David Anderson > yoa Seriously though, the consensus here seems to suggest that you pass some GED competency test first.
Please read my post again. I said he's a health stud compared to Yao. You know why? Because Gasol was always healthy when its playoff time. On the other hand, Yao Ming was almost always injured. So what if Yao Ming ends up playing deeper rounds or maybe even wins a ring or two? Why should that even matter when Gasol has already done that right now? And why is "being remembered as the only skilled big man in NBA history who could not win 1 playoff game in 12 tries" significant? Gasol is an NBA champion, and despite your claims to the contrary he is clearly the 2nd most vital guy to the Lakers' success. Why should I care what his state was before he came to the Lakers? We're about talking about who is the better player NOW, not 3 years ago. Again, one guy is healthy, the other guy is in crutches four of the last five years when its money time. How can you say Yao Ming is better when he's played less games than Gasol, and certainly less games when it matters the most? If I was a gameshow host and I offered you a choice between 1M dollars outright or a 20% chance to win 2M dollars, which would be the better choice? Would you spend all this time and effort arguing that you can buy twice the amount of things with 2M when you clearly only have 20% chance of winning it? Its the same thing here, arguing that Yao Ming is somehow better than Pau Gasol is idiotic when Yao can't even stay on the court and Gasol has contributed to a championship not just in the NBA, but also at World's. I get it. You're Chinese. And you're a Rocket fan. So it's logical Yao would be your favorite player. However when talking about better players race shouldn't be an issue, so you shouldn't let it blind you to the facts. As an Asian and a rocket fan myself I support Yao and want him to be the best, however wanting him to be the best and him actually being the best are two different things. The only team I hate more than the Lakers are the Celtics, yet because of blind Yao worshippers like you I'm actually forced to defend a player of a team I detest smh.
I understand your point however the OP's thread title is different from his opening post. The thread title conveys an outrage that Gasol is perceived to be better than Yao, however once opened the OP starts making this big "Yao was healthy" qualification. It is this disengenuos line of reasoning that I and a lot poster find particularly irritating with YOFs, they argue against blanket statements like "DH is better than Yao" or "Gasol is better than Yao", however when pressed for an explanation they go for the "1-on-1" excuse for DH and the "playoff failure" excuse for Gasol, conveniently ignoring Yao's health issue which automatically makes him worse than Pau Gasol, Dh, Perkins, Marc Gasol and most probably even Andrew Bogut. It is this continued tendency to ignore the obvious fact that invokes the "lol he's injured" from us rational posters here. Arguing that Yao Ming is better when he's healthy is a moot point because its pure speculation at this point in time and Yao is NOT healthy. Frankly I'm tired of arguing that Yao Ming is better than X if he was healthy, the only ones at this point in time who will be willing to discuss this with you are fellow YOFs like wnes and the OP.
So how is trying to argue who is better when Player X is sitting on the sidelines compared to Player Y who is in uniform any much better? The point is player Y will always be "picked" because he's playing. There really isn't much to discuss there. But fortunately this a is message board where hypotheticals and what ifs are welcome.
Read the post in which I replied to nodstonothing's assertions that 1) Gasol is always healthy and 2) his teams have way more success than Yao's team. These two were stated as matters of facts and without any qualification whatsoever. He later scaled back the grandiose claim #1 by qualifying the term "always healthy" as "playing 59+ games for five years straight" but couldn't refute my contention that the Grizzlies' record with Gasol is not exactly a shining example of having "WAYYYYYYY more success" than Yao's Rockets. You came to the party a little too late, revisionist history on LA's transformation notwithstanding. The original poster made it abundantly clear in his opening message that "right now" is not the condition under which the discussion is to proceed. Your silly insistence on otherwise gets old. Like another poster has said, you may want to beef up your reading comprehension. Well, failure may also be in the eyes of beholder. Evaluating a player's whole career is a fair game. Supposed to be the alpha dog on Grizzlies, Gasol mailed it in when his team failed to make playoff by demanding a trade. I won't be surprised if a large number of Memphis fans consider him a bona fide loser. In all-or-nothing scenario, it's not unreasonable to take a 20% chance of winning 2M if you have nothing and the guy you want to beat has 1M. Now you are getting really silly, Asian YOH. The only guys who bring race and YOF into this thread are you and that spiegl boy. There are plenty of Yao bashers of Chinese origins, on the other hand, we have multitude non-Chinese Yao supporters. The "logic" you so claimed has way too many holes it's not even funny. If you want to open the can of worms on race, go to D&D where you will have a field day.
Bogus, Gasol is too up/down like the Dow... Played great in the Olympic finals, however, he disappears against big men who play tough (Garnett/Stoudemire). We wil see tonight when Garnett and Perkins get in his face and start fouling him really hard to take him out the game. This strategy works on soft big men, turning them into jump shooters.
Jim, if i uploaded all my rocket games and we sat down and watched them, your translation into what is going on will be different than what i see. To you and others, they think yao gets doubles when he get off the bus. To you and others, a fronting defense is a double which its not. So no matter what you think or what i see, you're not going to agree. Even if you did, you, like other will probably come up with another excuse in regards to how teams can make him ineffective. He's a very good player when healthy and nbody can dispute that, but whether or not he's better than gasol is the disagreement. Neither guys are #1 options on a championsh team healthy or not. Neither guy can lead a nbdl team morless a nba team. They're both soft,big men who are skilled. Now anything after that, thats your deal.
Can we agree if Gasol was still playing for Memphis its possible this topic might never exist......... Another what if......haha
If you have some damning video evidence, post it. What are you afraid of? I have been quite clear about my openness to people posting some actual evidence and analysis. Do the extra work, post the videos, and count up and analyze Yao's plays. Too lazy to do that? Then excuse me for not caring about what you have to say. Which is mostly you running away from backing up your words, while throwing insults at me.
Rockets2k have hundred of rockets games he's posted on this site. Why dont u go and watch game 3 vs utah, pull out a pen and pad and count the double teams or what you percieve as a double. Not some 2 minute highlight u posted earlier, a real game. We will compare notes and maybe we can see the difference. I'm not insulting you unless fanboy is insulting.
Seriously, don't reproduce. An opening post typically explains what he wants the thread to be, and he very clearly stated the "if healthy" condition. You can't just assume that "Gasol Better than Yao" means "Would you rather take Gasol over Yao", especially when he states nothing of the sort. You wouldn't post book reviews based solely off of the title, would you? You claim that all "YOFs" ignore his health, but they clearly acknowledge it by stating "if healthy" and then move on to discuss their games since there really isn't anything more to say about health. "Pure specualtion" can be used to describe the majority of threads on the GARM at this point: it's the offseason. I don't see a problem with it. There's more discussion to be had if you disregard health. This is a discussion board, and if you're "tired of arguing" you can kindly exit the thread. Nobody is forcing you to read the discussion. You've made your point, Yao is injured and he's automatically terrible in your book. WE GET IT. That's all you've been talking about this entire thread. That's not what the thread is about. Pull a tinman and make your own thread. "GASOL BETTER THAN YAO: INJURY EDITION". One final thing: how can you call me a YOF when I would rather have Gasol on my team? I'm tired of you so called "rational" posters calling anybody who happens to disagree with you or say anything positive about Yao a YOF.
Gasol is better. look at the numbers he puts up healthy. More athletic, more offensive minded, better defending on ball, and out rebounds him also. "men lie women lie, numbers dont lie" I love the rockets, i would rather have a healthy Yao just from the business aspect. But whether or not Gasol is the best big in the league, he is better than yao. Dwight probably the best, but in the postseason i would take gasol, just cause howard doesnt have as many ways to score outside of dunks, and teams can simply foul him and he will miss the free throws. And Yao is for sure the best free throw shooter of all the bigs.
One players gets an abundance of favorable calls, while the other players is worst officiated player in the league.
You don't understand burden of proof do you? You claimed to have something, so show it. You're so disgustingly lazy, I will not do your work for you. Show me the link, show me your analysis, show me specific times in the videos. Again, why are you so averse to backing up your own statements?
Is it because A) He is healthy B) Coached by one of the greatest Coaches who has a perfect system? C) Surrounded by Bynum, Odom, Artest, D) playing with the best player in the game Kobe Bryant F) he is just a beast who can lead any team to the playoffs and win must be F
I'm not nodstonothing, and I didn't claim that Gasol is always healthy all year round so your rebuttals. As far as playoff success is concerned I think losing every single playoff game you have is much better than being injured 4 of 5 consecutive playoff runs. That's like a beggar making fun of a garbage collector. It's funny you say this, because the OP's complaint is based on stuff happening right now. "His poor performance in the Suns series notwithstanding,Obama and Doug Collins have each mentioned Pau Gasol as "the best big man in the game."" When did his happen? Oh yeah, this year. The problem is the OP is complaining about reality but the reasons for his complaint are based on fantasy. OMG why are Obama and Doug Collins calling Pau the best big man in the game? IF Yao was totally healthy he's the dominate C in the league! See the problem here? Complaining about reality based on theoretical assumptions. You got that right, bro. You make out Gasol's playoff history as if it's something that will haunt Gasol for the rest of his days. Ever thought what would have happened if Gasol and Yao had switched teams? I'm pretty sure a lot of those playoff tries would be considered losses as well due to Yao breaking down. On the other hand is there any chance of Gasol being negated by fronting or trumped by the Jazz frontcourt? LOL Tmac would have at the very least reached the 2nd round by now. And exactly where has Yao Ming led his team as the alpha dog of the Rockets? Oh right, he was never even an an alpha dog! The times he was supposed to be the alpha dog he broke his foot. A mediocre alpha dog is 10X better to a player sitting on the bench in a suit. As I said it's like a beggar making fun of a garbage collector. And "career loser" is stretching it when he already has a ring. Did I say it was an all-or-nothing scenario? What's the point of giving that choice if someone already has 1M and your only chance of winning is to get that 2M? Obviously everyone and their mothers would go for the 2M, since if they pick the 1M they won't win anyway. IF you could keep the money you win though, can you honestly tell me you'd take the 2M? Its the same thing here. The more consistently healthier player is better than the consistently injured player. And to be fair its not like we're comparing healthy Jerome James and injured Hakeem here. Even when both are totally healty I don't think there's a large gap between the two. First of all, I apologize if you think I just insulted all Chinese people, that was certainly not my intention. However, the reason I'm bringing up the race card is that's the only reason any rational person will say Yao Ming is better than Gasol. What holes are you referring to? The fact that Gasol lost all his playoff games? Is that somehow worse than sitting out multiple playoff runs due to injury? When comparing the career of the two players its not even close. Gasol will be participating in his 3rd finals game, Yao Ming hasn't even gotten past the 2nd round. Yet somehow Gasol can't hold a candle compared to Yao Ming.
