If Marbury is bought out, would you take a look?

Alright smart guy show me exactly where I mentioned anything about what Ainge did this season. It has nothing to do with this discussion.

And it cracks me up how folks like you want to pretend that CD was this fantastically successful GM when the results say otherwise. But maybe if I were to say to myself "CD was the greatest" enough times, I'd start to believe it also. And if I'm so wrong, then show me where are all the players he picked up during the lotto years - show me what's he's done since 2000 to build the Rockets into this Western Conference powerhouse. If you want to blame JVG for what's wrong that's your right. But JVG wasn't here in 2001 when CD was butchering the draft and he wasn't around in the late 90's after the championship runs when things went steadily south under CD's "leadership" either.

Trashing the team? Hardly. This team is what it is. Trashing the incompetent and clueless management and ownership? You betcha because they deserve to be ripped. Your great CD left Morey a real mess to clean up and it will be 2010 before he'll be able to actually get something done. But hey: If you want to pretend that this is a championship-caliber team then by all means be my guest. You are entitled to your opinion just as I am to mine - only unlike yourself, I won't engage in fan "purity tests" when I see an opinion that differs from my own.

 

True statement except for the CD part. He's been gloaming the credit that belongs to Patterson for years now.

Dude, I knew Hakeem when he was still at UH. I knew Rudy T, Mike Newlin & Robert Reed when they were wearing the funny short shorts playing pickup games at the Wheeler Ave YMCA. I watched Mose Malone play pickup ball at the Fonde. Where you back then? And I am not the least bit interested in having CD explain to me how you can be in all of those NBA lottos only to have 1 player to show for it all.

 

Then your opinion is dead wrong because I have never taken any shots at Rudy T nor will I ever will. You are reading something that I'm not posting. If you want to honor CD's years of service to the Rockets and use that to excuse his incompetence the by all means be my guest. But if you want to link the two together, then fine let's do so. In that vein, my position is very clear and this is directed at Les Alexander: if you can show the only coach to lead your franchise to two NBA titles the door, then CD's ass should have been the next one out that very same door. Rudy T fell on his sword for you and this franchise which is FAR more than what CD ever did.

 

Yeah I was at UofH with Dream, yeah I saw Moses at Fonde (not against Dream though...) but the first time I went to Fonde was to see E before the Rox moved to Houston at an NBA promo-type deal. I was seven so I have no idea what I was wearing but seeing E in anything but Cougar gear was pretty traumatic.

Back to topic: Rudy has said a hundred times he'd have never taken the head-coaching job had CD not been relentless convincing him to do so (I presume you know why CD turned it down). CD & Rudy were the reason Dream didn't leave Houston (his contract was still a joke, oh sorry 'tweren't Les' fault, just a different bad owner).

Go to any quote from Rudy, Dream, Moses or Patterson that didn't say CD was not integral and not a driving force for both Dream's development and his staying here.

It's fine to complain about decisions he made but you make it sound like we're a crap franchise because of him and that's just how you roll.

I'm proud of this franchise and you're not the only one around here that is frustrated, but you're stomping on hallowed ground. You're just lucky tinman's not five years older...

 

OK, now you are reaching. This is beside the point. A team that goes into the NBA lotto that many times in such a short period SHOULD have SOMETHING to show for all of that losing (unless they are the Clippers) and yet, under CD, that's exactly what has happened here. What's worse, these players are the ones who should be forming the backbone of your team yet under CD, all we got was an endless parade of guys named Herb.

See my sig. All the better so he could to pass the blame around without taking responsibility for his actions.

How right you are. Only now it's now Morey's job to clean up the mess that CD left behind only with no CAP or wiggle room to speak of. I'm sure he thanks him everyday for the nice cushy CD left behind.

Hmm, so the Rockets' & CD's lack of success in finding talented players was due to their being forced to "guess" on low lotto picks or late 1st round picks so you say. And it had nothing to do at all with their (and his) inability to scout and find talented ball players no matter where they were drafting. And yet, Detroit can find a Tayshaun Prince at 22, Dallas can find a pre-doobie Howard at 29 and let's not even look at what the team you love to hate (Spurs) has managed to do with its non lotto picks.

No, like it or not - accept it or not - it all boils down to the quality and competence of the organization in question and of those in charge. And on that note, CD, Les and the rest have done a lousy job. You can sugarcoat it any way you want to but under their leadership and management, this is a franchise that has been quietly drifting along content to watch the other teams in the West make significant efforts to win championships. That's why I totally understand the frustration of guys like Gater, Solid & Leebigez because this can be absolutely maddening to watch. It's only because I've been following the team since their arrival from San Diego that I can tolerate the prolonged drifting as I've seen it all before and no doubt will see it again.

 

Don't get me started about Elvin. I still smart over his leaving for the Bullets.

CD had health problems which is why he didn't take the job. And say what you will about Charlie Thomas but he stepped up and kept this team in Houston when no one else would. And he let Steve Patterson build a championship team. All Les did was reap the benefits of Patterson's good work and then look the other way for 12 years while CD struggled to find a clue. So yeah, that WAS Les' fault.

Again, show me where I've called the Rockets a "crap" franchise. I may have said that CD was a "crap" GM or that CD did a "crappy" job as the GM but I never called them (Rox) crap (although I may have said something to that effect about the Mavericks). At any rate, if you guys want to make believe that CD was this giant of a GM who did all that he could to win only to be twarted by the ineptness of his coaching staff, then by all means go right ahead and pretend away. But if being critical of this doofus for the lousy job he did is your idea of stomping on "hallowed" ground, then I suggest that you strongly consider another definition of what hallowed ground actually means because in my book rewarding incompetence doesn't fit the bill.

 

^5

CD wasn't bad at all, but neither was he outstanding. I thought he brought in some good players, you mentioned some above and he also got us SF (as rookie) and T-Mac. I guess I can give him credit for the Shane trade, as well as the Barkley one, too.

 

unlike most, i respected CD. i thought he did a great job for the most part.

i mean, i dont think morey has been spectacularly better than CD b/c we're in the same position as we were.

 

DO NOT WANT

 

And that brings up another bad CD trait: Even on those occasions where he did bring in players, he ended up trading them off leaving the Rox with nothing to show for it. And you can add Kenny Thomas to that list. Both Othella & Dickerson are out of the league now but the other players are still playing in the league. And to be nice, I won't discuss what he did with Moochie. Only the Mobley trade has yielded a player (TMac) who is still with the team while the rest of the guys that CD traded them for are long gone from here. So the net result is still a big zero even with TMac being considered to be a "superstar".

Youwill note that in spite of the so-called "superb" management by CD, upon taking over, the first thing Morey did was to begin the arduous process of completely retooling the roster beginning with getting this team a bonafide PF who could actually play.

Now you know good and well that they never intended to take JayWill at all so that's a nonissue. Yes, it is an inexact science and everyone makes mistakes. But here it seems that folks have been too willing to accept the stuck-in-the-middle, going nowhere status quo that Les and his boyz have been selling for over 12 years now. Ask yourself a question: why is it that teams like the Lakers or Boston or even your favorite Texas team (the Spurs) have the championships to show for their science experiments while the Rockets do not? Have you never wondered what separates this franchise from them? This is a franchise that has seen its share of talented players throughout its history and yet it could never quite get it right - it was either problems with coaching or management or players or a combination of the three - that always held them (Rox) back.

But wonder of wonders, they finally get it right: the coach (Rudy T), the players (Hakeem, Smith, Cassell, Elie, Clyde) and the management (Patterson) and they win not once but twice! And what did CD & Les do? Did they build on this success? Did they use those championships to establish a winning organization? Did they get us back to the top again? No, no and NO. Instead, they presided over the long slow demise of that proud chapter in Houston Sports history until today, that one shining moment has faded away into the past. All I'm saying is that this was far too high a price for this franchise to pay for keeping CD around simply because he was a nice guy.

 

I would love to add Marbury along with T-Mac and YaoCOLOR=Lime

 

HELL TO THE NO!

I don't think I need to add anything about Marbury. He's a quitter and whiner plain and simple, he makes Francis look like a saint compared to him! And for those that say Francis is done or is worse than Marbury, get the hell out of here. Marbury went to the playoffs more, he had KG in Minny. And he was in the East with NJ while Steve was in the hardcore West without much support outside of the Cat until Yao arrived.

Francis isn't done, using that horrible logic for someone that has an injury you might as well say Yao is done, or that Amare was done after his knee problems, or Grant Hill was done after his ankle injury in Orlando and this may sound Fan boyish but he's going to take Alston's starting job and make us wonder why we were wasting our time making "Which PG should we try and nab!?" threads.

 

Oh, no
take him as faraway as possible

 

With the reputation he's getting around the league is there a legit reason for Houston to get him?

Most of you know the answer already, let's move on.