How many championships did Adelman's "team ball" Kings win? Zero? How many championships did Adelman's "team ball" Kings play for? Zero? I think you're confusing team ball championships with teams that happen to have several great/hall of fame players. The Showtime Lakers looked like team ball because they had three Hall of Fame players. When you think of championship and great basketball teams, how often do you think of non-Hall of Fame or All Star players? Great players make great teams. This isn't the movies. Little Ollie isn't coming of the bench to hit key free throws to win and take us to Indianapolis. The Cleveland Lebrons seem to be doing quite well relying on a star. Boston relies on three stars at least two who will probably make the Hall. Show us some examples of these mythical "team ball" champions where 6 players average 16 PPG.
I wish T-mac would buy into the the offense. It's painful to watch how the ball movement dies when he is on the court. Whatever benefit we get from him being on the court is reduced by taking others out of the offensive flow. No matter how much healing/rehab T-mac does, he will never be the athlete he once was, and it has to be easier to score moving without out the ball and coming off screens than from an iso outside the 3 pt line. Unless his kness limit him from making that movement, in which case his days as a high level player are over.
I think a lot of this argument has been two ships passing in the night. It's not a question of whether t-mac is a willing passer. The question is the CONTEXT of those passes. Is he passing to an open teamate while driving on an isolation play or passing to an open teamate in the context of the offense? Are we running the offense as a team and taking what the defense gives us or running the offense through tracy and taking what he creates? I think the OP's point (correct me if i'm wrong) is that when the offense revolves around T-mac isolation plays and pick and rolls, it is not operating at optimum efficiency (EVEN IF tracy leads the team in assists), whereas if we run the offense as if t-mac is just another option as opposed to the creator, we get better shots. I tend to agree for a few reasons. 1. T-mac should still get shots, he should just get them in the context of the offense as opposed to shots he has to work to create himself. If the offense is run well, as soon as he touches the ball he will have a couple steps advantage on a defender who is rotating toward him or following him around a screen (as opposed to one glued to him as would be the case on an isolation play). With t-mac's talent, he should be able to get EASIER shots and BETTER assisting opportunities by exploiting these advantages. Von Wafer is proof of this--a career benchwarmer has put up near all-star numbers by attacking with the opportunities rick's offense gives him. If t-mac, who is on a completely different level in terms of skill, does the same, the results could be phenomenal. 2. Involves teamates. Involving teamates isn't just "here, i got you the ball, now score" it's involving them in the flow and creation of offense itself. moving the ball from side to side to high post through passes or dribble handoffs and forcing the defense to move. The more the defense moves, the more opportunities you will have to score. Cutting lanes will open up. Low post position and passing angles et easier to find. The defense will make mistakes on backscreens and cuts and handoffs. This means easier shots for every player on the team--layups and open jumpers for guys who can't create those for themselves, and better scoring chances for the best scorers on the team. Here's an analogy: a good batter in baseball is patient, works the count, and fouls away pitches they don't want. Eventually the pitcher walks them, makes a mistake, or gives them a pitch they can hit. A good offense in basketball does something similar--probes, waits, moves, forces the opposition to adjust, until a GOOD opportunity presents itself. Beginning an offensive set with a t-mac isolation is like swinging for the fences on the first pitch, every time--even if you're as skilled as pujols (and t-mac is very, very skilled) it's a lower percentage percentage play than working the count. I don't think any reasonable person would argue that t-mac isn't a willing passer. That's not the point. The point is that his passing could be better used in the context of the offense Which is harder to cover as a defense--recovering to a shooter after a slowly devolping wing iso with no player movement outside of tracy, or recovering on a kick-out after t-mac gets the ball on a curl as the ball is swinging around the perimeter. Common sense--its the latter. That's why Adelman preaches ball movement. That's why every coach preaches ball movement. That's why your Junior Varsity coach demanded 5 passes before a shot. T-mac will still get shots, and he'll still get assists, he'll just get them in a more efficient way than an isolation play. So, to summarize, the question isn't "is t-mac willing to pass", because he obviously is. The question is this: Is t-mac willing to let go of the "i'm a superstar, i want the ball in my hands so i can make the plays" attitude toward the game and become a cog in the machine. Admittedly, this isn't natural for him--during all his time in orlando, and in houston under JVG, he didn't have the smart, skilled, weapons around him that he does now. He was asked to do everything himself. He HAD to have the ball in his hands to give the team a chance. It's different now. On this team, the most efficient shot isn't created by t-mac, its created by the offense taking what the defense gives them. If he realizes that, and doesn't take it as a slight to his ego, this team could be absolutely deadly. massive amounts of cool points to anyone who actually read through all of that...
Why 16 points? Why 6 players? You're just setting up arbitrary criteria for a bogus test. So far as team ball goes the Detroit Pistons team that beat Kobe/Shaq's Lakers is a perfect example.
damn let the man rest! hell he hasn't played in a game and yall still find a way to bring him down! damn yall need to get a life!
i'm sure tmac spends his free time reading clutchfans threads, especially this one. if you want, you can go to his house and rub his back for him and manicure his feet too. you can set an example for the clutchfans.
TMac controlling the ball, jacking up shots at will, and being the focal point of an offense if great on a losing team with no other options - since, at least five years ago, it was entertaining. But this team has lots of options and good offensive chemistry without Tmac. Same story as last year: TMac will have to tailor his game to fit into the team concept, not the other way around, 20 million a year or no 20 mill. Team comes first.
I am trying to figure out if you are serious or not, and why you are whining about Adelman as a coach. His teams have consistently gotten deep into the playoffs, sometimes you win, sometimes you lose, but if you are there in the final 4, you are a contender. I think you have no concept of what I am talking about. Every champion...EVERY SINGLE ONE...has played team ball. Do they have "Go to" guys...yes, but ultimately there are moments that are defined by each championship team along the way where a "ROLE PLAYER" stepped up and hit a crucial shot. That is team ball, trusting your teamates to hit the shot, or to create the shot late. Rick Adelman understands this as does anyone who has ever played the game of basketball, I am not sure why you do not. DD
DD how about, the role players move around a bit and not stay in the same spot waiting for tmac to do all the work and pass them the ball. Also, the role players hitting their shoots? I think we can compare this,to the year kobe wanted to be trade from the lakers. That season, Kobe have to do all the work,because his role player just can't get it done so kobe took it upon himself to carry his whole team but now his role player have step up and are able to do what they need to do, thats why lakers are winning and kobe passes the ball more as you can see if you ever watches the lakers game.
How did u expect us to get some any where from our last season players in the playoff? and without yao?
but what it's tmac suppose to do when they just stand around and waiting for him to do something, most of the time i watch tmac play, ralfer take the ball up court and hand it off to tmac and go to a corner and just stand there Also right now as everyone he play ****ty for whatever the reason, and he really didnt get back to 100% and run the complete offense yet.
Sweet Lou... Great post.... You have basically stated a handful and as Tinman has stated it was Phil Jackson who turned MJ and Kobe around. It got them to buy into the system and to get their teammates involved early and then they could do their thing in the 4th quarter. Now as you stated.. T-Mac started doing that late last year and early this year, you can see proof in the number of (almost) triple doubles and assist he's had this year. T_Man
My point was that there are no such well-balanced teams that have points spread evenly among a lot of guys. Detroit is the one team in the last 30 years that I can think of that won a championship without a Hall of Fame player. That to me sounds like the exception and not the rule. If superstars weren't required to win, then you'd think it would happen more than once every 30 years or so.
What makes me scratch my head with this post is that you seem to be implying t-mac doesn't do this. He does. I think the most obvious example was a year ago in Sac-town. We had been cruising through games during our 22 game streak, but struggled against Sacramento (Artest was on fire). The game was tied or we were down by 2...and t-mac had the ball with time about to expire. He drove...and then whipped a pass behind him to an open Steve Novack who drained the game winning 3 pointer. T-mac has done it over and over. Passing to Yao and other players for finishes. He makes this team better - and it was his return to a confident ROckets team that started us on that 22 game win streak. So it's there - t-mac does it...so I'm not sure what exactly you are talking about. He's not a selfish player. He's just a bit looney, and a bit wrapped up into his own world like most talented guys. Give him some slack, let him get himself right and let the man do his thing.
You also have to have a closer. Somone to take over and make teh shots at the end. Look at the Kings and their vaunted offense. When it came to crunch time they didn't know what to do. They needed someone to be willing to take the shots. The real problem is finding hte balance. If we become the Tracy McGrady show we're sunk. However if we don't utilize his talents I think our potential is limited.
That 22 game win streak had zero to do with T-Mac, or Yao, or any one individual player. It was all about chemistry and teamwork. There were any number of games in that streak where the stars stunk it up and the rest of the team carried the Rockets to victory.
