I hate creating yet another Bosh thread, but the question keeps arising of what would we have to give up to get Bosh. Quite simply: we don't know. If Bosh is hell-bent on coming to Houston, Morey will be in the driver's seat in any negotiations with Colangelo. Remember, Toronto is trying to get something for Bosh rather that nothing at all if he simply walks. If Bosh doesn't care so much where he goes, it will be more difficult because there will be competitive offers. While I believe Houston has a nice array of players and picks we can offer (thanks Morey), the cost will be significantly higher than if Houston is on his short list (the shorter the better). So, again, we don't know what we have to give up. Still, the question remains: what would you give up? This is why I devised this multiple choice poll (Scola/Lowry salaries are complete estimates). After some time, we can take the top choices in the poll and add up the money until it's within 25% of Bosh's max salary. It'll be a good barometer of what the ClutchFans community thinks Bosh is really worth. Simply choose a package you'd be willing to toss at Colangelo for Chris Bosh. (give the poll a few minutes since it has a lot of options)
You first intuitions were correct. This is an unnecessary new thread. Your theory doesn't even make sense. Bosh will decide on one team or another and what they have to offer Toronto has no bearing. He will receive a Max contract so his decision will be based on if he will be the main guy, or If he will be able to win a championship and/or how much he likes the city, etc. The team that he picks will be based on how much they are able to convince him they have the best of what he wants. It is irrelevant what the team he wants has to offer Toronto. Let me rephrase that. What Houston will have to give up to attain Bosh will not be dependent on what other teams or interested in signing him. Toronto will not accept trash or take long term junk contracts just to accomidate Bosh. They also will not give him away for nothing. So if he picks Houston than any notion that will be because Houston has more to offer Toronto is just not so. As long as their some remote chance that Bosh is willing to sign with a team like Chicago or New York straight up than the team he picks will have the leverage. The only variation of that is if Bosh made it clear that he would only sign with Houston and no one else then Toronto would have leverage. But since no agent is stupid enough to suggest an intention that would cause his player to lose leverage even if it is true, Toronto will always be left with the possibility that Bosh will walk and they recieve nothing! Nada, a big fat zero! Hell, the whole Bosh appealing to fans on twitter might have been a ploy by his agent to show that Bosh is still undecided where he wants to go. I bet Bosh has a pretty good idea where he wants to go and that doesn't include more than a handful of teams. But by suggesting that a plea from fans could change his mind is not logical. But it does throw doubt in Toronto's minds as to if they will get anything for Bosh. And under those circumstances whichever team Bosh picks will have the upper hand. And as long as Houston offers Toronto something reasonable, something that is not an insult, something better than nothing Toronto will probably accept. The only question is what would Toronto want from us that is better than walking away with nothing. Now let us say we offer Toronto Jeffries, Hill Chuck Hayes to make it work and our 2012 draft pick. They would probably say that's not enough and then call Bosh's bluff. Bosh at that point might say to Houston hey you got to offer them more if you want me. I don't want to sign with New York for 30 million less. And then if we say no Bosh may decide to switch to his next choice. But that would be because he doesn't want to lose 30 million bucks. So you see it's not about the players. He doesn't care what the team he chooses is offering the Raptors. He just wants to play in a city he likes that provides him the most money.
Only 10 options available, so I excluded Kevin Martin and Yao Ming because I sincerely doubt they'd be involved in the trade... and excluded David Andersen because I don't think Toronto would want him (hasn't proven much yet).
Can we assume almost any package would include Jeffries' expiring contract to help match salaries with whatever young player(s) Toronto would accept? I'm sure it's been covered by now (if there are any other Bosh threads :grin: ), but what minimum dollar amount would Rocket player salaries have to add up to to match what would be Bosh's starting salary? Assuming Bosh comes alone, of course.
I think Bosh will first dictate the number of teams he will eb interested to play for. Then second layer would Raptors getting the best options out of those teams to pick couple for Bosh to make the final decision. Rockets? we are probably 3rd or 4th single team that could give attractive package to the Raptors. However, we may be the single best team in order to package a 3 or 4 teams trade to take both Bosh and hedo off Raptors hand. (if that is what raptors want to do). We end up having Bosh, Hedo to another team and then picks and young talents to Raptors.
if the question is what would i give up to get him, the answer is as little as possible... but that's my answer to what i would give up for any acquisition. this poll is flawed in the sense that people will vote for jeffries and jt... but that doesn't mean that is all bosh is worth.
What a strange poll question. Let's be honest, most people would be willing to give up any one of those guys for Bosh. And, of course, most would prefer to give up Jeffries or one of the other more minor roleplayers. So what's the point?
How realistic is this? Ariza + Jeffries + Hill + Brooks + 2012 pick for Bosh and #13th pick this year.
You are overpaying IMO. Jeffries, Hill, Battier/Ariza, Pick is more than enough to land us Bosh. Remember, Toronto doesn't have much negotiating power on the S&T if Bosh only wants to sign with us... However, we might need to throw in Cbud or a 2nd round pick if we are just one of the teams Bosh wants sign with..
What happened to David Andersen?? I think that giving up Jefferies and Battier are necessary for salary purposes. Scola is a free agent so that complicates things. If he wanted to go to Toronto in the event we acquire Bosh then I don't think I would have a problem with it as long as we can keep more assets in the trade. I think we would need to get a decent combo PF/C to play limited minutes behind both Yao and Bosh. The players I would want to see go (in order of necessity and preference) are Jeffries, Battier, Hill, Lowry (maybe Budinger depending on the situation). Lowry is weighing his options finding a starting job somewhere else, and Toronto could provide him with that. One thing I am afraid is that our own free agents may get offered too much money for Morey to consider it worthwile. Scola is older and doesn't play terrific defense so I think teams will be hesitant about overpaying for him. However Lowry is younger and a very decent pg except for his shooting an I could see a few teams offering him a substantial amount of money and a starting job. So maybe we can work out a deal where he goes to Toronto. In the end I think I would be happiest with Jeffries, Battier, Hill and picks... If they asked for Brooks or Martin I would walk away from the table and tell Bosh they are playing hardball with us and trying to make us take on Hedo or Calderon. Bosh's agent should know that if his team is playing hardball they are going to screw up the team he gets traded to. I would assume that he is going to make a decision on one team and discuss it with that team then Toronto, so a better deal can be worked out for us and him .
From that list, I would give up everybody but Hayes. Hayes would do the dirty work that Bosh may/can/will not do.
Maybe, maybe not. We would have the 13th and the 14th picks in this years draft (Whiteside/Alabi & Anderson/Bledsoe).
We, at clutchfans, have already stated many times the reasons why Bosh SHOULD do a s&t to Houston (if he knows what's good for him). Business-wise, Morey has done a fantastic job to stockpile assets over the past couple years to be in a position to make a 'splash' type of move. Whether Bosh decides to become a Rocket, is entirely up to him. Morey knows this and that is why he is probably trying to come up with just the right pitch to sell Bosh and his agent come recruiting day. Since only Bosh and Bosh alone knows exactly what he wants, we can continue speculating on what someone's opinion is... OR we can try to figure out the package that will be going out if we were to attain Bosh. Based on Toronto's interests, this is what I think will ultimately be offered: J. Hill, S. Battier, S. Llull, J. Jeffries, NY swap 2011, NY pick 2012. That gives Toronto 2 solid prospects that they want, expiring contracts, and the potential to land 2 high draft picks. The beauty of the NY picks are that TOR can potentially get a higher pick if they send Bosh to another city. NY traded their picks banking on the fact that they will go all-in for 2 max free agents (Lebron/Wade + Bosh). The current climate highly indicates that none of the three will be headed to NY, leaving them with overpriced 2nd tier free agents and a bunch of mediocre role players to suit up for the next couple of years. So in essence, the ROX took Jeffries from NY, giving them the cap space they want, but at the same time were targeting the same players NY was going after, all the while knowing that they had better chips on the table when the time came to bid. That is the true genius of Morey. I can also see how Battier could come back to our team ala Big Z for the vet min after being bought out by Tor by ROX request. That is where HOU would give cash considerations. Also, I can see Tor wanting to include Hedo/Calderon somehow, but Morey saying that it would be a dealbreaker. So instead, HOU might accept a smaller unwanted contract from TOR like a Reggie Evans, which means no cash considerations. Your (potential) ROX 2011 Yao/Hayes/Andersen/(part of MLE Miller) Bosh/Scola/#14 Ariza/Budinger Martin/Battier*/Taylor Brooks/Lowry/(part of MLE) My guess is just like anybody else's... a guess. But, I did call the Martin/Landry trade and also the Jeffries/McGrady dump so take it for what it's worth.
anytime you get a superstar in a deal you shuold be willing to part with anyone. at the time of the KG trade most people thought boston gave up too much to land KG, but look at minnesota and how al jefferson worked out. needless to say they aren't winning a chip in the near future.
We have all the leverage. We are just as good with/without Bosh. Getting Bosh requires us giving up a lot of bench talent. Leaving Bosh gives us a much stronger bench options. Our Bench w/o Bosh would give teams the blues. Battier Budinger Taylor (14th Draft Pick) Lowry Hill Chuck.
BTW, Toronto doesn't have that much power since Bosh is UFA. If they play hardball they get nothing for Bosh and Bosh loses $30 mln. So everyone has to give up something to get something. Basically they can't just take the Rockets for all of our talent. We may give up on Jordan (I hate the thought of this. Dude has crazy upside, I like a big man with a 15 ft jumper and hops). We also need to get Luis on board with coming off the bench. I'm not sure Scola would be okay with this. In that case I see us including Luis instead of Jordan Hill. We could also lessen the amount of assets given to Toronto by increasing Luis salary and sending him and Jeffries along with 2 1st round picks.
