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Yao:Play finisher or playmaker?

Discussion in 'Houston Rockets: Game Action & Roster Moves' started by leebigez, Apr 15, 2009.

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Is yao a better playmaker or play finisher?

  1. He's better at starting the play(waiting or drawing double teams).

    7.2%
  2. He's better at finishing the play ( just shooting when he gets it in range).

    34.2%
  3. He's good enough to do both for most of the game.

    58.6%
  1. leebigez

    leebigez Member

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    Just want to gauge the opinion. There is a big difference between the two. Its not anything wrong with either option. Even with centers through the history, they fell into one of these categories. Shaq,Dream,young Kareem were playmakers. Ewing,Robinson, and even zo were play finishers. This isn't a knee jerk, just a observation.

    Personally, I think he's more effective as a finisher. I say this mainly because of stamina issues and obvious mental issues. Tonight, he was more effective with the pick and pop. Once Dallas started 3/4 fronting, as usual, he struggled. I really like it when Yao is on the one way street. That one way street is shooting. No thinking, no waiting, just get the ball and shoot. If this is what he's going to be, the team needs slashing types that can get their own shot. The offensive structure and flow will be the playmaker moreso than the pg or waiting on double teams. Just a thought.
     
  2. Hmm

    Hmm Member

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    teams aren't going to wait for Yao to show up like he did against the Mavs to decide they'll be fronting in the 4th..

    might as well get the most out of him as early as possible.. and come up with some actual strategies to offset.. the crippling fronting.. and the team's crippling mentality in high stakes high pressure games..
     
  3. durvasa

    durvasa Member

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    The first responsibility of a playmaker is getting the ball. You can't be considered a playmaker if you're so dependent on your teammates to get you the basketball. I mean, the Rockets have to execute plays almost perfectly just to put Yao in position to be a "playmaker". I guess that's what this team lacks. A playmaker-maker.
     
  4. leebigez

    leebigez Member

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    Durvasa, I think he gets the ball enough to be a playmaker, im just not sure its best for him to play that role. I think the rox are kinda figuring it out. I like to see yao just get the ball and make a move. The pick and pop with yao shooting is a good way to get him easy baskets. Like I said in the game thread, he's like francis. He's not a guy that can think quickly in the flow of the game and make high quality choices. When he decides to just be the finisher, he's good, but when choices are there, I think it hamstings him a lot..
     
  5. carib

    carib Member

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    Regardless, the Rockets need to figure out how to make a lob pass when Yao is fronted or else he won't be a finisher or play maker he will just be a spectator who on the court watching his teammates not knowing what to do.
     
  6. Hmm

    Hmm Member

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    then there's when that option is completely removed from him.. fronting.. didn't you include that in your OP..?

    so why now overlook it without addressing it.. while worrying about something else..?
     
  7. michecon

    michecon Member

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    then who is your creator on this team? :confused:
     
  8. durvasa

    durvasa Member

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    The Rockets can get Yao the ball plenty in the high post, but he's not effective as a playmaker from that position. Getting him the ball inside 10 feet with his back to the basket is the challenge (especially late in games). I think he can be a good "playmaker" for us in that position, provided he can get the ball there, in that he can draw double teams and potentially create open 3-point shots. But it's just so hard to get him the ball in that position when the stakes are high because the defense starts throwing different looks at him and as a team we're too slow to respond.
     
  9. Hmm

    Hmm Member

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    again.. doesn't that then essentially make it all moot..?
     
  10. DaDakota

    DaDakota Balance wins
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    If we had an elite PG like Bibby, that fronting crap would not work.

    DD
     
  11. durvasa

    durvasa Member

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    I would say yes. To me, that's main issue. Not that Yao is incapable of making good decisions with the ball once he gets it in his comfort spots -- I think he's improved in that area the last few weeks -- but that you can't rely on a "playmaker" who struggles just to receive the ball.

    A playmaker needs the ball early in the shot clock, because the play starts with him and the more time you have, the more likely you are to get a quality shot. With Yao, because we struggle so much just to find him, he'll usually get the ball late in the shot clock (if at all). There's no way he can be an effective and consistent playmaker that way.
     
  12. leebigez

    leebigez Member

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    That's why I think he should just finish the plays. If they front, instead of burning shot clock, just pick and pop to yao at the ft line. He's a good enough of a shooter and is getting enough confidence that in the flow, that's a good shot. Why not milk it instead of just running the clock down and shooting a crazy shot?
     
  13. shortfuse3

    shortfuse3 Member

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    this is what separates yao from being a truly great center. you never heard about being unable to get Duncan, Shaq, or Hakeem the ball. in the 4th quarter you knew they were getting the ball. Yao is who he is. a good player, but with obvious mobility limitations. hell, perfecting a pass to Yao should be 2 points in itself.
     
  14. leebigez

    leebigez Member

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    I really think its more than the pg, I think its more about diversified players. The biggest loser when teams single yao is scola and shane. Scola is the biggest benefit from yao doubles, but when teams don't leave him open, he struggles. Shane also struggles because they don't leave hime. Shane isn't the type of guy that will shoot when a defender is in close proximity. As I stated in another thread, it then comes down to the only guys that can create a shot, artest,brooks,wafer, and lowery. When those are your options, that's going to be a problem.
     
  15. Hmm

    Hmm Member

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    actually the Mavs were countering that in the wee minutes of the 4th quite well as well.. they weren't merely fronting him.. they were slathering a defender on him.. just smothering his space.. it should be a foul when it's happening after he steps out.. but try to tell the officials that..


    i still say.. exhaust his offensive output from the onset.. and work out offensive options that don't rely on him for the 4th.. i seriously doubt the Mavs are going the be the last team to do this to Yao heading into the playoffs..
     
  16. durvasa

    durvasa Member

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    Exactly. Just getting him the ball is a feat in itself in crunch time. That's the hard part.
     
  17. leebigez

    leebigez Member

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    Hmm, then it turns into the chris paul syndrome. If every play the go to yao, how confident are you that yao can truly make a team pay by dropping 35? Then what happens when when teams 3/4 front and guys are cold because they weren't involved in the game?
     
  18. DaDakota

    DaDakota Balance wins
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    Invert the offense then...let Scola post and move Yao to the HP and let him run the screen and roll.

    The predictability garbage reminds me of why I hated the JVG days.

    There are other options.

    Heck...when Barea was in there on Lowry why were we not posting up Lowry?

    DD
     
  19. leebigez

    leebigez Member

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    That's why I like the pick and pop from the ft line. Brooks and yao or lowery and yao gives the team a good option late in games.
     
  20. leebigez

    leebigez Member

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    I like the idea, but im thinking more Yao high and artest low. I do think and by listening to morey today, they really like wafer in the game for those situations. The jvg esque offense is pretty frustrating.
     

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