be happier for it.