Yes, this argument can always be brought up until the end of time, and noone will be able to dispute it. But in order to enjoy and discuss professional sports, let's face it, there's just certain things you have to ignore. Otherwise when Karl Malone and John Stockton lose in the finals, knowing it could be there last chance to ever win, what are we going to say, "ah, no big deal, they're still making a lot of money." Not a good example since everyone here hates those two guys, but the "look how much money they're making argument" can pretty much be used in any case to completely wipe out any sort of drama or emotional situation in professional sports. And you're right, noone can truly feel sorry for him with all the money he makes, but I don't think by you bringing it up, you really are surprising anyone or changing anyone's mind. This is kind of good example of the same thing. When all the sport reporters were complaining about BCS stuff a couple months ago, some holier-than-thou writer wrote some article that went a little something like this: "I can't understand why people spend so much time arguing about this issue. Sometimes you just have to accept things and move one. Its seems so trivial to be obsessing over sports, when there's so many other more important things going on in the world." To me, this is just another example of someone trying to negate the obsession people have with discussing and following sports. I mean is anybody going to really argue that what the guy said isn't true? Of course not! It's the truth! Sports do not matter that much! But the simple truth is that people discuss and argue about sports because its FUN!!! I mean if you think that every single player in sports is just doing it for the money, and cannot feel any thread of emotion for them because of it. Then what's the point? Why even follow professional sports? Sorry if I didn't make any sense. I tried my best.
I get what you mean DC Kid...and I'm sure you also know what I mean. Jacksons situation is different also in that no one gave him a chance...he was playing in Europe and, being in his mid 20's, it was highly unlikely he'd ever get a chance in the NBA. Golden State gave him that chance...and 24 m to go with it. For that, they deserve whatever they can get out of him...be it playing wise, or as trade bait. That's why they 'invested' 24M. The guy just comes across as a w$nker. If someone wants to give me $24m and a chance i'd never have otherwise got, I should wouldn't be abusing them a few months later for looking out for themselves. And Joe Joe...yes he DID have a choice to play elsewhere. He could have gone back to Europe and still earnt a million a season...but hey, he wanted the really big money. Fair enough...but the reverse of that is that he became Golden States asset. How they treat him is up to them...no one forced him to sign.
Imagine if you will that you are on a team that you're not happy with. So you decide that you're going to go elsewhere, but in order to do so, you have to get a high valued contract, because the team you're currently with wil match any other offer. Well that was Jackson's dilemna over last summer. Jackson did not want to play for the Warriors, that he is why he asked St. Jean not to match the offer because he did not want to play there. The Rockets feeling that Jackson was worthy of a 6 year, $24 million dollar contract figured thay got the center they needed. The Warriors matched the offer only because they didn't want to lose Jackson and get no compensation in return. It was a business decision. However, Jackson knew he was just trade bait, so he knew he wasn't going to be a big part of the team. I mean how can he go and work his ass off and try to be in the offensive and defensive schemes knowing that in 90 days or more that he may be on another team. He was pretty much a lameduck, and no matter how much you're paid, you're not gonna perform as well when you're a lameduck. As for Jackson possibly going back overseas, who are you kidding. Thats like asking the guy with the jumbo, high definition big screen TV to go back to wathcing his little black and white portable TV. Jackson wanted to be in the NBA, just like all those guys working their tails off in the NBDL, and the guys in college. He paid his dues overseas, and was coming off a great year with the Warriors, he would've been a great pickup for any team. However, he was a FA at the wrong time, especially with the Luxury Tax. Now he is the guy at the very end of the bench, and only gets PT in blowouts or trash time. The guy has a right to be bitter and pissed off. To act unprofessionally and call out your team and GM that way, thats a little too far. The point is that no matter how much money you make, if you don't like your situation, or the people you work for, no amount of money, not even $6 million a year is going to make you happy. Sorry I still believe money doesn't buy happiness. Jackson is in a bad situation, I don't feel bad for him, but I know where he's coming from.
That's such bull****. I suppose you thought the Knights should have benched Roy Hobbs in "The Natural." Not that Jackson is a Roy Hobbs, but the same principle applies. The Warriors are abusing the system. Players shouldn't be simply treated as commodities.
In an ideal world, sure. Unfortunately, the NBA is a business, and one in which the players are the commodities, like it or not. I personally wouldn't have any complaints if the Warriors had let Jackson go to the Rockets, or traded him for a bag of pretzels to the team of his choice. But I'm not going to criticize them for being just as businesslike as everyone else involved. Seriously, are you really naive enough to think Jackson's tirade was a heartfelt cry for freedom? If so, it's time for you to wake up and smell the proverbial coffee. Golden State did not refuse to trade Jackson -- they simply had the temerity to tell Phoenix, three weeks before the trade deadline, that they felt they could get a better deal than what the Suns were offering. This is not exactly a shocking stance during negotiations. But Phoenix, not wanting to boost its offer or to lose its chance at Jackson, decided to play hardball. So they held an unprecedented press conference to announce that their offer -- again, three weeks before the trade deadline -- had not been accepted, thereby cueing Jackson (whose agent had been in touch with Phoenix's GM) to throw his tantrum for reporters in the locker room. In short, the Suns and Marc Jackson staged their public statements in the hope that they would lower Jackson's trade value to where the Phoenix offer was the best the Warriors could get. Who knows? Maybe if they were lucky, outside observers would blame the Warriors, calling them unethical and abusive for not giving in to the Suns' blackmail. Seems to have worked with regard to some posters on this BBS.
Your argument fails internally. If the Phoenix offer is inferior to others GS can get, then he would be traded regardless. If this is not true, then the Phoenix offer was the best they could get. Incidentally, how can you excuse the Warriors for playing hard ball, and accuse Jackson of doing the exact same thing? Not letting someone play after retaining them against their will is slimey. I can't see how you can deny that.
Swopa, a lot of the people hear understand why they kept him. It's a business, you don't give away a player if someone else needs him more than you do. 1) GS gave Dampier the starting spot. Apparently, Jackson wasn't intent on taking jumpshots for Jamison to work the post. I suppose Dampier is opening the floor up with his jump-shooting huh? I highly doubt it. Swopa, the Warriors are horrible put together. They can hope to trade a couple of players for a couple of picks, and let a few contracts run out. But right now, it seems you're best 4/5 combination is Jackson/Jamison. They played that way last year, and that's not why you lost, because they both played admirably. If you want 2 players working the post, why not Jackson and Jamison? Your SF can play perimeter. Dampier and Foyle have shown what they have, alll-be-it in flashes, we know their maximum capabilities. hat Jackson showed last year was better than those flashes, and we haven't seen the best. He can improve on it. So basically: 1) Gave the starting spot to Dampier. Often injured, and a dissapointment for the past couple of years. While Jackson, who earned starter's minutes, is the backup. That's a confidence killer. The reason he asked to be moved to the teams on his list is because he wants playing time. No C in this league demands a trade to LA or SA do they? Because you go where the time is if that's what u care about. 2) Re-sign him against his will, and plan to bench him, aste a YEAR of his career, to get a better deal. If it's a business, then this is bad PR.
"And Joe Joe...yes he DID have a choice to play elsewhere. He could have gone back to Europe and still earnt a million a season...but hey, he wanted the really big money. " I don't he could. I think they could match a deal he signed with a team in another country becauser the NBA and other leagues usually honor other team's contracts and rights. Not positive on this. Going to Europe is not an option as the NBA has no teams in Europe. Jackson, to my knowledge wants to play NBA basketball. Europe has different rules and thus isn't the same. The US is suppose to be the land of the opportunity. GS did what any team would do if they were at that point. Whether other teams play hardball as tough as GS is another story. I just say it sucks to be in his position. He was a restricted FA at a time in which other teams couldn't give him market value. You can whine all you want about him making 24 mil, but that is still less than he's worth in a capitalist market. As long as you have an oligarchy and people willing to spend X dollars for admission, NBA players will make millions.
I don't see what you're saying here. There's still more than a week before the trading deadline, so it's entirely possible that Jackson will be dealt. If it's for a better package than the Suns' offer, then GS has done the smart thing and been aboveboard with all parties. If they wait until October but still get a better deal, then they're kind of putting the screws to Jackson, but at least they're acting in their best interest & Jax is still getting paid. If the Suns get him next week, then what was all the b****ing about? The Warriors don't have a right to shop around for the best deal? The only way this is a fiasco for GS, in my opinion, is if they hold on to Jackson and still wind up getting crap for him -- which, I might add, is a legitimate risk. GMs have been known to drop bogus hints of future deals just to mess up a trade that might help a competitor, and if St. Jean lets himself get snowed that way, I won't defend him. Really, I don't. Complaining or misbehaving to hasten a trade is a time-honored NBA tradition, and it's a risk the Warriors had to aware of when they matched the Rockets' offer. One tantrum is probably right at the over/under for this situation. I've weighed in on this before. Jackson was undeniably out of shape when the season started, got minutes when Dampier was out, and didn't play well enough to demand further minutes. (Note to Sane: Your analysis of Dampier/Foyle overlooks the fact that they provide much more defensively, which is essential because Fortson and Jamison don't offer much on that end. If GS had a stud defender or shot-blocker at PF, it would be easier for them to play Jackson more.) Also, don't overlook the possibility (likelihood?) that Jackson isn't being played because GS does plan to make a deal, and doesn't want him to wreck it by getting hurt. Winters specifically said when Jackson fell out of the rotation that "I'm going to play the guys who are going to be here" -- a strong hint that Jackson's departure will be sooner rather than later.
Come on. Everything GS ever does is a fiasco . But really, even if they get a player or a pick from a Marc Jackson trade, will they use it to make the team better any time in the next 5 to 10 years? Doubtful (I am being sarcastic here as no one can predict the future, but then again it isnt all the unlikely that they continue to suck for a long time - i mean I wont call Jamison a bust cause I like him as a person, but lets just say GS definitely got the short end of that). That being the case, they were probably better off avoiding the whole fiasco. Not that Marc Jackson is right either. Both groups are doing what they think are in their best interests, but I get the feeling neither has enough intelligence to really know, so it will probably be bad all the way around in the end.
I don't see how matching the Rockets offer to Jackson, not playing him an entire season, then attempting to milk the clock for a better deal that likely might never surface, thus stunting the growth of the organization for at least two years is in the best interest of the Warriors organization and the fans. There are simply too many if's in the equation because when a player doesn't play his stock drops. I'm sure every GM in the league would be very cautious about trading for a player in Jackson's position and most likely would not want to give up too much because the risk factor is too great right now. We can agree that the Warriors have the right to shop him around or even do absolutely nothing, but this whole fiasco will end up backfiring and in the end, hurting the franchise for years to come. I honestly hope the Rockets do not make a move for MJ in the offseason.
Marc Jackson is being loyal to his <i> future team </i>, the one who actually wants him, by acting this way. The more he acts up, the less trade leverage GS has, and the less they will get for him. His salary is set, it isn't going to change for 7 years. GS played hardball with him, all is fair if he plays hardball back with them to ensure he goes to the team of his choice and his new team gets him for as cheap as possible (in terms of picks/players etc). GS decided to go this zero sum short term thinking route (business hardball if you will), they have to live with the consequences. Personally, I think the way we handled Mobley in a very similar situation and GS handled MJ--we could have played lowball games and used the RoFR option but didn’t because we let the player know we valued him even as a backup --speaks volumes for the approach of the organizations and it is no accident that one has been more successful both in terms of bringing in FA and in terms of the bottom line (W’s). The only part to GS actions that were especially scummy however was waiting to the last minute to match the contract. If the day the Rockets signed him they matched, well, we all could have accepted that. But instead they chose to strum MJ around and screw us from being able to pursue other options with our injury exemption by waiting until the end of the period--that part was totally bush league. I don't buy they really didn't know what they were going to do until the last day when they had “a revelation”, they had all summer to prepare for different scenarios. As far as MJ a Rocket, I don't see it. It was a really good option for us this year because we just lost Mo and MJ was the best available-team fitting C/PF out there. KT and EG have both improved substantially as PFs and Cato is producing at the C, but more importantly with Mo back they (Mo and MJ) are probably just a little too redundant (not equivalent players, but similar enough in many respects). I think when Rudy said he was disappointed in GS decision and wished Marc well in his future pursuits or the like Rudy realized the likelihood of Marc ever being a Rocket was pretty slim. I have to admit Swoopa for as insightful as you posts are you havn't recognized mistakes by the GS front office in handling the manner. I can understand your frustration and irritation with MJ (we would be to in a similar situation), but that doesn't take away GS's short sidedness in approaching the whole thing.
If the Warriors screwing with the Rockets means they screwed up their chemistry and image around the league while having their cap tied up with a disgruntled player then I say it was well worth it. It helps me sleep well at night knowing the Warriors preventing Marc Jackson from coming to Houston blew up in their face big time! And that's my partisan side talking!
<b>Also, don't overlook the possibility (likelihood?) that Jackson isn't being played because GS does plan to make a deal, and doesn't want him to wreck it by getting hurt. </b> I think that's wishful thinking more then anything. The reason they're probably not playing him is to "punish" him for not wanting to be there, and having to many big men there. They've barely played him all year long, and it's killing his value. And if going through all of this was worth it to keep him away from Houston then Golden State has some serious issues because Houston isn't the defending world champions, why try this hard to screw over Houston!?
I really don't know what to think about MJ anymore. Does he really suck that badly, to get such little playing time? Or is GSW that dumb/vindictive to spite MJ by not playing him, but still paying him 4 mill per year? At this point, I wouldn't want the Rockets to get him, unless we gave up someone like Moochie or less.
Swopa, granted he's not gonna be nicknamed "The Glove" or anything, but he does play hard, and is average defensively. Even if this was the case, I think you can keep either Foyle or Dampier and bring them off the bench? I still think that Jamison will never be succesful in the West, SF or PF, so they should've traded him. It's too late now, because he hasn't been playing well and is making the MAX. Tell me, if you wanted a draft pick, the Rockets could've "worked a deal out" with the Warriors, if you know what I mean, don't you think? One sided trade, where GS ends up with a pick.
Bottom line...he took the $. That makes him a commodity. Geez...we are talking 24 Million here folks If a Rocket player was going on like this...I wonder how people here would be reacting. Slightly different I imagine. As for GS knocking back Phoenix's deal...John Wallace and a protected pick is NOT a deal. It's an insult...
Bottom line is he took the money from another team. I'm going to be remarkably consistent in this regard : Restricted Free Agency is a crappy thing. And I don't like it one bit.
I'm of the opinion that Marc Jackson sucks and isn't even worth talking about. We should all be thankful we don't have him... CATO TIME FOR LIFE BABY!
