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Should Yao start attacking the double team?

Discussion in 'Houston Rockets: Game Action & Roster Moves' started by devin23, Dec 1, 2008.

  1. devin23

    devin23 Member

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    Many recent game is showing he is passing out of every double team. Should yao start attacking some of the double team to change up the opponent's defense? I've seen him do that last year, like that facial against 2 Dallas opponents. Would like to see him do that again.
     
  2. bushbush1988

    bushbush1988 Member

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    um....the point of double team is that u can't attack anymore. Maybe on the perimeter u can split the trap sometimes, but on the post, it's almost impossible.

    if yao tries to dribble through 2 players, it's 90% turnover, 9% jumpball, 1% score....
     
  3. Spacemoth

    Spacemoth Member

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    The problem isn't passing out of the double team, it's him catching the ball and already looking to pass before the double team even comes. He needs to be much more aggressive with the ball, right now it looks like he has no confidence in any of his post moves besides his baseline spin fadeaway jumper, which frankly was a last resort even for Hakeem the one that made it famous.

    Right now Yao is a shell of the player he used to be, and it probably has to do with his rustiness coming back from injury, but it's got to improve for us to go anywhere. Everything is off for him: his post moves, his confidence in his shot (which actually did come back the last couple games), and especially the speed on his kickout passes, something everyone seems to overlook. Most of his passes are so slow that the entire defense has reacted and rotated completely by the time the outside man catches it. On a few occasions they've even had to lunge backwards to try to catch it since the arc was so high. Someone needs to straighten him up on that crap since it's easily correctable.
     
  4. BruceHR

    BruceHR Member

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    With Tmac absent recent few games, our offense was linked by Yao, Yao in the center gives opponents much pressure, smooth offense like vs Spurs at home, that's we need, while last game vs Nuggets, back to back and high altitude both puzzled Yao. Yao missed a lot, 18 pts on the stat seems not to bad, but problems still exist.

    I will never say Yao is our concer of this team, we only need is Battier, if he played last night, can Chauncey Billups got so many pts?
     
  5. devin23

    devin23 Member

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    You make a good point. The problem also is that if yao passes the ball out, the perimeter players often take too long to take an open shoot and have a hard time reposting yao due to fronting and then start jacking up shots. I actually like to see yao take more turn around jumper without dribbling the ball. That way double teams won't have the time to come as fast.
     
  6. HeWhoIsLunchbox

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    As much as people say a good center is the anchor of a defense, Battier is the true anchor of our defense. His effort and intelligence makes everyone around him a better defender. That being said, Chauncey made some tough contested 3's that, no matter who was guarding him, he would've hit no matter what. But we would've been better in limiting JR Smith, Martin, and Nene.
     
  7. Invisible Fan

    Invisible Fan Member

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    Yao wimps out after he notices he isn't getting calls from the other team hacking him.

    This is why Shaq b****ed and moaned about hard treatment, so he could play through double teams and earn foul shots. It would also help if Yao was a bit dirty too.
     
  8. BruceHR

    BruceHR Member

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    well, Chauncey Billups was a good PG, while you see our PG, Alston and AB, AB preformed much better than RA, not RA only, our benches played much better than our starters, just as Yao said, starters should apologizes to benches. In the 4th qtr, our benches helped us to down only 5 pts, we even see the chance of winning, but later several turnovers buried it.

    You said was right, Battier is good defender, around him all can be good defenders, that is why I always reguard Battier as our leader, not Yao, Tmac,Ron. Even Battier's offense is not so good..
     
  9. DOHCtah

    DOHCtah Member

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    sure if he wants more turnovers
     
  10. DOHCtah

    DOHCtah Member

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    along with ignoring the open man on the kickout+swing.. but then again Rafer can't shoot anyways..
     
  11. ekim

    ekim Member

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    Yao can't attack the double team because hes got soft hand (good for shooting the ball). He will lose the ball when the defenders start hacking him.
     
  12. TracyMcGreat

    TracyMcGreat Member

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    he should be dirty. didn't he push the gay birdman last night? but yao should definitely play dirty. he's gets punk by the like of Howard.
     
  13. el_locoteee

    el_locoteee Member

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    Thats one think I want him to do. use the elbow.

    He, not intentional, have hit a few player with his elbows and have not been pretty for the one getting hit.

    If ref don't blow the whistle, he need to get someone hurt, then the mentality change.

    Mutombo have bad hands but nobody wants to get close to does elbows to slap the ball.
     
  14. dexkk

    dexkk Member

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    Well, Yao did fine against double teams last two seasons. When I say fine, I mean he was able to score against double teams. The Yao today, I'm not sure because he's showing signs of huge decline in his plays. As much as Yao Haters annoy me, a lot of their criticism is warranted. However, last season, he was a steady 22-10 guy with lots of consistency.

    This season, there could be major factors contributing to his decline.

    1. Re-adapting to Adelman's system.
    2. Adjustment to the roster => building team chemistry. This probably factors in for all of our big 3 (Artest, Yao, Mac).
    3. Age and years of injury taking its toll.
    4. Recovering from his surgery. Remember, being healthy just means that the surgery was successful. Is he in game-shape? We all knew he had no hops but this season his vertical sucks even for his standards.


    As a Rockets fan, you have to hope that by the end of the year, all of our bigs 3s have figured it out and are completely healthy and in game-shape. The team chemistry will come with time, we can't expect what happened in Boston to happen here.
     
  15. London'sBurning

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    Superstars fight through double teams and take over when necessary. Just because a star player gets double teamed still means they can split the double team and get their own shot.
     
  16. leebigez

    leebigez Member

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    To the general fan, watching yao pass out the double is the correct thing to do, but if you know basketball, he's not making the correct basketball play.

    Listen up because I don't want people thinking I'm bashing the guy. Aggressive players know when and where to attack doubles in the post. Some doubles are just used to make a passive player play passive. When attacking double teams, its not attacking the double, its isolating 1 player and attcking his shoulder. When Yao decides he wants to be aggressive, double teams will only matter when executed with 2 tall players over 6'10 which rarely happens. He can counter theses doubles by using making his move quick and being aggressive. Instead of waiting, if he gets the ball and get into his offensive move, its too late. If the double comes small from the topside, he can use the step thru move and use the jump hook or step thru with a hop step to get a little seperation from a defender to get his shot off. Once they really crowd him topside, he can turn baseline. If they double baseline, then he can take the 2-step cross the lane Patrick Ewing shot.

    There are many ways to attack the soft doubles they send at Yao. They double Yao because he lacks aggression at times and he's not a quick decision maker nor good passer. Other teams know this and use it against him. Passing the ball out for a 23'9 shot isn't always the best basketball move when you're 6 ft from the basket.
     
  17. rocketsjudoka

    rocketsjudoka Member

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    A good post and there are smart ways Yao can attack double teams. I think he is still recovering from his injury and we will see him doing some of those things that you are talking about. Right now though the rest of the Rox could nullify the need for Yao to attack the double team by hitting outside shots more consistently and forcing the D to come out instead of collapsing.
     
  18. freemaniam

    freemaniam 我是自由人

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    Some astute observations here.

    Yao's anticipation of double team on the court has almost come to the level of annoyance to me. He kicked out the ball way too often now even when he has established good position down low. CCR's Yao-touch reports would have shown the trend.

    Watching the change of Yao's game downlow is actually worrisome. He said after last season that his shoulder may need surgery next summer. He felt pain when he raised his arm. If this is part of the reasons for the reduction of his shot attempts, we are having a serious problem here.

    People still double-teaming Yao due to his "reputation". When the league eventually recognizes that Yao will never get back to his pre-injury form again, the games will be very difficult for us.
     
  19. BlakeB

    BlakeB Member

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    While I can't sit here and argue that Yao's production is down and needs to improve, I don't really think it's fair to say he is a "shell" of his former self. Stevie Franchise is a shell of his former self, Yao is just off to a slow start in what may ultimately be an off year. His slow start could be because of on going recovery from injury, his need to build momentum and chemistry with a team featuring quite a few new faces, having to find his niche in a system he has played relatively little in (due to missing most of last year) or, what I think is the problem, a slight combination of all those things. Regardless... when this season is over, if Yao has had an off year, it doesn't necessarily mean he's on the decline.

    What's really important this season, is if the Rockets can make it deep into the playoffs and really contend. With the team the Rockets have they must get out of the first round, and I think they finally will, even if Yao continues to play down from his normal level. If Yao can play the way he has been and the Rockets get to the WCF, NBA Finals, or win a title... frankly, I'll take it to him scoring 25/12 or whatever.

    Ultimately though, I think Yao's production will improve as the team continues to find its groove. Pencil in his absence for 10 games or so, sure, but as the team plays more and more games together I think we'll see Yao, Mac, and Artest all find their rhythm-perhaps each statistically down from their past avgs., but all 3 functioning better in the system than we've seen; each picking up the other players' slack where necessary.

    Finally, Yao should attack the double team... but only within reason. Most of the time a double team calls for Yao to kick it out to an open teammate, and rightfully so as a) Yao is pretty good at passing and b) due to his size and cumbersome speed its easy for him to be overwhelmed by smaller, quicker defenders when they attack in tandem. His being prone to turnovers when doubled by faster defenders is an unavoidable weakness you deal with when you utilize a big inside player like Yao. With such a talented roster and a center everyone is forced to double; passing, ball movement, and finding the open man is an important part of Adelman's system. Thus, continued focus on countering the double team thru passing is something this team must do, and do well, to be successful-especially considering the stars we have and the double teams they constantly see.
     
  20. t_mac1

    t_mac1 Member

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    he just has to make quick decisions when he does get the ball. he takes so long to process his thought and doing what he wants to do.

    i think before he gets the ball, he needs to check the defense, see how he's been covered, and attack QUICKLY or make a quicker play.

    when he holds the ball like he did, it just really kills the flow of the offense and really wastes valuable time off the shot clock.
     

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