With all the Ming talk in the air, it has made me a bit nostalgic for the days of the Twin Towers, and it has brought back a question I have always wondered about, namely, if not for the knees, and possibly the inconvenience of having to make room for Hakeem, how good could Ralph Sampson have been? For those of you who aren't old enough to remember, I'll mention a couple of things that you might not be aware of... 1) At the time of their respective drafts, it was Sampson, not Hakeem, who was seen to be the potential earth-shaker. Hakeem was considered a very raw but very athletic defensive/rebounding bull in the paint, who had intriguing upside, but was a bit of a question mark in terms of all-around play. Sampson, on the other hand, was honestly predicted to be possibly the best to ever come into the game, someone who could, if he lived up to his potential, revolutionize basketball, a more athletic, bigger version of Kareem Abdul Jabbar, a 7-4 guard, etc...I'm not exaggerating one bit. Many scouts said he was the most complete big man prospect to EVER come out of college. People really were excited about the impact he would have, not just on Houston, but on basketball as a whole... 2) Sampson always played his best when he played center. Another thing that people forget is that, while his knees were a big problem, another question mark which grew around Ralph as his career progressed was the one regarding his ticker...did he have the heart for the game? He would often seem passive, able to have flurries of great play, but more often seemingly content to drift...think Derrick Coleman without the off-court troubles. But, another thing people forget was that was only the case when he was playing forward...I remember many occassions when Hakeem would be hurt, or even the year before we got the Dream when Ralph would really play with passion... Several articles/comments during broadcast would center on the fact that playing the 5 seemed to be like turning on a switch for Sampson, and while he didn't really complain, it seemed to many that he was paying the price for the fact that ( hard as it is to imagine ) he had a much more diverse game than Hakeem, and of the two he was the only one with the offensive versatility to handle playing facing up...I know Hakeem really evolved, but this was early on, and he was basically a dunker at that point. But either way, I do remember that when Sampson would play the 5, he was a different man, a different player, he was a focal point, and would take over games. Whether this would have been sustained is in doubt, as it's easy to be very competitve when you don't have to do it every night...and of course, by the time he got the chance, his knees were so shot that we'll never know if his heart wasn't too...but still, I wonder.... So, I'm asking you...IF he'd not had the knee problems which plagued him, and maybe even IF he'd been left alone at his natural position...how good could Ralph have become? As it was he averaged double-doubles as a center AND a power forward for his early career, and how many guys could have done that? It's an excercise in speculation, granted, and probably also one in frustration, as we'll never really know...but still, I ask you...How good could he have been?
If Ming is as good as Sampson, I will have NO complaints. Ralph was AWESOME, but he did dissappear for stretches. DaDakota
I'm probably more than a little biased, as for some strange reason Ralph always has been my personal favorite Rocket, but I always felt that if Ralph had possessed the love of the game itself, he would certainly be regarded as one of the absolute best ever. The physical tools that he had are probably now only best replicated in Garnett or Nowitzki. At 7'4", it was truly mind-boggling the things he could do, he almost seemed like a Globetrotter sometimes (albeit, without any humor). I still remember the Sports Illustrated ad that had Kareem getting his layup snagged from behind by Sampson and the quote "How does it feel to be 7'2", & still not be tall enough?" I think that the true blow that knocked Ralph out of the game was the regular season game in Boston in '84, when he was under-cut, slammed flat on his back & was taken out by stretcher. It seemed that ever since then, he was done. Then the knees went out, he was traded to Golden State, & like damn near everyone else who played for them, he was through.
Actually it was more in 87 really. Once his knees started giving out and developed arthiritus, it was over. When they played Seattle in the playoffs, Chambers wors him out. The next yr he was undercut and then the problems came. He was on his way to a hall of fame career but just didn't make it.
He gets no credit for it because he was about the most inconsistent 20/10 guy you could see. I remember nights where the guy would completely disappear. I remember one game against the Bulls he had something like 2 or 4 rebounds and 2 points (I think). Now pardon me, but if you're 7'4" tall you need to be getting 2 or 4 rebounds by accident. I saw guys 6'4" to 6'9" block his shot far too often. Ralph also had this propensity to think he was a guard at the most inane times. He'd try to bring the ball up the court by himself instead of passing it to one of the guards and often turn it over. At other times he'd try to do the behind the back fancy stuff instead of a direct pass. I would listen to sports talkshows in Houston back then and hear every other caller b**** about Ralph and he has no heart, he doesn't show up for every game, blah, blah, blah. He was a good player, but I don't think he would've been legendary like a Jabbar, Russell, or Chamberlain. Part of the reason was the expectations were so overblown coming out of college that nothing short of being another Chamberlain would've sufficed for his critics. Before it completely derails this thread, yes, Jordan, Drexler, and Hakeem would've made a great team. Move on. And give me a break DaDakota, you'd be b****ing about him not having a brain and having no fundamentals just like you do Steve. lol.
I was kidding... well sort of. I was saying that he did (and didn't do) things during the course of a game that made you sometimes want to throw a shoe at your tv. I was thinking you may have forgotten those things with the passing of time and that you would cuss him out for the same reasons you cuss Francis out. I'm thinking you'd be saying something like "trade Sampson for Steve Stipanovich - he's got fundamentals!". And holy cow we have smilies!
leebigiz, are you sure it was '87?, I know that I'm wrong about '84, that was a brain-lock, but I'm fairly certain that Ralph fell the same year that we lost to the Celts in '85-86. Of course I do reserve the right to be wrong...
I was a season ticket holder through the '80s and saw every game Sampson played as a Rocket and DoD is dead right. Ed Fowler used to call him Casper because he was invisible on far too many occasions. He never had the fire to battle down low and absolutely despised physical play. Bill Hanzlik used to drive him crazy. If you have the tape, go back to game 5 against the Lakers in '86. Sampson carried the Rockets on his back down the stretch leading up to the prayer at the buzzer. That is as good as it ever got for Ralph as a Rocket. He stunk in the finals against the Celtics, highlighted by that ridiculous brawl with Jerry Sichting. To see what he could have been, watch the all star game where he won the MVP with Magic feeding him. Spectacular! Unfortunately, there were no Magics in Houston.
lol! Bill Hanzlik. There's a blast from the past. Long before Hakeem found peace, became a pacifist, and reverted back to his true Islamic roots, Bill Hanzlik and Danny Schayes used to drive him and Ralph Sampson up the wall. Here are these 2 average players absolutely pissing the mighty Twin Towers off. I can't remember who it was, but either Hanzlik or Schayes used to have this patented move where he drove his knee up Sampsons' butt as Ralph tried to get position. There were a few games where Ralph nearly lost it because, well, obviously he didn't enjoy a knee up the ass. I spoke of Kareem and how I didn't think Ralph would ever have been that dominant or even in the top tier of centers ever to play the game. Coincidentally, when asked who was the most talented player he ever played against, he's often said that Kareem was it. Not Jordan, Worthy, Ewing, etc., but the big man because of one thing: the Sky Hook. Also, the most memorable moment of that fight against the Celtics in which Sampson went after Sichting to me was the swing the young Akeem took at I believe Dennis Johnson. I could be wrong about it being DJ, but nonetheless, that punch had to be the wildest thing I've ever seen. He made something like a 180 degree swing parallel to the floor using his fist like a mallet. I never laughed so hard in my life. He was out to do some damage. Of course it wasn't later until I realized how dangerous it could have been had it connected. Rocket anecdotes and nostalgia are cool to remember...
That fight happened down in front of me and the most memorable part for me was what came after order was restored. A guy started walking around the court with a Big Bird doll hung from a stick with a rope/string around it's neck. The crowd was already foaming after the Sampson ejection and you could just feel them getting more hostile as this guy paraded around The Summit. The police never stopped him. The Celtics completely shut it down after that. I think that was the greatest single season team I ever saw and they actually looked scared sitting on their bench.
Ralph's problem was his legs, and that is ar reason why i believe Yao Ming will be better. Ralph had sticks for legs and he was too tall and ,therefore, couldn't hold his position. ming is tall but has very stout legs. even though a 6'9" center will have some low leverage on him he should still be able to hold them off, especially once he builds up his upper body strength.
People throw out the term "superstar" so loosely nowadays. Ralph Sampson put up 20 and 10 his first two years in the league! Anyone who did that today would immediately be placed among the all-time greats. There are only a couple of guys in the league right now getting 20 and 10, period, and this guy did it as a rookie. He definitely would've been mentioned among the top power forwards of all-time had he stayed healthy.
Ralph was a very good player but he did have a tendency to take games off. His career ended too soon.
Let's not forget the deterioration of Ralph's knees were hastened by Rockets owner Charlie Thomas. Supposedly at the time Thomas wanted to trade Sampson and sent word down to start playing him, even though his injured knees weren't fully recovered so he Rockets fans would see him play with less than all-star quality, and wouldn't be so upset about the trade. His knees had already been injured, and the process probably only sped up the inevitable. Playing on bad knees might make him look like he didn't have the fire people would expect. I agree that when playing center, he was really something to behold, and the way at 7'4" could lead the fast break was something I can't imagine seeing too much of these days.
Ming will benefit more than Sampson because he has all star guards to take the heat off him to produce and to help him produce. I think he is more talented at this stage than even Sampson was. He seems to be built sturdier than the rail thin Sampson too. If he can come in and contribute like Sampson on a team with Rice/Taylor/Francis/Mobley/Griffin/Thomas/Nachbar/Maddox/Torres/Cato he could easiliy be a 15 pt. 10 reb 3 blk 4 asst guy out of the box.
Ralph was undercut, I think during the 85-86 or 86-87 season. The injuries started taking their toll during the next season. I don't think Ralph would have been a superstar like Bird,Hakeem or Magic but he would have been a very solid pro until the early 90's. But who knows just much the knees had to do with his inconsisent play. I'm 32 and still play basketball a few times a week. I have knee problems and it does take away from your game at times. You just don't have it in you to go hard every play because the pain in your knees. I'm guilty of picking an choosing when I step it up especially on those days my knees are killing me. We'll never know just how much the knees affected Ralphs play and psyche.
I remember that game. Ralph was dominating the Celts before he landed on his back. It had to be before 87 because John Lucas was still on the team. I am almost positive it was 85 because I think Lucas was removed from the team for a drug test just couple of weeks later. I remember the SI picture that had Ralph stealing a rebound from Kareem. "How does it feel to be 7'2" and just a little too short" That is still one of the most awesome sports captions of all time. Two people stand out in my mind when I think about the down fall of Ralph Sampson: Karl Malone and Tom Chambers. Karl Malone basically said that he was going to abuse Sampson just before a game and then he went out and did it. That was the first time that I relized who Karl Malone was. I still hate him for that. Sampson never had the strength to play against Malone. Tom Chambers had the best outside shot of any power forward in the game at the time and Ralph was just a half a step too slow to guard him on the perimeter. If Ralph laid of Chambers then Tom would drain the outside shot. If Ralph would come out to guard Chambers then he would drive around Sampson. Like you I always thought that Sampson was better inside. Unlike DOD I don't remember Ralph as any kind of liability on the break because Ralph was great in the fast break. He had the best outlet pass in the game and would run down the floor like a gazelle either on the wing or as a trailer. I remember one time Ralph was taking the wing on the break and received the ball just inside the arc and took like one step before he took off and slammed the ball down. IMO Ralph was a victim of his own high skill level because Dream had a more natural body for a PF but he did not possess the offensive skill to handle the ball away from the basket. Ralph was a hall of famer waiting to happen IMO if he had stayed at the center position and no gotten hurt. Not only was Sampson someone that would get you 20 and 10 but he also would give you 2 blocks, 3 assists and a steal a game. The one thing that drove me nuts about Ralph though was that he would catch the ball and bring it down around his waist or he would hold it in one hand out to the side looking for that long outlet pass which always seemed to put the ball in the perfect location for a little guard to steal it.
Remember the Magic Johnson quote about Ralph Sampson after that all star game? He said something to the effect that if Sampson was his teammate then he would not have enough fingers for all of the Championship rings he would win.
