You realize that was five years ago right? Since then he has undergone Microfracture surgery. Players lose something as they get older. Think about the Rockets 5 years after they won their second title. Was Olajuwon still capable of leading his team to the finals? No.
HA HA HA HA are you joking? Devin Harris will never be confused with a sharpshooter. Until this season he couldn't hit an open jumpshot to save his life. Im amazed how much some of you overate Devin Harris. Listening to some of you Im thinking the Mavs traded away Gary Payton, Stockton or Baron Davis. The Mavs traded their 4th best player and 8th best player for one of the best point guards in the NBA and despite the claims that he is over the hill is close to averaging a triple double. Where im worried about the Mavs is their ability to run. The Mavs beat us by 40 points in game 7 because they run our team out of the gym. For some reason the Mavs don't run very well anymore. This is the Mavs pecking order. 1. Dirk 2. Josh Howard 3. Jason Terry 4. Devin Harris 5. Erick Dampier 6. Jerry Stackhouse 7. Brandon Bass 8. Diop 9-13 Don't really matter
No, Mavs do not need a point guard, they need a tough center. Kid will do nothing to upgrade them. Remember Nash was there a few years ago? After losing Nash, they did not do worse. That also says someone as good as Nash did nothing for Mavs. The present Kid is not better than Nash was. So it's a very strange trade, as strange as Cuban letting Nash joining Suns.
Devin Harris shot well against the Rockets the last couple years. He also is a big threat to penetrate so that makes him all the more deadly. The comments were from a Rockets POV. If Jason Terry did to the rest of the league what he does to the Rockets he'd be an all-star. Its all about what they mean to us. Derek Harper when he was with the Mavs was always a Rocket killer. Some players just bring it when they play your team it seems, Harris usually brought it against HOU.
I think so, cuz while The Rox r against The Nets, Kidd's performance is not as good as usual.. Alston once had said that he knew how Kidd would move, and Kidd would likely make a fake... Alston is able to suppress Kidd
Moot argument considering Rockets have lost the last 6 games to Dallas WITHOUT Harris shooting the ball well. (2006-2007) Game 1) 3 pts, 0 rebounds, 4 assists Game 2) 7 pts, 4 rebounds, 4 assists Game 3) 3 pts, 1 rebound, 4 assists (2007-2008) Game 4) DNP Game 5) 22 pts, 1 rebound, 5 assists Game 6) 14 pts, 2 rebounds, 7 assists That is the dumbest thing I've read all day. What do you mean the Mavs don't need a pg? Sure Harris gets the job done, but it's obvious you haven't seen a single Mavs game all year. He's a scoring pg and his game is similar to Terry's. I made the argument a few months ago in the "Mavs, Something is Wrong" thread that you can't have both playing at the same time. Terry finally started coming off the bench and Mavs suddenly climbed to first place. Devin will get his points and make his stops on defense, but he doesn't make his team better. Mavericks run nothing but Iso's and high pick and rolls. Lucky for them they're a good shooting team. But things can get very ugly when they can't buy a basket (look at NJ and Philly last week). Going back to your argument, Kidd single handedly took his team to the Finals TWICE. Dirk has been there once. Nash, even though the system he runs in PHX suits him better, has never made it to the Finals. I think the best Mavs team ever assembled was in 2003 when they had Dirk, Josh, Nash, Finley, Jamison, and Walker. They failed to do anything. Nash isn't the answer, and there's no point in even bringing it up. It's very hard to imagine that the 7th best pg in NBA history (according to ESPN) won't help this team. This is what Dirk had to say - http://mavs.beloblog.com/archives/2008/02/dirk-loves-the-deal.html Surprisingly, Mavs have the 2nd most efficient offense in the league. Just wait till Kidd gets going. I'm actually incredibly excited now. If Dirk is happy, then I have no reason to worry.
That is the dumbest thing I've read all day. What do you mean the Mavs don't need a pg? Sure Harris gets the job done, but it's obvious you haven't seen a single Mavs game all year. He's a scoring pg and his game is similar to Terry's. I made the argument a few months ago in the "Mavs, Something is Wrong" thread that you can't have both playing at the same time. Terry finally started coming off the bench and Mavs suddenly climbed to first place. Devin will get his points and make his stops on defense, but he doesn't make his team better. Mavericks run nothing but Iso's and high pick and rolls. Lucky for them they're a good shooting team. But things can get very ugly when they can't buy a basket (look at NJ and Philly last week). Going back to your argument, Kidd single handedly took his team to the Finals TWICE. Dirk has been there once. Nash, even though the system he runs in PHX suits him better, has never made it to the Finals. I think the best Mavs team ever assembled was in 2003 when they had Dirk, Josh, Nash, Finley, Jamison, and Walker. They failed to do anything. Nash isn't the answer, and there's no point in even bringing it up. It's very hard to imagine that the 7th best pg in NBA history (according to ESPN) won't help this team. Kidd plays in the east which has no comparission to the west. My point is Kidd today is not better than Nash a few years ago. In his carrier, Kidd is an extremely good point guard, but right his best rank as a point is 3rd, after Paul and Nash. What I am saying is Dallas need a tough guy like Shaq (because Dirk is a very soft player). Kidd on the other hand has not been a tough guy. He gave up in the NBA finals even before the game started. From this point, he is even worse than K. Martin. I don't think Dallas will achieve anything without adding another tough guy. But any way let see what will happen. Don't say "That is the dumbest thing I've read all day" as you have your point that others may not aggree with. So let show some respect from each other.
I like it for the rox. Less time for Mavs PGs that shoot well, all the better since that is what has killed us most often (see Jason Terry). JKidd can do a lot of things, but shooting isn't one of them.
agree but they are taking a huge gamble like heat did with shaq, he might win them a title, but may looking to rebuild not long after getting the ring
That team was horrible. Worst Mavs team they have had sine Cuban owned the team. That team played absolutely no defense and is the only Mavs team to lose more than 30 games in a season. Im with you. People seem to think that the Mavs gave up Chris Paul or Deron Williams when in reality they gave up a guard that only creates for himself. Devin Harris is not as good as the people on this thread are making him out to be.
The verdict is not out but I think the trade will make Dallas better. Even though Kidd is not a scoring threat Mavs has plenty of scorer: Dirk, Josh, Jason, and Stackhouse. Kidd will be the "Little general" on the floor. He offer experience, leadership, and he has the senority to bark orders when they fold. They'll be a dangerous team. Hopefully it'll take them some time to adjust for us to catch up.
Personnel-wise, this is a much better trade for Dallas, however, it cost Cuban and the Mavs $11M more to make this deal, whatever that means...
Nice blog post by Bill Simmons that echoes why many don't think this trade helps Dallas out as much as one would think: http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=simmons/080223 1. Kidd can't shoot. I mean, he really can't shoot. He always has been useless as a 3-point shooter, but nowadays he can't even get to the rim like he did during his heyday. Just look at his numbers. During the '03 season, when he would have been the MVP if not for a career year from Tim Duncan, Kidd averaged 18.7 points, got to the line five times a game, shot 41 percent from the field and averaged nine assists and 6.3 rebounds for good measure ... and that was two years before the league changed the hand-check rules and allowed point guards to start dominating. If Dallas was getting THAT Jason Kidd? I'd be standing and applauding. But the '08 Jason Kidd is shooting .366 from the field, scoring 13 a game and averaging 2.2 free throws, which tells me he's not driving to the basket anymore. Now, look at this particular Dallas team. The Mavs have one guy who can consistently create his own shot (Dirk Nowitzki), one guy who catches fire from time to time (Josh Howard), one good shooter (Jason Terry) and one scorer who might be washed up (Jerry Stackhouse). I keep hearing Kidd is going to get everyone easy baskets, but their three best scorers (Dirk, Howard and Terry) are already shooting around 47 percent. How much easier can he make it for them? Dallas was missing a guard who could create shots for everyone and carry the offense every time it got stagnant -- because, after all, the current defensive rules are geared toward helping penetrating guards do their thing -- and every other Western contender has a guy like that except the Lakers (who don't need one because they have Kobe) and Rockets (who can't be taken seriously because they don't have one). Phoenix has Steve Nash. Denver has Allen Iverson. New Orleans has Chris Paul. Utah has Deron Williams. Golden State has Baron Davis and Monta Ellis. San Antonio has Tony Parker and Manu Ginobili. Portland has Brandon Roy. If you don't have a guard who can take advantage of the current rules, that's a legitimate disadvantage, especially in the last five minutes of a close game when defenses clamp down and it becomes tougher to get good shots. In this respect, I don't see how Dallas got better by getting Kidd. (One other wrinkle here: For a team like the Suns, this trade doesn't bother them if they end up meeting Dallas in a series. Not only can Nash blow by Kidd whenever he wants, but, defensively, he can play 5 feet off him and double another player. It's no different than if Devin Harris was still on the team. It really isn't.) 2. The benefits to having Kidd on your team are simple: He's completely unselfish, he's competitive as hell, he makes everyone a little bit better, and he's better than everyone but Nash at running fast breaks. The first three traits help Dallas just like they'd help any team: Kidd always has been one of those players who gets better with better teammates, as he proved during every All-Star Game and even the Olympic trials last summer. Still, it's his creativity and consistency on fast breaks that make him special ... and that's what confused me about the trade from Dallas' end. Have you watched the Mavs? Who's running with Kidd on that team other than Howard? Dirk is slow. Erick Dampier is slow. Terry doesn't go within 20 feet of the basket. Stack stopped running five years ago. Who's left? Anyway, every time I had a conversation about Kidd in New Orleans last weekend, I asked the question, "Yeah, it's great for the Mavs and all, but who the hell is running with him?" I couldn't get past it. And if you watched the Mavs-Hornets game, the thing that stuck out was Kidd's teammates (everyone except Howard) chugging to keep up with him. In fact, there was one play in the third quarter when Kidd took off with a rebound and beat his teammates down the court by 8-10 feet, realized nobody else was with him, screeched to a stop at the foul line and had to dribble back out and wait for everyone else to show up. Switch Nowitzki for someone like Amare Stoudemire and switch Jason Terry for someone like Monta Ellis, and I'd be saying, "Wow, awesome trade, this is gonna be unbelievable!!!!" But Dallas doesn't have the right teammates for him -- it's a halfcourt team and, to be honest, he's not a great halfcourt player anymore. 3. Once upon a time, Kidd was a destructive defensive player, one of the best defensive players in the history of the point guard position. The thing that made him special was his ability to guard anyone under 6-foot-8. (Remember in the '02 playoffs when he shut down Paul Pierce?) You could unleash him on anyone like a pit bull. And he was so good at planting his feet and taking a charge on layups and dunks, he was single-handedly responsible for the NBA extending that little semi-circle under the basket. Unfortunately, that guy is long gone. He can't handle great point guards anymore, and if you watched that Hornets game, the enduring image was Paul killing Kidd in the third quarter to the point Dallas had to switch Terry on him. Paul's final numbers: 31 points, 11 assists, nine steals, five rebounds. What else can you say? Look, I have Kidd ranked as one of the 50 greatest players ever, as well as one of the best eight point guards ever. But at this point of his career? I'd take seven point guards in the West over him: Paul, Williams, Nash, Davis, Iverson, Parker and Ellis. So you can't tell me he pushes Dallas from "fringe contender" to "genuine contender" -- the upgrade from Harris to Kidd just wasn't significant enough, and that's before you factor in what the Mavs lost with DeSagana Diop (their best shot-blocker and low-post defender), or the eight-figure financial bump in salaries and luxury-tax expenses. If you're a Dallas fan, the trade made your team more interesting this season (as opposed to "fairly uninteresting") and you have a significant trade chip next season (Kidd's expiring contract in 2009 for $20 million). Just don't think you're winning a title, because it's not happening.
We have always matched well against Kidd led teams. I like this trade for us. I only wish George was moved as well. But not to worry, when the go small with George, we have Scola and Landry to match-up as well - complete with a coach who is not stubborn when it comes to the issue of matching up/down. Now Stack is another matter.
