Kahn's Top 50

Oh, ok. I thought maybe that's what you were referring to.

I'll admit that it's just my opinion, and I could see an argument being made for most of those players. I think Cuttino LAST YEAR was better than any of those players LAST YEAR. I guess I'm mostly talking production, not talent. I agree that some of those players definitely have more natural talent than Cat.

Also...all of the players I mentioned, including Cuttino, are sort of on the verge of either reaching stardom or fading into mediocrity, and I think it remains to be seen whether history will judge them one way or the other...

 

Here's MSNBC's top 50:

http://www.msnbc.com/news/722238.asp


1. Shaquille O'Neal, C, Lakers. If his size doesn't lead to career-shortening foot problems — he already is hindered by an arthritic big toe — O'Neal has a chance to be remembered as the most dominant big man ever.

2. Kobe Bryant, SG, Lakers. One personnel man calls Bryant "the Lakers' engine," and it's a good bet Bryant, 23, still will be running high on this list long after O'Neal, who will be 30 on March 6, has retired.

3. Tim Duncan, PF, Spurs. If O'Neal is the player every GM would love to have, Duncan is the player every GM loves. Duncan isn't the physical freak O'Neal is, but his game is freakishly consistent, a compilation of perfectly honed inside skills. "He may be the best all-around big man of all-time," one GM says. Duncan has dropped from first to third since TSN last did these rankings two seasons ago, but that probably has more to do with the Lakers' two titles than anything Duncan has done.

4. Kevin Garnett, SF, Timberwolves. Garnett, 25, was third on this list two years ago, but he's a distant fourth today. Does that mean Garnett is slipping? Hardly, but he has leveled off statistically after a rapid climb in his first four seasons. Garnett is the league's highest-paid player for good reason, and, athletically, the league hasn't seen anything like him at his 6-11 size. Still, he would be No. 1 on this list with a more reliable post game.

5. Tracy McGrady, SG, Magic. McGrady wasn't even in the top 50 two seasons ago, but look what a move out of Vince Carter's shadow in Toronto did for him. He reached 40 points in three of four games during a rare good stretch of health in late December and could be the league's most unstoppable scoring threat when his back is right.

6. Allen Iverson, SG, 76ers. "Beep, beep — he's everywhere!" one personnel man says. Proof that speed is as important in basketball as in any other sport, Iverson usually is there and gone before most players even get there. Last season's MVP is shooting a miserable 39.6 percent, but he still is the guy most NBA players least like to guard.

7. Vince Carter, SG, Raptors. When Carter came into the league, scouts said he had no outside game to complement his thunderous dunks, but he quickly took care of that, shooting at or near 40 percent from 3-point range in his second, third and fourth seasons. Too bad McGrady didn't find himself until he left Toronto, because McGrady and Carter could have rivaled Michael Jordan and Scottie Pippen in their prime.

8. Chris Webber, PF, Kings. Personnel men ranked him highly but were reluctant, given Webber's history of injury problems and his inability to transform the Kings from a good team into a great one. "(Ranking him this high) was a stretch," one official says. "The Kings play better without him." Still, there aren't many 6-10, 245-pounders who can handle, distribute and shoot the ball like a guard and defend like a center.

9. Jason Kidd, PG, Nets. Every GM who commented on Kidd had the word "team" within a few words of his name. It's no wonder the Nets already have won more games this season with Kidd than they did all last season. He might be the only player in the league who can be the best player on the floor without taking a shot for five or six minutes.

10. Gary Payton, PG Sonics. Two seasons ago, Payton was the top guard at No. 5, but don't blame any erosion in his skills for his standing behind Bryant, McGrady, Iverson and Carter. Payton, 33, still is the NBA's best scoring and defensive point guard. No team relies on a single player more than the Sonics do on Payton.


11. Ray Allen, SG, Bucks. He seemed ready to join the likes of Bryant and Carter during last season's playoffs but suffered a knee injury and still is feeling the effects of it. Allen has the prettiest jump shot in the game but needs to work on the mean streak he seemed to be developing last May.
12. Dirk Nowitzki, SF, Mavericks. How fast is he improving? In 1998, he was traded for Robert Traylor on draft night. Two years ago, he wasn't on this list. Today, he's the best-shooting big man in basketball.

13. Paul Pierce, SF, Celtics. Antoine Walker's onetime sidekick has become the leading man in Boston. Capable of scoring five points in the first half and 35 in the second, Pierce is one of the game's most dangerous streak shooters and is an underrated defender.

14. Michael Jordan, SF, Wizards. His comeback was as much a point of disagreement among the GMs as it has been in the media. Two ranked him fifth, another didn't put Jordan in the top 30. The consensus, best described by one: "A 75 percent Michael is better than most others."

15. Karl Malone, PF, Jazz. At 38, he no longer can carry a team to The Finals, but his averages this season — 23.8 points, 8.8 rebounds and 4.3 assists — are comparable to his career averages. The best power forward ever still is the No. 3 No. 4 man on this list.

16. Steve Francis, PG, Rockets. At 6-3, Francis is the league's best-rebounding point guard. He's as explosive as Iverson with another 30 pounds of muscle packed on. His most important statistic: The Rockets are 2-19 without him and 18-17 with him.

17. Rasheed Wallace, PF, Trail Blazers. The poster boy for the Blazers' dysfunction, Wallace could be in the top 10 if he ever learned to harness his temper. He's 27, so don't count on that happening. In fact, his role in Portland's offense seems to have diminished this season.

18. Michael Finley, SG, Mavericks. He had the league's longest consecutive games played streak at 490 before he injured his hamstring in December. He's a streaky outside shooter who finishes as strong at the basket as the Carters and Bryants.

19. Peja Stojakovic, SF, Kings. Fans probably are surprised to see him rated this high, but GMs know the truth: Stojakovic needs only an inch or two of space to make his long-range jumper from almost anywhere. His 47.7 percent field-goal shooting is impressive for a player who rarely goes inside.

20. Dikembe Mutombo, C, 76ers. The second of five centers on this list, Mutombo's No. 20 ranking probably is more a product of the league's dearth of talent in the middle than his own game, which is largely one-dimensional as a defensive stopper. "An inside defensive force is hard to find," one personnel man says.


21. Jerry Stackhouse, SG, Pistons. His scoring average has dropped from a career-high 29.8 last season to 22.4 this season, but his stock among GMs isn't falling now that he's learning how to pass — and win.

22. Baron Davis, PG, Hornets. There were whispers during his 1999-2000 rookie season that Davis might be a bad No. 3 overall pick, but today he's the second-highest player on this list from the '99 draft. His lightning-quick penetration game became even more dangerous when he added a reliable perimeter shot in last year's playoffs and carried it through into this season.

23. Shareef Abdur-Rahim, PF, Hawks. A highly regarded player in five seasons with the Grizzlies, Abdur-Rahim was supposed to shine on a more talented Hawks team this season. Amid injuries to his teammates, he still hasn't proved he can lead a winner, but defenders haven't proved they can stop him in the post.

24. Antoine Walker, PF, Celtics. Opinions on Walker vary as wildly as his game, which features deadly post moves and passing skills that sometimes are obscured by the inability to slow down his record-setting 3-point pace. Five of those surveyed had Walker in the top 12. Seven voters didn't have him in the top 30. Even with the Celtics winning, some aren't convinced Walker's smarts match his skills.

25. Elton Brand, PF, Clippers. The Clippers brought in Brand to be Lamar Odom's right-hand man, but it's clear that Brand is the BMOC. There's nothing flashy about him, but he works wonders in the post and hits the glass as hard as anyone.

26. Stephon Marbury, PG, Suns. Marbury, 25, was ranked 13th two seasons ago, but his inability to turn the Nets into a winner certainly diminished his stock. He still has the jumper, the crossover and the fiery attitude to climb this list again, and he might be gaining back some respect in Phoenix. "He's a great talent," one personnel man says. "He's starting to be a better teammate."

27. David Robinson, C, Spurs. How does a guy averaging 11.5 points and 8.2 rebounds make the top 50? The Spurs signed him for two more seasons at $10 million each last offseason because they think Robinson still has enough left to be a 7-1 difference-maker in the playoffs. NBA GMs apparently think so, too.

28. Reggie Miller, SG, Pacers. He hasn't lost a thing at age 36, even if his statistics have slipped a bit. What Miller does best is score, and the Pacers have more guys who can do that than they did when they were making deep playoff runs every season. If he needed to score 20 a night, Miller still could, and he still is the best big-basket gunner in the game.

29. John Stockton, PG, Jazz. Stockton is not only the oldest player on this list, he's the oldest player in the NBA. He will be 40 later this month and can't keep up defensively on most nights, but he still knows how to manage a game better than any point guard.

30. Alonzo Mourning, C, Heat. He was ranked seventh two years ago, but kidney illness has robbed the NBA of one of its few elite centers. Mourning still is better than most because of his heart, and there isn't a player more dedicated to his coach.


31. Glenn Robinson, SF, Bucks. The league's most reliable midrange shooter, Robinson had a career season last year but has been hampered by nagging injuries so far this season.

32. Grant Hill, SF, Magic. He has played 18 games in the past two seasons, but it's hard to forget the triple-double machine he can be when healthy. Ranked No. 6 two years ago, Hill probably is one more ankle injury away from an early retirement.

33. Latrell Sprewell, SF, Knicks. Sprewell, 31, still relies on his athleticism as his calling card. It's the reason he can score 30 points against most of the league but can be held to five if he runs into the wrong defender.

34. Jermaine O'Neal, PF, Pacers. A year and a half later, the Dale Davis-for-O'Neal trade looks like a steal for the Pacers. If O'Neal, 23, continues to improve at the pace he has this season, he'll be a top-15 player in a year.

35. Andre Miller, PG, Cavaliers. The only thing that prevents Miller from being the league's best penetrator is opponents' lack of respect for his jump shot. He already leads the league in assists, but once he adds a reliable outside game, he'll be among the leaders in points, too.

36. Steve Nash, PG, Mavericks. When last season started, the Mavericks were thinking of platooning Nash at point guard with Howard Eisley. Sixteen months later, Eisley is in New York and Nash is an All-Star.

37. Jalen Rose, SF, Bulls. Capable of playing three positions, Rose struggled this season with a reduced role in the Pacers' offense, but he should get all the shots he wants in Chicago. He's the best Bulls player since M.J. left town.

38. Sam Cassell, PG, Bucks. Milwaukee coach George Karl would like Cassell to play more defense, pass more and score less, but when the Bucks need a clutch shot, it's Cassell's job to take it.

39. Antonio McDyess, PF, Nuggets. McDyess had a career season last year, but a knee injury still is delaying his start to this season. When healthy, he has a nearly unmatched combination of size and athleticism.

40. Shawn Marion, SF, Suns. The league's best-rebounding small forward, Marion has developed an effective midrange game and is a wonderful finisher on the break.


41. Antawn Jamison, SF, Warriors. Miscast as a small forward, Jamison proved what he could do at power forward last season when teammate Danny Fortson was out. Not as athletic as he looks, Jamison has an array of nifty inside moves that go to waste when he's on the perimeter.
42. Jamal Mashburn, SF, Hornets. Mashburn took his game to another level in last season's playoffs but suffered an abdominal injury that lingered into this season before he had to shut it down for the first half. Mashburn returned last week, and the Hornets are counting on him to lead them to the playoffs.

43. Wally Szczerbiak, SG, Timberwolves. A near-lock for the Most Improved Player award, Szczerbiak has added a dose of toughness to a perimeter-based game.

44. Allan Houston, SG, Knicks. Ranked 14th two years ago, Houston never took his game past the jump-shooting level as many expected he would. His $100 million deal with the Knicks ensures he'll never live up to expectations.

45. Vlade Divac, C, Kings. Just when you start to forget all the things Divac can do — pass, work the post and defend with the NBA's best centers — Webber gets hurt and the Kings end up relying on the old man in the middle again.

46. Nick Van Exel, PG, Mavericks. He proved he can run up huge stats on a bad team, but that didn't make him happy. Van Exel, who wanted out of Denver and got his wish before last week's trade deadline, has few equals as a clutch shooter, but there are a few folks who will take those shots before him in Dallas.

47. Terrell Brandon, PG, Timberwolves. Brandon, 31, is injury-prone and on the decline, but he still is capable of hot streaks where he is one of the top handful of point guards in the league for weeks at a time. Any chance of another such streak this year vanished with a season-ending leg injury two weeks ago.

48. Keith Van Horn, PF, Nets. Van Horn has the ability to be more than the spot-up shooter he is in the Nets' offense, but he has settled into that role nicely this year with Kidd as his setup man.

49. Antonio Davis, PF, Raptors. Davis seemed to function better at center last season than he has at power forward — supposedly his best position — this season. But when he's healthy, he's one of the fiercest interior rebounders and defenders in the league.

50. Lamar Odom, SF, Clippers. Clinging to the bottom of this list on talent more than production, Odom had his season derailed by injuries and a five-game drug suspension.

 

Mobley just has to go and prove himself again. He didnt make either list, so i guess he has something to work towards for next year.

 

I'm very shocked Francis is that high.

I'm surprised Mobley isn't on at all.

Walker should be lower. Bibby should be lower. Ben Wallce should be lower. Mutombo shouldn't be on there.

 

Bigboymumu I rank you as a 0 for putting francis so high on the list migraines or not!

 

where in hell is mobley?

 

How is it unfair to say that Cat is better than Rashard? He is...period. He plays better "D", he can dribble, he drives to the basket, gets to the free throw line more, he can actually create his own shot if he has to and he has better stats. Both players are their teams number 2 option. The only thing that Rashard might be slightly better at than Cat is the outside shot. IMO.

I'm not saying that Cat belongs on that list but I can't find anything to support anyones oppinion that Rashard is better.

And what in the Hell is Grant Hill doing on that list?! After missing the last two years he needs to prove he can still bring it before he is placed back on that list. Rashard is not my only problem on that list their are several.

 

Steve Francis is ranked 13.......This is too high!
Steve Nash is only ranked 33 ,even lower than Marbury,Bibby.
This is unfair. Nash is a true all-star!

 

i didn't check to see if it's broken down with a certain amount from each position but if not there is no good reason for cat to be left off.

lewis,d robinson, g robinson, cassell, odom, van exel, wells, houston, jamison, and szeribak. he's easily in this class and probably better than most of them.

van horn and martin got on there because of new jersey's success but neither are top 50 talent. grant hill is not deserving at all.

 

I'm glad Walker and Abdul-Rahim are high. Those guys get no credit... Walker could be MVP one of these years, and Abdul-Rahim no one notices. Shareef has to be the most underrated player in the league.

On MSNBC, Jordan is 14? Sure... look at the 4 guys they rank right after him: Malone, Francis, R. Wallace, Finley? They would take Jordan over those guys? That's called a major network jocking a cultural icon. Jordan is way too washed-up to be #14.

 

For those of you who don't think that Grant Hill should be on the list: in 16 games last year, he put up numbers that would place him solidly among the top 50 in the NBA - 17ppg and 9rpg - at only 75% health.

Two years ago, he was quite possibly the absolute best player in the NBA. Injured or not, until he proves otherwise with his play or retirement, he deserves to be listed among the top 50 NBA players. People just seem to forget how good he was and how could he could be...just like with many other injured players.

In any case...Mobley should be on the list somewhere, but in the 41-50 range. Both lists have a few players that are too high or too low, but they are just opinions meant to stir up discussion - as they have here.

 

thats gay. Cats stats were better than wallys. Who was a allstar. Whats up wih that. he averaged 21.7 ppg. I know 50 other players do not put up #'s like that. We will have 3-4 players on that list after this season. We will prove all those mother &#%%&&$%%@^^*&*$%^&!@#$*)_)& wrong.

 

HOW THE HELL IS BEN WALLACE SO HIGH??? Ahead of Francis, Vince and SHEED... wallace can only rebound and block.. he has NO OFFENSIVE SKILLS.. he should be MUCH LOWER.... this dude is on crack

 

No one can complain about Vince's place. His team lost because of him. It's that simple. I'm not saying he's doomed to be like that, but he has to improve.



As for Cat, like I said, I agree, Cat is better than Lewis. But the thing is, Lewis does somethign REALLY REALLY good, while Cat does a lot of different things good. Lewis shoots lights out. He can really really score. While Cat can drive really well, and has added a good 3-pt game. But people notice mroe when someone does ONE thing really good. Plus, Cat was on a losing team.


The second list is old. Earliest could be before the past season, or at the All Star Break. No way that's an after season list.

 

Am I understanding it correctly that Francis went from place 47 to 13 based on last seasons play? ... How did that happen? I mean last season for him and the Rockets was obviously a complete mess with injuries and few wins ... I just dont understand what he showed last season that would justify this "improvement".

 

I personally don't see the logic of leaving Reggie Miller off. It's not like he's some old, decrepit guy who doesn't contribute anymore.

This list is just plain goofy!

 

Francis moving above guys like VC is insane. He's done nothing to warrant it.

 

And Kahn completly left Michael Jordan off the list. What kinda sports writer forgets to mention Michael Jordan? He only averaged like 23-24ppg and was the best player on the Wiz.

 

All top 50 list are based on opinions and not statistics... That is why anyone who has an opinon is correct. For instance, the MSNBC list has Jordan in the 20's...