1. Welcome! Please take a few seconds to create your free account to post threads, make some friends, remove a few ads while surfing and much more. ClutchFans has been bringing fans together to talk Houston Sports since 1996. Join us!

[Sac Bee] Artest settled in nicely with Houston

Discussion in 'Houston Rockets: Game Action & Roster Moves' started by Carl Herrera, Dec 19, 2008.

  1. jVgOwnsYou

    jVgOwnsYou Member

    Joined:
    Oct 30, 2006
    Messages:
    3,595
    Likes Received:
    73
    Thats simply not true.

    First of all you dont lead by talking, you lead by your actions.

    Second of all, I've seen Yao tell players what to do when he needs to. He doesnt do it every play, but I see him do it when he has to. People dont respond well to "leaders" who just talk all the time. Sometimes the best leadership is by not leading at all.
     
  2. tycoonchip

    tycoonchip Member

    Joined:
    Dec 25, 1999
    Messages:
    7,194
    Likes Received:
    5,726
    Well it is about time. Hopefully this attitude rubs off on our two stars. He doesn't need to be the main man scoring on the floor but the vet presence and vocal leadership is something we've been lacking. I can't wait to see tmac ron and battier on the floor at the same time.
     
  3. leebigez

    leebigez Member

    Joined:
    Jun 24, 2001
    Messages:
    15,825
    Likes Received:
    796
    jvgownsyou- Yao nor tracy are leaders. Neither players are willing to demand a certain level of intensity in the game because neither plays with that intensity every night. Just like last yr when yao called the team soft then went out and grabbed 5 rebs. Leaders have something in their dna. That's why so guys work 30 yrs and collect a gold watch, while others start or run companies and retire early.
     
  4. waihh

    waihh Member

    Joined:
    Jul 28, 2003
    Messages:
    429
    Likes Received:
    41

    I beg to disagree. To me that's exactly why Ron is needed in here. Remember someone named JVG who often stated that we had enough to win when both Yao and TMac was down and we did not have Scola, Landry, Brooks.

    Though some teams really have superior talents, for most of the NBA, if everyone in your team practices and plays as hard as Ron Artest, Kobe Bryant, etc, you have a very good chance to win it all. I guess that's what Mr. Artest means. Motivation and hard working do matter!
     
  5. waihh

    waihh Member

    Joined:
    Jul 28, 2003
    Messages:
    429
    Likes Received:
    41

    You will need a lot of reasoning to trust Yao as your leader. No one will disagree that overall Yao has the highest efficiency in the team. That's why Shane the cool guy consistently take Yao as the leader as he never give up giving Yao the ball.

    But you need passion and fire to play good game in the court. Yao's pathetic plays, ie. loss of easy rebound, not able to receive a simple pass, get stolen in consecutive plays really frustrated teammates sometimes. In those situations one can not slow down and reason and continue to trust Yao as the leader. A leader does not need to be the best player, but he cannot be the most frustrating one in prolonged period of the game either. So Yao can not be the leader.
     
  6. jVgOwnsYou

    jVgOwnsYou Member

    Joined:
    Oct 30, 2006
    Messages:
    3,595
    Likes Received:
    73
    Yao has more than enough fire and passion. You don't move to a new country, new culture, new language just because you can. He has a passion for the game that rivals anyone in the league.
     
  7. jVgOwnsYou

    jVgOwnsYou Member

    Joined:
    Oct 30, 2006
    Messages:
    3,595
    Likes Received:
    73
    Leadership is a learned trait. Its social. Anything social is learned and not part of one's DNA.
     
  8. badgerfan

    badgerfan Member

    Joined:
    Dec 17, 2007
    Messages:
    3,974
    Likes Received:
    3
    I don't think anyone's questioning Yao's heart or his commitment. To the extent that you can lead by example he will.

    But the leadership that Artest provides is of a different cloth altogether. I'm very happy that Ron Ron's in Houston.
     
  9. jVgOwnsYou

    jVgOwnsYou Member

    Joined:
    Oct 30, 2006
    Messages:
    3,595
    Likes Received:
    73
    So am i. It takes a good mix, and Artest is part of the equation. His confidence and his aggressiveness really add a nice element to the team. But that is only a few aspects of leadership. Yao exhibits leadership qualities that are more unique in the NBA. His unselfishness, his humility, his desire to share success with others. That is a pretty rare quality for star players in the NBA.
     
  10. jVgOwnsYou

    jVgOwnsYou Member

    Joined:
    Oct 30, 2006
    Messages:
    3,595
    Likes Received:
    73
    I you get frustrated by Yao's play more than any of our other players, you may want to lower your standards a bit. He is consistantly the top performer on the team.

    His rebounding will never be on par with a KG or Howard, or even a tim duncan, but he more than makes up for that in other areas of his game. We just need to surround him with active players like Scola, Landry, Hayes and that should about take care of his rebounding issues.

    10 rebounds a game? What a loser.
     
  11. Dave_78

    Dave_78 Member

    Joined:
    Oct 12, 2006
    Messages:
    10,809
    Likes Received:
    373
    You lead by both. You can play your behind off every night but if you don't talk to other players they might think you're a great player but they are not going to duplicate your effort unless you challenge them to do so. On the other hand, you can talk all you want but if you can't put the ball in the hoop or keep your guy from dropping 30 on you then nobody is going to listen no matter how insightful you are.
     
  12. Baqui99

    Baqui99 Member

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2000
    Messages:
    11,495
    Likes Received:
    1,231
    The city is extremely dead. It's up there with Salt Lake City for worst NBA destinations.

    The best selling point for the city is the proximity to Lake Tahoe. If you're into skiing or waterskiing, then it's only like an hour away. So that's pretty good. Also, apparently the river through there is a pretty cool place to go tubing during the summer time. I have some friends that went to Davis, and it's not too far away, as well.
     
  13. dachuda86

    dachuda86 Member

    Joined:
    May 3, 2008
    Messages:
    16,325
    Likes Received:
    3,586
    different players LEAD at different times... personally I like when Battier leads the team's work ethic and brains, Barry the teams humor, Mac the will power, Yao the honor, Brooks the energy, and Artest the crazy.
     
  14. dachuda86

    dachuda86 Member

    Joined:
    May 3, 2008
    Messages:
    16,325
    Likes Received:
    3,586
    rafer for aggression too... :/
     
  15. jVgOwnsYou

    jVgOwnsYou Member

    Joined:
    Oct 30, 2006
    Messages:
    3,595
    Likes Received:
    73
    True. I'm led to believe that it is the coach's job to lead by speaking. Best way for players to lead is by their actions on the court. Unfortunately, not all coaches have the respect from their players, so they respond better to a team mate telling them what to do.

    You have a good point. Theres a balance there, and maybe Yao could be more vocal to be a complete leader. Personally, I've seen him speak up during games when he has had to. He is alot more vocal on the court now even with referees.
     
  16. fmp087

    fmp087 Member

    Joined:
    Nov 18, 2007
    Messages:
    1,479
    Likes Received:
    75
    Yao leads by example which is sometimes not always the best thing. Mutombo does not lead by example, but he's a vocal leader. He probably had a bigger influence on the team then did Yao. Also, Yao can not win ball games without Tmac or Artest in the lineup, the Win/Losses speak for themselves (without Tmac and without Yao).
     
  17. leebigez

    leebigez Member

    Joined:
    Jun 24, 2001
    Messages:
    15,825
    Likes Received:
    796
    JVG- Leaders are born leaders and to some extent guys do learn at a early age to lead. When has Yao ever been taught to lead? Some guys have different leadership skills, but if you're a leader, you have to be accountable as much as u want other players and that's where your play comes into it. U think yao can get on scola or landry about playing strong and tough when he plays soft a lot? The same high expectations u have for your teammates, you have to have for yourself and act accordingly. If someone doesn't close out on a shooter, yao nor tracy can say much because they don't do it. Can has at least shown he can lead a team to the playoffs no matter how flawed he is physically and mentally. Actions do speak load, but I think artest is probably the only 1 out the 3 that brings it all the time and competes every posession. He may not make every shot, but he competes every posession.
     
  18. jVgOwnsYou

    jVgOwnsYou Member

    Joined:
    Oct 30, 2006
    Messages:
    3,595
    Likes Received:
    73
    Mutumbo is the ultimate leader by example....He's 56 years old and in great shape. When you look at his career you cant question him at all. you just have to follow his lead.
     
  19. jVgOwnsYou

    jVgOwnsYou Member

    Joined:
    Oct 30, 2006
    Messages:
    3,595
    Likes Received:
    73
    Yeh Yao never had to learn how to lead. He's just the most looked up to athlete in the biggest country of the world.
     
  20. KingCheetah

    KingCheetah Atomic Playboy
    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Jun 3, 2002
    Messages:
    59,079
    Likes Received:
    52,748
    You have to be careful tubing the river there...

    [​IMG]
     

Share This Page

  • About ClutchFans

    Since 1996, ClutchFans has been loud and proud covering the Houston Rockets, helping set an industry standard for team fan sites. The forums have been a home for Houston sports fans as well as basketball fanatics around the globe.

  • Support ClutchFans!

    If you find that ClutchFans is a valuable resource for you, please consider becoming a Supporting Member. Supporting Members can upload photos and attachments directly to their posts, customize their user title and more. Gold Supporters see zero ads!


    Upgrade Now