Well, I read your comment as..."He (insert player) scored a crapload (insert numbers) of points against a professional team (insert team) and you really can't dismiss that in any way," whereas Robinson did exactly that but his accomplishment was then immediately dismissed, seemingly. Maybe I just read the statment wrong. I'm glad you're not comparing him to Wilt though. Kobe's performance last night was simply amazing. I wish Steve would be that selfish sometimes, because I know he could do the same thing if he wanted to and then everyone would be oooohing and aaaahing over him.
No I don't think Kobe is that good, I don't really believe the gap between the 3 is all that big. I would have Iverson ahead of Carter. Carter is just a three point shooter, and the other aspects of his play aren't remarkable in any way.
Ahh, I see your point. I <I>did</I> say those kind of numbers against <I>any</I> team can't be discredited, which would seem to contradict me somewhat discrediting Robinson's performance. I was really pointing out though what made that <I>game</I> a farce, not the opponent. But I see your point. On an unrelated note, I watched some of the game last night (and if I'm not mistaken, Kobe missed his first two shots, but he made his third which was a <I>ridiculous</I> one-handed scoop shot from about 12-feet out).... and the pont I wanted to make was Pau Gasol is a player. You should have seen the spin move he put on Horry, flew down the baseline and slammed it home.... seriously looked Dream-esque. Shareef-Gasol deal is looking good for the Grizzlies.
jayz, There is a distiction between robinson's 71 and kobe's 56. Robinson - and his teammates - played the whole game with one goal in mind get robinson as many points as possible. He played the whole game. The clippers could not have cared less to win the game. On the other hand, Kobe - and his teammates - played the whole game to win - and when the game was essentially over (in the middle of the third quarter) kobe left the game for good, shortly thereafter. Kobe's points came in the flow of the offense. The point is no one who watched robinson's 71 thought the guy only got those point because it was the clippers. Instead, they look at it like a well-planned game plan on the spurs part to get robinson the scoring title.
Do you watch basketball? Carter shoots a good amount of threes, but he is hardly a three point shooter. His first step, ability to penetrate, and elevate with stellar body control are absolutely amazing. "Remarkable" doesn't do it justice.
But the guy isn't motivated---his star would be even larger if he had some dog in him and if he ventured beyond the three point line more often.
I think you are wrong. Again, you are quick to make players with little expression of outward emotion into "unmotivated' or "wimpy." I think Carter is extremely motivated. I think he showed that last year in the playoff run they had. The year prior, he was criticized for not stepping up, as he should have been. He faltered as the leader that year. I don't think it was because he wasn't motivated. I think it was because of the jitters and nervousness. A choking sensation in the throat if you will. But last year was a huge turning point for him in my opinion. He took his opportunities and made good on them. He shined when he needed to, to get Toronto deep into the playoffs.
Good source to prove a point, Charles Oakley. You decide, watch the tape from last year, or believe Charles Oakley.
Umm, the Rockets played without Steve Francis for 17 games. Doesn't mean they are as bad as the Grizzlies. Edit: the rest of this message was removed because I don't have time for another back and forth debate
I think Cat should examine what JayZ points out: the Lakers are 10-4 without Shaq the last two years. Extrapolate that over the course of an entire season, and they come close to winning the best division in basketball. Carter and McGrady have better supporting castes... and won't win divisions that aren't nearly as good.
No way we are able to change Cat's opinion. Even if Kobe wins 50 rings, grows wings on his back, and is found to have saved 750 orphans from a burning building, Cat would point out that 14 of the 50 rings deserve an *, his wings give him an unfair and unlegal advantage, and that Kobe wasn't helping the problem of overpopulation.
The problem with that, haven, is that 14 games isn't a season. The Detroit Pistons started off this year on fire... now, they're under .500. In the short-term, it's not as hard in many cases to survive without the "star player." Often, this motivates the rest of the team, especially the role players, to step up and show what they can do in the absence of the big star. As a result, for the first game or so, the team comes out with a lot of emotion and passion, which in most cases can be enough to carry you through a game. Also, since most of Shaq's injuries have been short-term, the opponents aren't as prepared for the type of Laker offense that will be run that game. However, if that star is out for a prolonged period of time, the reality of the lack of talent begins to set in. It's very unlikely for those role players to keep playing with the same energy and emotion for 10-15 games, or something like that. It's also likely that the other team starts to learn the Lakers system when Shaq isn't around, and thus defends them better.
Gotta love how this BBS translates one game against the Grizzlies into multiple world championships and the likewise. Anyway, how about this: if the Lakers win another championship, this year, next, or later, (assuming Tim Duncan doesn't tear up his knee again) I will apologize to all the Laker fans on this BBS, start an individual thread calling Kobe and Shaq the best two players in the game, and never post in any Laker threads again.
Kobe is one of the best players in the game. Yesterday he had an awesome awesome nite! But I still dont think he would win jack without Shaq. Yeah he might carry his team to the playoffs like Carter and McGrady, but thats it. Kobe is not the single best player in the game today.
What, this comment? After falling 2 points short of reaching the Eastern Conference finals last season and then re-signing all of the team's free agents, Toronto is showing no improvement. Antonio Davis believes the Raptors should regret trading Charles Oakley to the Bulls. "Taking nothing away from what we have, but I miss him," Davis said. "Charles was very vocal, as you know, and maybe he said some things to upset people on the outside of our circle. During team meetings and practices and things like that, he said a lot of things that made a lot of sense. "Somebody asked me about him fouling Vince and it being a wake-up call (in the Bulls-Raptors game on Dec.20). Well, imagine him giving us wake-up calls once a week during practice. That was really a big help, and you miss that. We've been so inconsistent. Having guys like that will bring some type of consistency. Without question, you're going to play hard." Where does it say that Vince was not motivated? Now you are nitpicking about one minor event. All that it says is that Davis misses Oakley and he helped make them consistent. That says more for Oakley then it does against Vince and the Raptors. They are a different team now, with some new players, a new starting PG, a new center, Davis moved to PF, to name a few things. I am betting the chemistry is not quite where it needs to be. His scoring is down this year by 2 ppg, but his assist numbers and rebounding numbers are up. Why do you keep bringing up their record as a reflection of how motivated Vince is? Their record last year was 18-18 at this point in the season. This year it's 20-17. Last year they made it to the Eastern Conference semifinals. By your logic, Vince is MORE motivated at this point?!?! That makes no sense.
