in terms of potential: ming/griff = jabbar/worthy?

Yes, Yes, and yet another, Yes

 

For Yao to be in the same class of Jabbar, he'd have to show up big time against Shaq. All these player came into the league and everyone knew they would be impact players. Including Olajuwon...and even Ewing.

Yao is not a hands down favorite to even win rookie of the year. Let's see how he manages against Shaq...if he puts of a good showing, I think that would be very impressive.

But until then...my money is that Yao will have a couple of decent seasons and then flame out ala Ralph Sampson.

 

Basketball is the game of giants, you can't teach height. Ming can also play a power game, which Jabbar couldn't. Potentially Ming can be better than Jabbar. I talked about it in detail in another thread.

http://bbs.clutchcity.net/php3/showthread.php?threadid=41174

 

This has to be the most idiotic thread in CLutch City history. Comparing to also ran players to Hall of Famers is one thing, but you goobers think they will be better. Kareem was better in HS than Ming will ever be and comparing Eddie freaking Griffin to Worthy is even dumber. Griffin does not have 1/4 the basketball IQ Worthy has and has less than 1/4 of the skill. If you really think you have a young Worthy and Kareem than you should think you are going to win the NBA title THIS season. I will be glad when the season starts because this board is slowly slipping into the 9th cirlcle of Hell regarding Ming and Griffin.

 

This thread is about potential you putz. You obviously never saw Jabbar or Worthy play so why don't you go ask your dad for an accurate description of their games and what kind of impact they had on their team.

Also, if you knew how to read then you would know that this thread is also about impact. With the low caliber of centers in the NBA it is entirely possible for Yao not to be as good as Jabbar and still have the same impact for his team. Besides, Yao’s skills are very similar to those of Jabbar or Walton. Good passer, shot blocker, nice skyhook, and un-guardable one on one with in 15 feet of the basket. But you actually have to watch basketball to know that.

Now troll on back over to the Grizzlies fan board and share your lack of basketball IQ with them. Oh wait that fan board is like a ghost town and you have no one to talk to over there right? What a shame.

 

At this stage, Griffin would be a Junior in college which means Worthy hadn't played an NBA game at the same stage of his carreer. Back then, they were probably not saying Worthy could be one of the 50 greats and weren't comparing him to Oscar Robertson. We probably shouldn't either. Griff will need the benefit of other great players and TEAM MATES to get to the level of a Worthy. Worthy was surround with great (Magic) and really talented TEAM MATES. We have that same potential in Steve, Griff and now Yao.

Before Hakeem was drafted he was getting praise as potentially one of the best defensive centers of the time. No one was comparing him to Kareem, no that was Sampson. They were lining Hakeem up to maybe even be a defensive, rebounding power forward.

Comparing Yao to Jabbar is more like comparing Sampson-Jabbar. If Ralph could have stayed healthy he would have been up there, probably not quite with Jabbar though. Yao will have the benefit of a much better team and talent around him than when Ralph came in.

Yao may not offensively beat Ralph or Jabbar at first (Ralph had to score on that team the first couple years), but he should average at least 10 points, 10 boards, 3-4 assists and 3 blocks. As far as Jabbar, he came out of college a star national champion, well coached from the get go. He had that almost unstoppable and automatic sky hook. It may take Yao a little longer to gel in the NBA than it did Jabbar just due to the competition Yao is used to facing and his lower quality coaching so far.

In addition, Yao comes into the NBA when the focus is not so much on centers as it was in Jabbar and Sampson's day. If Yao can only last as long as Jabbar he has the potential to make a run at him. We'll see!

 

I don't completely agree with that statement. Jabbar never showed up big time against Moses Malone. I don't know when Moses did not dominate Jabbar in a big game. Most players have their Achilles heal.

 

Saying Ming/Griffin=Jabbar/Worthy is like me saying Gasol/Battier=Shaq/Kobe. It is stupid whether you are talking potential or not. Let Ming play ONE NBA game before you say he will be better than one of the top 5 players of all time. Let Griffin get 30 minutes a game before saying he is easily better than one of the 50 all time greats.

 

It's true, Abdul-Jabbar was not an outside shooter. As a matter of fact, he made one 3 pointer in his career, and it was basically on a bet from Magic Johnson that he even took that shot. But Kareem was an absolutely unstoppable force on the inside, offensively and defensively. He didn't shoot much from the outside because he didn't have to.

It's too bad that the competition in China is nowhere near the level of play here in America. Kareem grew up with legitimate success on every level: college, high school, and the pros. Of course Yao has enjoyed similiar success, but with what kind of competition? He's very very untested against NBA players still.

I still maintain that Yao is going to be very good in this league, maybe even great, but right now he hasn't shown us a game complete enough - or the longevity necessary to - bestow upon him the honor of being compared to, much less esteemed higher than, arguably the best center to ever play the game. (I said arguably, I personally lean towards Russell)


And you'll also notice, I've said very little about the Griffin/Worthy comparison. That one is much further afield if you ask me. Griffin = pretty good player. Worthy = top 10 forward ever to play the game. Hmmm.

Does objectivity and patience tarnish my perceptions as a fan?

 

Go back to school and learn how to comprehend what you read. Until then our debate is over. And one other thing, stop making up things and trying to say I said them. Search as hard as you want and you will never see a quote by me saying that Griff will easily be better than Worthy.

 

Just when you thought some posters could not take this Yao and Eddie homerism any further.........they bring it up one more notch.

 

I don't know you guys are stupid or what. We back up our assessment on what those two players showed with facts. Go think very hard about Yao's game and try to come up with ONE reason, and it'd better be an unfixable one, that's detrimental to Yao's potential. Mentality, skills, whatever... before you start trolling. I don't expect Yao and Griffin to become the next Jabbar/Worthy, but I think they have their chances to reach the same breath of greatness.

 

I guess we will see start to see who's "stupid" around a year from now. BTW-Jabbar averaged 28.8 pts, 14.5 reb, and 4.1 assists his rookie season and Worthy averaged 13.4 pts, 5.2 reb, 1.7 assists despite playing behind Magic and Kareem,being injured, and playing under 20 minutes a game.

 

Lakermania, the morons run Clutchcity during the offseason. There are some real good Rocket fans on this board who would never utter such foolishness as Ming/Griffin=Kareem/Worthy. Ming and Griffin need to get to the level of Brad Miller and Jermaine O'Neal first then we might talk about their 'potential'.

 

Ming / Griffin do not equal Gasol/Gooden at this point. Does Ming/Griff have more potential and the potential to reach Jabbar/Worthy? Yes. But it will take their talent and a great point guard (Steve?) and great team success to get there. That is rare air...

 

Lakermania,

Get your facts right. First off, Jabbar is not a top 5 player in the history of bball...I don't think anyone suggests that. Secondly, the comparison to Jabbar/Worthy is being made based on the fact the Lakers were so good, single coverage on Worthy was common. If Francis/Mobley/Yao can get Griffin single coverage like Worthy benefitted from, well...that is the question posed in this thread.

As for the Jabbar comparison, are you trying to tell me people did not make comparisons to HOFers when Robinson, Mourning, Duncan, Shaq, Sampson, Dream, Ewing, Bowie, Dougherty...etc came out. 7ers get comparisons, because predicting their success has simpler than any other players. No one here is predicting the longevity of Jabbar or 28ppg as a rookie in a different era of a more defensive and less wide open NBA, we are comparing Yao's proven ability to score at will against NBA players from 10-15' ... just like Jabbar. We are comparing his passing as well.

You guys will see soon enough that Yao is for real. It really shows an incredible amount of naivety to say that Yao has to prove to be better than Brad Miller.

I really don't think you and MemphisX witnessed Jabbar and Worthy. Jabbar was man-handled by Cowens and forced to shoot over a lot of players. He did at a great success rate, and he had enough passing ability to prevent successful double teams. It is a simple formula for someone 7'5....develop an sweet stroke that you can get off from 10-15' away, and learn to pass. bingo...that is Jabbar, except for the fact Jabbar sustain that for many seasons. btw: MemphisX, it is not like comparing Gasol/Battier to Shaq/Kobe because Shaq/Kobe are clearly better than Jabbar/Worthy and Yao/Griffin clearly have more potential than Gasol/Battier... go ahead, try that out on another bbs, if you don't believe me.

Lastly, Worthy played 25mpg as a rookie.

 

Ming has to have the footwork of Dream and the dominance of at least Sampson to be a Great. Griffin must have quicker footwork and the ability to finish the break with a one handed jam to be 'WORTHY'. Griff's my man though.

 

Gasol is better than Ming and Battier is better than Griffin, but I guess my sperm has more 'potential' than Shaq. I guess that is what this thread is about...lmao.

 

Didn't Gasol play C for his NT? If he was better, wouldn't he have made the All-Tournament as a center? There isn't really nothing else to compare them except that since they both played in it at the same time.

 

This thread just turned for the nasty...

I agree with Darkhorse, but I realize this is a speculation thread like all the others.

I'm not sure whether Ming and Griff will click and complement each others games, only because I haven't seen both players play their natural positions and use all their gifts consistantly...

Impact is different, but I'm not sure profiting off a weak league is more rewarding or not...