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ABC: Third Treasury choice withdraws

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by basso, Mar 12, 2009.

  1. basso

    basso Member
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    Obama depression = Epic Fail

    [rquoter]Obama, Geithner Get Low Grades From Economists
    By PHIL IZZO

    U.S. President Barack Obama and Treasury Secretary Timothy Geithner received failing grades for their efforts to revive the economy from participants in the latest Wall Street Journal forecasting survey.

    The economists' assessment stands in stark contrast with Mr. Obama's popularity with the public, with a recent Wall Street Journal/NBC poll giving him a 60% approval rating. A majority of the 49 economists polled said they were dissatisfied with the administration's economic policies.

    On average, they gave the president a grade of 59 out of 100, and although there was a broad range of marks, 42% of respondents rated Mr. Obama below 60. Mr. Geithner received an average grade of 51. Federal Reserve Chairman Ben Bernanke scored better, with an average 71.

    The economists, many of whom have been continually surprised by the depth of the downturn, also pushed back yet again their forecasts for when a recovery would begin. On average, they expect the downturn to end in October. Last month, they said the bottom would arrive in August. They estimate that U.S. gross domestic product will continue to contract in the first half of this year, with slow growth returning in the third quarter.

    Economists were divided over whether the $787 billion economic-stimulus package passed last month is enough. Some 43% said the U.S. will need another stimulus package on the order of nearly $500 billion. Others were skeptical of the need for stimulus at all.

    However, economists' main criticism of the Obama team centered on delays in enacting key parts of plans to rescue banks. "They overpromised and underdelivered," said Stephen Stanley of RBS Greenwich Capital. "Secretary Geithner scheduled a big speech and came out with just a vague blueprint. The uncertainty is hanging over everyone's head."

    Mr. Geithner unveiled the Obama administration's plans Feb. 10, but he offered few details, and stocks sank on the news. The Dow Jones Industrial Average is down almost 20% since the announcement, as multiple issues have weighed on investors' confidence. The Treasury secretary has since appeared before Congress and offered more specifics but has said action on key parts of the plan still is weeks away.

    "We have taken an unprecedented level of action toward economic recovery, accomplishing in weeks what took other countries years to do," Treasury spokesman Isaac Baker said. "While Wall Street and investors were disappointed when they didn't get a sweeping bank bailout, we've laid out a plan to stabilize the financial system while protecting the taxpayer and ensuring government funds are spent wisely. This crisis was years in the making, and it will take time to solve."

    Treasury has started implementing a housing-recovery plan, moved forward on a joint program with the Fed to boost consumer lending, and has begun stress-testing banks in an effort to determine which institutions will need additional capital from the government. The results of the stress tests won't be known for a few weeks. Meanwhile, a key part of the plan -- a public-private partnership to take toxic assets off bank balance sheets -- remains in the planning stages.

    The economists' negative ratings mark a turnaround in opinion. In December, before Mr. Obama took office, three-quarters of respondents said the incoming administration's economic team was better than the departing Bush team. However, Mr. Geithner's latest marks are lower than the average grade of 57 that former Treasury Secretary Henry Paulson received in January.

    Mr. Geithner, who is relying on a skeleton crew of advisers in the Treasury Department as the administration struggles to make key appointments to his staff, is encountering the same problems as his predecessor in dealing with the complexities of a bailout plan. Richard DeKaser of Woodley Park Research, who gave high marks to Messrs. Obama and Geithner, admitted disappointment in the delay in action but said he appreciated the magnitude of the task. "I don't know what's holding it up," he said. "But I'm assuming it's not just because they're hitting the golf course."

    There was widespread initial support for the appointment of Mr. Geithner, who as president of the New York Federal Reserve had been on the front lines of the crisis since it erupted. However, in the ensuing weeks Mr. Geithner has had to deal with tax troubles and criticism from those opposed to any bailouts as well as those who think the government needs to be doing more.

    Meanwhile, the economists surveyed this month predict that the economy will shed another 2.8 million jobs over the next 12 months as the unemployment rate climbs to 9.3% by December, up from the 8.1% rate recorded in February. Economists also see nearly a one-in-six chance that the U.S. will fall into a depression, defined as a decline in per-person GDP or consumption by 10% or more.

    "We just keep moving the date [when the recession will end] out, hoping at some point in time we will be able to move the date back in," said Diane Swonk of Mesirow Financial.

    The economists didn't just single out the U.S. for criticism; 70% of participants said the response of governments around the world to the global recession has been inadequate. "The Europeans or Japanese don't seem to be doing near enough to kickstart their economies," said Nariman Behravesh of IHS Global Insight. "It could be we've done all the right things, but the rest of the world goes down the tubes."

    Despite the growing criticism elsewhere, the respondents were broadly supportive of the Fed. More than 85% of the economists agreed that the central bank's proliferating lending programs are well-designed, well-executed and helping the economy. And while grades for Mr. Bernanke remain off of their 2007 highs, the average has stabilized after falling as low as 69 in the November survey.

    Amid all the gloom, there is a bright spot: Four-fifths of the economists said now is a good time to buy equities, especially if the investor has a long-term view.[/rquoter]
     
  2. fredred

    fredred Member

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    Amazing really, a few years ago, these same people were saying that 8 months in, Bush wasn't "responsible" for preventing 9/11.
    But after 50 days, Obama owns the recession...double standard anyone?
     
  3. El_Conquistador

    El_Conquistador King of the D&D, The Legend, #1 Ranking

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    Not a valid comparison. The difference is that Obama has announced a string of fiscal policy moves that have taken the market lower. The market's weakness is a direct result of their lack of confidence in Obama and his failed policies. But that's just the facts...
     
  4. vlaurelio

    vlaurelio Member

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    same thing, bush's laziness not reading his pdbs made america unsafer/weaker
     
  5. pgabriel

    pgabriel Educated Negro

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    we know it isn't a valid comparison because bush actually had intel to stop the attack. obama is in the midst of a wave that started when housing prices crashed in 07.
     
  6. El_Conquistador

    El_Conquistador King of the D&D, The Legend, #1 Ranking

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    Bill Clinton was offered Osama bin Laden on a silver platter by Sudan but declined the offer because he didn't think he had enough of a legal case to convict him. The libs have ZERO CRED in trying to pin 9-11 on Bush. Virtually all of the planning occurred on Clinton's watch as well, as he pu$$yfooted around on foreign policy.

    What's amazing is that despite this gaffe, some libs still think we should treat terrorists with five-diamond service in detention camps and not interrogate people. Talk about living in lala land.
     
    #26 El_Conquistador, Mar 13, 2009
    Last edited: Mar 13, 2009
  7. mc mark

    mc mark Member

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    The confidential President's Daily Brief (PDB) for August 6, 2001 contained a two-page section entitled "Bin Ladin Determined to Strike in US," and refers to possible hijacking attempts by Osama bin Laden disciples and the existence of about 70 FBI investigations into alleged al-Qaeda cells operating within the United States. The August 6 PDB, an excerpt from which you'll find below, was presented to Bush while he vacationed at his ranch in Crawford, Texas.
     
  8. pgabriel

    pgabriel Educated Negro

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    at least bill clinton looked at his intel and made a decision. for all we know bush was clearing brush on one of his many vacation days.


    edit: I promise I didn't read mc's post before typing that
     
  9. El_Conquistador

    El_Conquistador King of the D&D, The Legend, #1 Ranking

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    Crawford was fully equipped to be a functioning base for the entire staff. It was hardly a vacation. It's not like the guy was in Hawaii body surfing like Obama the craptastic novice.
     
  10. pgabriel

    pgabriel Educated Negro

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    bush ignored the burning brush, he should read his bible more often
     
  11. SamFisher

    SamFisher Member

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    Wow - that's actually a vast improvement from his previous survey numbers from this distinguished, unbiased panel assembled by the WSJ, (from daily kos)

    February 2008: 76% of the economists surveyed by the WSJ said they supported either McCain or Romney on economic policy over Obama or Clinton
    May 2008: 75% of these economists said they preferred McCain's fiscal policy to Obama's
    August 2008: 49% said the recession had already ended, and 50% believed the economy would be the same or better by election day.
    September 2008: 66% said they opposed any new stimulus plan
    December 2008: the economists predicted the unemployment rate would peak at 8.4%. It's already at 8.1% and rising.


    This distinguished panel of Hooverites is really good at filling out surveys.
     
  12. FranchiseBlade

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    I've pwnd you so many times on this. You are hilarious. It never happened.

    I asked you to bookmark this thread http://bbs.clutchfans.net/showthread.php?p=2096850#post2096850 because I knew you'd try and break it out again.

    Sure enough you did it.

    Here is the old post

    That came from this thread. It's hilarious that you bring it up again after you were busted on it, and even warned to bookmark the thread in case you had inclination to make the foolish accusation again.

    http://bbs.clutchfans.net/showthread.php?p=2096850#post2096850
     
  13. El_Conquistador

    El_Conquistador King of the D&D, The Legend, #1 Ranking

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    FranchiseBlade, how can you possibly argue with Clinton's own words which were provided to you? You simply can't -- no matter how much text and links you provide. It's all for naught -- Clinton ADMITS TO IT. Why can't you?
     
  14. FranchiseBlade

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    Clinton did not admit to it, and in the post which you were asked to bookmark, it mentions Clinton's only statement regarding Bin Laden.

    It's right there for you to read. You are lying when you say Clinton admitted it. You are wrong in what you claim Clinton said in the first place or lying again.

    Read the old thread or at least the post I put here, that you were supposed to bookmark, so as not to waste everyone's time and valuable space on Clutch's boards.

    Your comment shows that you didn't even read it, because Clinton's words are addressed in the old thread as well as the repost here.
     
  15. El_Conquistador

    El_Conquistador King of the D&D, The Legend, #1 Ranking

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    Sorry FranchiseBlade, that you think you can put words in Clinton's mouth to cover up words that Clinton has already spoken on the topic. You are in denial. Time for an intervention.
     
  16. FranchiseBlade

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    I used Clinton's exact quote, and provided context and evidence. You just made a false claim about what Clinton said.

    You've had your arse handed to you on this topic once again. Go ahead and keep trying to justify yourself if you think it will help. But you are really just bringing more attention to the fact that you've been repeatedly shamed on this topic. You may want to just crawl off, and hope people forget about it soon.
     

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