OK, there’s been talk about moving Cato. I can’t say I’m opposed to the idea, but if that’s done, there’s little doubt we’ll need another guy in here to start at one of the harder positions to fill (no offense to Pig Miller). Here are two 24 year old FAs who might do the job: Brad Miller 7’ 261: He played 17 minutes a game for Charlotte this season. If you take his production (I’m just showing the relevant rebounding and shot blocking stats, cuz that’s what real centers should do) and put it out to 35 minutes a game, here's what you get: 1.45 BPG, 12.27 rebs., 4.77 offensive Jahidi White 6’9 290: He played 19 minutes a game for Washington. His season stats at 35 minutes a game are: 1.9 BPG, 12.58 rebs., 4.56 offensive Compare that to 25 year old Cato at 35 MPG: 2.72 BPG, 8.64 rebs., a measly 2.3 offensive I point out the offensive rebounds, because I figure if you’re big and have no offensive game you can at least contribute by getting the team second shots. With his big contract, Cato’s now starting to get that big contract bust label. The guy everybody always seems to bring up when talking about overpaid big men is none other than our friend, the 7’2 280 pound Greg Ostertag. Well, he played 19.8 minutes a game this season and here’s what his stats are like at 35 MPG: 3.75 BPG, 10.43 rebs., 3.71 offensive I have to admit I’m pretty darn surprised that Ostertag’s numbers eclipse our Cato’s so handily, but really, Ostertag’s numbers look pretty darn good for any center. I guess his main weakness is the same that’s plaguing Cato. That’s mental toughness and inconsistency. Anyway, back to the point of this post. I like these two centers, Miller and White. Can the Rockets afford them, and do you think they could handle the job? Are there any other guys out there who are available who could replace Cato? ------------------ [This message has been edited by oakdogg (edited May 05, 2000).] [This message has been edited by oakdogg (edited May 07, 2000).]
I'm glad you're bringing up the fact that it's not good for us to just get rid of Cato. We need a center if we get rid of Cato, and they're not that easy to come by. I still think we could do a lot worse than having Cato as our starting center. Unless we just have a good deal fall in our lap (i.e., Duncan, Kandi, or maybe even Doleac would do), I think we ought to keep Cato at least one more year. Maybe CD can help the guy out this summer. I certainly think he'll be able to tell if we ought to keep him or get rid of him by the time we really need to make that decision. Personally, I'm hoping Cato gets a fire lit under him. If so, he'd be a good fit with the Rockets. There's abosutely no reason why he shouldn't at least be giving the Rockets 12points/8 rebounds -- AT LEAST. I don't think the situation is as simple as, "We need to get rid of Cato." He may have been an underachiever last year, but I'd much rather have him than somebody like Ostertag or Reeves. ------------------
Ostertag actually played quite well versus seattle-is Cato really better than Ostertag? According to oakdogg's stats he's not. Guys, what is the point of keeping Cato for one year? We're *not* going to win a championship next year. Jettison him for a decent player, and then pick up one of these guys getting 15 minutes for chump change. QUALITY starting centers are a rarity-7 foot stiffs like Cato are not. ------------------
I say we give Cato a chance at an offseason of work with the Rockets and see how he does next year. He could surprise some people if he works hard in the offseason...especially if Hakeem works with him. Lets not trade him just to get rid of him. Lets make sure we get a good center in return or we have someone lined up already. ------------------ You can't stop F&Brule, you can only hope to contain him.
In the Charlotte-Philly series, Miller was an force down low on the boards. He has the rebounding intensity of Dennis Rodman, albeit not as much talent. I'd love to pick up either he or Doleac somehow. As far as Cato's future is concerned, I'm not too ecstatic about him staying with the Rocks if he's gonna pull the same crap he did at end of season. However, remember early on when he was lighting it up, and blocking everything? If he can return to that form, he's an excellent addition because he has tremendous athleticism and can get down the floor as fast as most point guards. But if he decides to stay in mediocrity, then he's obviously not worth keeping. Perhaps Rudy will monitor him during the summer and try to gauge his progress (good, keep ; bad, trade). He's got exceptional talent, it's all about whether he's got the desire or not.
Adonal Foyle is a free agent and with the highly paid Dampier coming back I don't think the Warriors will offer him that much money to stay. Folye: 6-10, 250lbs born 3/19/75 Cato: 6-11, 255lbs born 8/26/74 Foyle: 21.8 minutes per game (76 games 59 starts) Cato: 24.3 minutes per game (65 games 32 starts) Foyle: 5.5 points per game (5.0 shot attempts per game) Cato: 8.7 points per game (6.2 shot attempts per game) Foyle: 1.79 blocks per game (15th in NBA) Cato: 1.91 blocks per game (12th in NBA) Foyle: 5.6 rebounds per game (2.3 offensive) Cato: 6.0 rebounds per game (1.6 offensive) Foyle: .508 FG%, .378 FT% Cato: .537 FG%, .649 FT% [This message has been edited by outlaw (edited May 06, 2000).]
Yeah, I mentioned Foyle before on this board, and the consensus seems to be that Foyle is undersized at the center position, though 6'10 250 doesn't sound undersized to me, and he has really, really bad hands. Hands of course are really important with Francis and Mobley dishing off to our big guys. Yet, Cato's got some pretty bad hands too IMO. Furthermore, I just don't see how a professional sports team at the highest level (the NBA) with all its scouts would not notice any of these apparently enormous deficiencies in Foyle's skills and waste the no. 8 pick in the draft on him, the same year, FYI, that Cato was picked like no. 15. Same goes for the Clippers and Kandi Man. How can you waste the number one pick on a guy so mediocre? Anyway, I don't know anything about Miller, White, or Doleac's hands. Theirs could be just as bad for all I know. Anyway, Foyle's stats at 35 MPG (to compare to the other 35 MPG stats) aren't too bad. Check out the blocks: Adonal Foyle 6'10 250 3.03 BPG, 8.99 rebs., 3.69 offensive Doleac peaks my interest, because it's been said he's got a good outside shot which would really help this team's spacing. I didn't mention him at the start of this thread, because I didn't know how available he was over in Orlando. Here are some of his stats at 35 MPG for comparison: Doleac 6’11 262 0.88 BPG, 8.59 rebs., 2.31 offensive With Doleac, there's not the shot blocking that's there with Cato, but from how I've heard him described, he actually has offensive skills, so he brings more to the table than just the standard blocks and rebounds. I kind of like the idea of some sort of platoon system between a center with a jump shot like Doleac or maybe Jason Collier and more of a defensive minded junkyard dog type of center like Brad Miller, Jahidi White, or Adonal Foyle. I don't know how possible that sort of scenario is given that I'm unsure of how in demand these guys are, but it doesn't seem unreasonable to speculate that guys of this quality could be brought in without us breaking the bank or losing anybody from our nucleus. ------------------
I agree on the Doleac point. I think he would be a solid big man to add to the frontcourt that could rotate with Cato. Doleac possesses the capability to step out on the perimeter along with playing around the basket which is a plus with the penetrating guards on this team. I really thought he was going to blossom this season, but Orlando just did not give him enough PT. I was under the impression that Orlando wanted to keep Doleac before this season began. I heard that their plan was to basically clear out everyone aside from Armstrong and Doleac which is essentially what they did, and then re-signed Outlaw. I have no idea if they are still that high on Doleac, and if they arent, I think he would be a nice complementary big man in the Rockets frontcourt. ------------------ Check out the Best Source for Draft Info Draftsource.net
If we bring a Doleac here, it better not be to "rotate with Cato". Cato will be gone. How much would you enjoy starting/rotating and even playing more minutes than a guy that probably averages 6 times your salary? I'd be a bit disgusted to see Cato making what he makes and sitting on the bench. One thing about getting a center that I look at. On this team, I'd rather have a good defensive center or one that intimidates with the threat of a blocked shot. Let's face it, Stevie's defense is horrific; I want somebody back there that's going to make the opposing players think twice of driving. Doleac from what I remember just ain't it. I think you guys are overstating the need for a jump-shooting center. You can place any of these centers out on the perimeter and they'll have to be guarded out there or the opponent (hopefully) gets called for an illegal D. In my opinion, we don't need offensive numbers from our center as much as a strong defensive presence. Good luck finding that... we're about to lose that defensive presence in the form of Cato. ------------------ ?
Ugh. I'm getting sick of this. It is ridiculous to just go and get rid of Cato. This is not Brent Price sitting on the bench with injuries for three years for several mil a year. I am astounded at how people are ready to just get rid of him as if he were a cancer or some useless scrub. Even at his lackluster performace this year, he makes more blocks per 48 min than Shaq. The is nobody in the NBA or draft that brings the combination of size/athleticism/age that Cato does. He is the perfect fit for a young run and gun team. Am I pissed off about his lack of effort and passion in the regular season? YES! But it isn't like he's some dull nobody who never cared or never tried! He got that contract because he played some of the most inspired shot-blocking action I've ever seen in the preseason. Don't you remember when Clutch called him "The Foaming One" in the recaps? He was one of the most passionate players on the team. The heart is there. People are not one-dimensional beings that you can just judge and nothing about them will change. Maybe he needs a smack upside the head, some harsh dose of reality, whatever, to rekindle his passion for playing. Can you honestly declare he will never play again like he did in the preseason? Never ever? It's only been one season. Give him a chance next season, the trading deadline isn't until the All-Star break. There will be plenty of time to wheel and deal before then. Trade him for a decent player? Come on. Even on a bad day he's already a decent player. We shouldn't be moving him unless we are packaging to get a Big Fish. And that means more than some undersized unproven 4 from the draft. ------------------
Also, for those of you extrapolating players' current production over 35 minutes based on 16 and 19 mins per game play, be careful. I do it, too, but reality has to set in, because you have to realize there's a reason these guys are only getting 16 minutes a game. Case in point: someone in this thread mentioned over 35 minutes, Jahidi White would average 12.58 rebs per game and 4.56 offensive rebs per game. So how realistic is that? Consider that there were only 2 centers in the league that averaged 12 or greater rebounds : Shaq and Dikembe. Dikembe only averaged 3.71 offensive rebounds per game and Shaq only averaged 4.25. If you want to throw Tim Duncan into the mix as a PF, he averaged 12.4 rebs per game and 3.54 off rebs per game. ------------------ ?
I've said this again and again in posts about Cato but he may not have a good offensive game but isn't that why he is working on it over the off season. Doesn't that tell you he's trying? He could be at home sitting in his gacousie but no, he decides to work on his game. Cato MAY NOT and I repeat MAY NOT have been playing as we expected from him but if you look at his games he looked disappointed that he couldn't live upto his expectations that he had in the pre-season. Anyway just watch what happens. If CD can help him develop a better shot then he is going to be dominant. Anyone seen the "Hakeem the Dream" video? When Dream started in college he didn't have an offensive game but he worked on it over the summer and then he was unstoppable. Can this happen with Cato? Hope so! ------------------ Walt the Wizard Williams. "The aging Terrapin from Maryland"
"When Dream started in college he didn't have an offensive game but he worked on it over the summer and then he was unstoppable. Can this happen with Cato?" no it can't happen to Cato because he's not in college anymore. If he wants to be a star, he would have learned this stuff way long time ago. He has been 7 feet tall for quite awhile.
WE cannot trade CAto I think. BRIEFLY, for two reasons. 1.)He is athletic, REALLY ATHLETIC. 2.)He will get better. He is like Theo Ratliff. I would explain this better, but I really dont fee like typin rite now. Give him 1 summer. ------------------ treasurer of the moochie norris fan club
I suppose Portland thought he was so valuable that they made him 3rd string, behind someone with even less experience. I suppose the Rockets are shopping him because of their confidence in his abilities and his summer work ethic. I suppose he didn't want to start because he realized he wasn't ready. Oh yeah... what about all those offensive rebounds that he didn't grab? Boys, the guy's athletic, but has a complete deficit of skills. I don't propose chucking him for salary cap relief... but get a decent exchange, so we can go after Webber next year. ------------------
If Philly gets manhandled throughout the series like they were today, they may realize that the mix of veterans and young'ns isn't going to win a championship and start building a young team around Iverson. That's why we give them Cato, Thomas, and Drew for Tyrone Hill and Theo Ratliff. Ratliff is Cato but with more coordination. He does everything Cato does, only better. He is the ideal center for these runnin' and gunnin' Houston Rockets. ------------------
But how about this situation: We have Doleac and Cato on the same front line (Cato CAN and does play PF...just not as much in Houston). If we were to not get a top 5 pick, we could draft say a Moiso to come off the bench, or Oyededji to be a project. If we did have the ability to get Swift or Martin, then the decision is also pretty easy. You have Olajuwon start at Center, Cato at PF, Doleac the first man off the bench (Olajuwon will prob. only get about 25 mins. a game) and Swift the 2nd. Or, Swift could start at PF, and both Doleac and Cato off the bench. (Cato has said he likes coming off the bench). That potentially could provide the biggest 1-2 punch in the league off the bench (should Mobley stay here, and as a 6th man) with Mobley-Cato. It's not like Doleac has ever gotten major minutes before, 15 is his usual. ------------------ Rockets fans wanted at hoopsboards.com Draft Chat, NBA Chat, Team Chat, and more!
Ratliff is Cato but with more heart. Ratliff is Cato but with more hops. Ratliff is Cato but with a better jumper. Ratliff is Cato but with more intensity. Ratliff is Cato but with better man defense.
why are you guys thinking, that everyone in the league is mad bout having 6/42??? his trade value decreases uninterrupted and all the other teams (even the clips) might have realized it!!! ps: we´ve killed quitten´s contract, so there must be a way to kill cato´s contract! ------------------ "These pretzels are making me thirsty ..."
The whole idea of getting someone like Doleac would be to provide the offensive qualities that Cato lacks at this point. I dont think it would be a good idea to get Doleac to "replace" Cato. I agree with Nolen that it is not a good idea just to send Cato out for cap relief, the Rockets had better be getting something or worth if they deal him. The whole idea of backups are to provide something the starter lacks. Thus if the Rockets had a defensive minded SF, it would be an ideal match with Walt Williams as they could rotate as necessary depending on matchups and how the team was currently playing. If the Rockets cant acquire a player like Stromile Swift in the draft and end up drafting a swingman, someone like Doleac would be a nice role player to have in the frontcourt. Basically if they end up with studs at the 1-2-3, a frontcourt rotation of Cato, Thomas and Doleac or something to that effect with Rogers filling in the remaining minutes would not be half bad. ------------------ Check out the Best Source for Draft Info Draftsource.net
