1. I do not like Melo, think he is a punk. 2. I would love to have Melo on the Rockets. 3. Only if he would sign an extension. 4. No extension = no punk Melo on the Rockets. DD
http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=2bqqvwq Throw in the 2012 Knicks pick. (Though, for reference, I wouldn't want Anthony if he's not willing to sign an extension with the Rox; that's why we didn't get Stoudemire at the deadline last year.)
Ok so Melo wants to play in NYC and the McNuggets know it, the Rox may or may not want a 1 yr rental but what if.... Rox get Chris "Birdman" Andersen Why - Devastating rebounder and shotblocker that can be the ideal 4/5 defender and could reek chaos on Gasol, Odom and Bynum. Contract - 4 years = $4,533,300 $4,869,100 $5,204,900 $5,540,700 Knicks get Melo and JT Why - Melo and a nice cheap SG Denver gets Jordan Hill, Eddy Curry, Gallinari and Alexander Johnson. Why - Rebuild with young PF and SF/SG along with 12 million in expiring contracts. Rox only add roughly 1 million in salary this season and get a defensive player of the year candidate. Knicks get their man and money continues to be no issue. Denver will have 12 million in cap relief and team options in Jordan and Gallinari. Brooks/Lowry Martin/Lee Battier/Budinger Scola/Andersen/Patterson Yao/Miller/Hayes That is 2 severn footers and a 6-10 beast on the frontline... :grin:
Interesting...but this is a move you make if you think this is the final piece to make you a contender...maybe get him with melo and that would be great....but if we loose out on melo...then we are going after iggy or wallace or another star...just keep moving down the list. We had more assets then we could play to start the season and morey has only added to it...we have to make a move...the fact that we havent made a move like you are talking about...shows that morey is waiting on melo and paul...I think really just melo... Without melo we wont get paul...if we can get a trade for melo with no guarantee he will resign then make a major push for paul either at the dealine or offseason next year....that has to be the plan.
Agreed on points 1. and 2. However, I would amend the rest as follows: 3. I would not offer nearly as much for Melo unless he signs an extension. 4. No extension = I'm only paying ___ cents on the dollar for him in trade. I think each person here has a different view of the number to go in that blank.
Amendments accepted. I guess, I would take a risk for expirings, a young potential talent like Taylor and some picks..... DD
Kevin Martin + Jordan Hill + NY 2012 swap pick for Danny Granger + 2011 second round pick. The Pacers can get the big they've been looking for since the 4-team trade, plus an ultra-effecient SG and a lotto pick. The Rockets get the all-around well polished SF who can score and defend and become a stretch 4 when Battier is in the game.
I would be willing to make the following offer to Denver, right now, with no guarantees about Carmelo signing an extension: Houston gets: Carmelo Anthony Denver gets: Chase Budinger Jordan Hill Chuck Hayes (expiring) Jared Jeffries (expiring) Alexander Johnson (non-guaranteed) Mike Harris (non-guaranteed) One or both of the 2012 first rounders (maybe the higher of the two) Cash This trade saves Denver (which is currently over the luxury tax threshold) a bunch of money. In total, assuming that the non-guaranteed guys are waived and not even counting any savings from buyouts, this trade would save Denver about $9.7M next season, plus any cash the Les Alexander sends their way. Of course, that's also how much it would cost Les. The Nuggets get two nice young players in Budinger (who can slide into Melo's spot or share minutes with JR Smith) and Hill (who could eventually replace Kenyon Martin). The 2012 pick (or two) could help with the re-building effort. Chuck Hayes gives them some quality depth and another good post defender. Jeffries is pure filler but might be able to crack Denver's rotation as a situational defender. Johnson and Harris are purely for luxury tax relief. From Houston's end, I think it's a gamble worth taking. You're not going to get Carmelo Anthony in a trade (even if just for one year) without giving up some talent. To put it into perspective, it took Donte Greene (coming off a spectacular summer league) and another first rounder to get Ron Artest for what even at the time was considered a likely one-year rental. Yes, it would hurt to lose Budinger and, to a lesser extent, Hayes and Hill. But you'd be getting in return the second best small forward in the NBA. I think the Rockets might consider making such an offer (if the Nuggets would at least be willing to consider taking it) and then go all-out for a championship next year. Meanwhile, Morey would have in his back pocket the enticement to keep Carmelo beyond next season. First of all, winning. And second, a potential 2011 lottery pick from New York (all the more adding to Morey's pitch to Melo to stay in Houston and stay away from the rebuilding Knicks). Keep in mind, Melo should be free to sign an extension with Houston at the higher salary in the days leading up to the lockout. Just something to consider.
Bima, I would never make that trade, it is giving up way to much for a half year rental. It leaves us completely bare for next season. I might give up CBud or Hill but not both, and would RATHER keep CBud because Melo is gonna walk, more than likely. DD
For Carmelo I'd give them there choice of: Jermaine Taylor Shane Battier (expiring) Chuck Hayes (expiring) Jared Jeffries (expiring) Alexander Johnson (non-guaranteed) Mike Harris (non-guaranteed) and 2012 Knick's pick (if they get Melo with Amare it won't be worth much). Whatever makes the money work, but that would be my max bid. Carmelo was on a winning team in Denver but that is not stopping him from running. I'm not sure anything short of winning a ring will make him to stay so I wouldn't give up any young good talent.
DD, first of all, I was talking about a trade for NOW. A full year's rental, at least. Also, you GREATLY underestimate the "rental value" for a player the caliber of Carmelo Anthony. Based on what you're willing to give up, there is no freakin' way that Denver would agree to such a deal. Assuming that there are no drastic changes to the CBA next summer, it is possible that Denver could net more than what you're willing to give up simply by keeping Melo and then facilitating a sign-and-trade. By comparison, Toronto managed to get two first round picks and a $14.5M trade exception just for signing and trading Bosh. That, by itself, strikes me as a better deal that your offer(s). I know you love Bud. I like him, too. But you gotta give to get.
Yes they'd probably hang up the phone on that but I really don't expect him to go anywhere but NYC. At least Caremelo is not doing a Douche Bosh "where am I going" game for a free iPad. They only thing of value that I'd give Denver is what I might hope to get back in SnT to NYK. Even that is a risk because I think they can renounce all their FAs and sign him straight up.
I am sorry Bima, I would not take that deal, because of Yao's situation. If Yao is done, we need Hill and Bud to develop, if he is good to go, we may need them to build around him. Your trade proposal, although well constructed would just be giving up too much for a rental in a year in which he would not put us over the top. Unless we KNEW that Yao was healthy, then I would go for it....but because of that...no.... DD
Fair enough. In my opinion, the only real downside to my proposed trade would be losing Chase Budinger, a decent pick and Chuck Hayes's post defense. I don't particularly think much of Jordan Hill as a player and think that Patrick Patterson is just better. Hill is a redundancy who, if he doesn't get minutes this season, will become a "wasting" asset who may quickly turn into "just another contract". But if you really think highly of Jordan Hill and his ability to become a high impact NBA player, then I can see how that might be a bit much for you to want to part with. So, I guess what you're saying is: No extension = No Melo. Why didn't you just say that before?
A similar thought occurred to me regarding Ariza. That Ariza trade reminded me a bit of what Oakland A's used to do with closers-- they'd take their existing closer, trade him to a new team, and then promote one of their other relievers (typically a flame thrower, I think) to be the new closer. Rinse and repeat. They do this because saves, a relatively meaningless stat mostly determiend by opportunity to pitch in the 9th inning with a lead, somehow had value in the market place. They would trade the guy who got the opportunities last year, give the opportunity to someone else, raising that guy's value, and then trade that guy. We don't really have such a thing as "save opportunities" in basketball, the closest thing we got is minutes. The traditional box-score stats (ppg, rpg, apg) are often depending on minutes played per game, and these box-score stats, are often overvalued. So, a good racket would be to take a guy who didn't get many minutes before, play him 30+ or even 35+ mpg and a good number of touches, and sell off the value generated by his traditional per-game stats. On the flip side, if you take a former 35 mpg guy, and have his minutes cut due to no reason associated with actual change in his play (such reason could be crowding at his position, for example), and he all of a sudden looks to be worth less than before even though we are talking about the same guy and same level of play here. So, before you are going to cut a guy's minutes, one thing you might want to do is explore cashing in his per game stats by trading him. Not sure if this is what Morey did, but it seems to be a fairly logical intepretation of how Morey handled Trevor Ariza.
I did say that....lots of times....heheh... As for Hill, I agree with you there, I kind of hope the team can flip him this year or he can develop in a Mikki Moore kind of way, where he can be a shot blocking weakside defender to Yao Ming on the block. The only thing I have really liked about Hill are when he is not a go too guy, but more of a garbage pail player, or someone who dunks alley ooops... DD
Well, since this is a RANDOM trade thread..... Houston gets Melo Iggy Lou Williams Denver gets Jeffries Hill Bud Johnson Harris Patterson Phillie gets Brooks Battier(buyout?) Taylor + $5 mil. TE for Williams(sweetner) Line-up Lowry/Williams/Ish Martin/Lee/Battier? Melo/Iggy Scola/Hayes Yao/Miller Distribute picks as you see fit to make each team happy(if possible). Flame away gentlemen!!! :grin:
