The difference in the slavery system between Africa and other parts of the world that Prempeh mentioned was that the slaves in Africa held a life in bondage but not their children. Quickly after slavery became popular in the Americas for cheap labor, it became a racial standard. There was an account where the English colonists raided a Portuguese slave ship, took the crew and slaves as their property but later decided to free the Portuguese because of race. Slave labor was expensive then so the racial inclinition was high. Even if there were around 12-15 million survivors, the children and the descendents of their survivors were still condemned to a life a bondage. Nonetheless, despite all this, I still feel that the lines between the truly entitled to those who have to foot the bill for all of this is muddled between self interests and greed. Our "reparation" to some Indian tribes was their own set of laws to operate tax exempt entertainment complexes. It still doesn't benefit all the Indians, nor does it hide the fact that the government committed acts of genocide 150 years ago. Reparations and blood money won't heal the pain of the actions some of our ancestors did centuries back. Nor does it eliminate the racism or the "uneven footing" Black people has had to endure. It's like this is more a trial on racism against African Americans than sorting out those who were truly aggrived.
I think a dollar value should be placed on the US white lives that were lost in the civil war, along with compensation to the US military that stamped out the world-wide slave trade. Then after figuring out the damages rendered to slaves, we deduct from what they owe the US, and walla, every black in the world will owe each US white citizen $10K. Wheres my check????? Lets go march!! Im joking by the way. It just appears throughout time someone was F--ed hard without any compensation. You just overcame and survived..... Anyways I agree with another poster. If were going to compensate anyone, start with the native americans.
I would consider deprivation of wages, freedom, education, culture, heritage, etc. of my ancestors to be worthy of a claim. That's why a study is important. It's a first step to investigate.
The sad thing is, this was a vote to just "explore the possiblities" of reparations. No money was to change hands if this vote passed. If the govt is going to pay reparations, they should be paid to actual slaves. Seems like it's a little too late for that... Question: Didn't some slaves get "40 acres and a mule" after slavery was abolished? Google link to "40 acres and a mule" search
The Japanese people who were harmed were paid their settlement. it is no different than a traditional lawsuit settlement. To say that this is the same thing is ridiculous. So boo hoo to you. I didn't say that Federal entitlements and welfare should be scrapped. I said that the persons receiving the reparations should waive their rights to these programs. That doesn't harm anybody else. So...gee...I guess I have a point after all. Oh, I get it. You want the money. NOW it makes sense. How is not agreeing to reparations holding anybody accountable for anything? I'm just not willing to fork over even more money to the government than I already do so that it can be given to somebody who didn't know or have any tangible connection to the wronged party. Be realistic...this isn't about what is right and just, it is about political power and money. OK I studied it and those are my findings. Sorry, I don't think you deserve a check for something that happened 137 years ago.
Sure the government was responsible for slavery, but that was abolished generations before you were even born. Its also the government's fault that you live here because they savagely kicked the native indians off their land and allowed you to colonize...why have you not replied to anyone's comments about it? And you know what? They were still doing it after they "abolished" slavery. Since you are so passionate about the race issue why don't you start with the worst one(native american) and see what the government has left to give you after that. To me, it sounds like the various African American groups are requesting these reparations because of how poorly they're treated AFTER slavery...but, american society is more to blame for this than the government. To my knowledge, there are no US laws that condone discrimination or racism, in fact, there are laws in the 60's that state it is illegal to for anyone to practice it. Of course that is the LAW and not what is practiced by a lot of members of SOCIETY. I don't see how you can hold the government accountable for what is really the fault of society.
The United States government is responsible for Japanese internment as much as allowing slavery. Japanese internment camps were arguably illegal under US law at the time. That creates a legal problem. Slavery was perfectly legal at the time. Governments don't usually rewrite morality backwards to the past and repay people for it. I wonder if we should also re-pay families of any women who were arrested for having abortions in the 1800's because it was illegal? Perhaps we should also go back and repay families who were affected by prohibition laws as well. Slavery was a ridiculous blackmark on our past. That doesn't mean the government and today's people have an obligation to undo a wrong from 150 years ago.
Statute of Limitations. Also, I'll be damned if anybody gets my money out of this whole deal. I didn't enslave anybody.
First off, I am sad that some of you have undergone discrimination in this country. I can proudly say that I have NEVER looked down on or treated someone badly because of the color of their skin...I was raised better than that, and I am raising my kids to be the same way... This is what I offer you in payment for the aggregious acts of some parts of American society over the last 150 odd years...it's all I can offer and all I feel that I owe my fellow man... So I am against any monetary reperations, if they want to study it in detail...fine..but I don't see how we are gonna learn anymore than we already know about that dark period in our history.. For the record ( not that it really matters) , my ancestors didn't come over here till the late 1800's..and when they did, they were much to poor to own anybody...and the other part of my heritage is Cherokee, so I know they didn't own anybody...
For those of you who use the argument that you didn't do it, so why should the government use your tax dollars-how is this any different from someone who's never flown having their tax money used to bail out the airlines? How about those who never drive having their tax money used for highways? How about those with no kids who have their tax money used for public schools? I'm not really sure how I feel about reparations. I just think that this argument is flawed.
I couldn't disagree with you more. The things that you listed are essentially infrastructure. Even if you never fly or drive, the goods that you buy and any packages you may ship use the air and the highways to get from point A to point B. Without these things, we simply could not conduct commerce. What we are talking about in this thread is a lump sum payment to a discrete group of individuals for a specific past wrong. It's basically a delayed tort settlement. If you didn't commit the wrong you don't pay...that's the system. society at large vs. various specific individuals apples vs. oranges
Cohen The reason that number is so hotly debated is because there really is no way of knowing... The estimate in your link, I would think, is based on cargo manifests...not counting illegal/unregistered shipments I am sure most of us know that the slave trade did not stop when it was "outlawed." The 50 million estimate is sort of a happy medium that I've heard many scholars use as a sort of baseline.
But they're not suing individuals, they're suing a government. The government we have today is the same one that was here when slavery occured.
I think Strom Thurmond is the only government official old enuff to have been around back then. The name of the organization may be the same, but it's not the same ppl making the decisions... I 'm not seeing why it's right to demand financial reperations for a past (way past) wrong...You're welcome to try to convince me...but it aint likely...
That's a simplistic analysis. What would likely happen is that all of us would ship an extra check to the government to be distributed. Therefore it is the people paying the money, not the government. The courts are an arm of government, and the courts can order you to pay a judgment. That is why this is analogous to a lawsuit. In any event, your other examples are still not a good comparison.
I think the proposed numbers broke down to costing each nonblack American $85K a piece(including minors). So a family of 5 would owe $425K,if they settled for the current 18 trillion asking price.
$85k...that's funny. Bottom line is that if they want 85 CENTS from me they'll have to come and beat it out of me.
An aside: The vast majority of people on welfare in the United States are *white*. Tying reparations and welfare together is utterly inaccurate (and a really dodgy assumption). By the way, other countries pay reparations to minorities. The world does not come to an end as a result. Shrug.
I made no assumption at all. I merely said that any person to receive reparations would have to waive their rights to such programs. I never said that I thought most recipients were black. However, drive to the nearest HUD project (which costs a lot more than welfare) and tell me the racial makeup. Reparations should extinguish ALL governmental obligations and/or entitlements to those who receive them. Period. End of quote.
