Blake, Part of me thinks some of these posters have never really watched all of these guards play. There should have been a "TEST" for people to even vote on this poll. Especially the people who claim that Sura was an average guard.. you and i and all the faithful know that they never watched him play a minute. Paper: HOUSTON CHRONICLE Date: FRI 01/14/2005 Section: Sports Page: 1 Edition: 3 STAR A few more Suras sure would help By JOHN P. LOPEZ Staff BOB Sura could do more with a bad knee than New Jersey's Jason Kidd could do with bad teammates. At best, both Sura's knee and Kidd's team will likely get only marginally better this season. They both need help. But the Rockets won this one and can officially be called streaking now, winning 13 of their last 19 with Thursday's 94-85 overtime victory, because what Sura brings to the team the Nets could never find on a waiver wire or on the trade block. "He's one of those guys," Rockets coach Jeff Van Gundy said, "that you walk away and think, `I'm proud to coach that guy.' I like him. Fans do the same." Lots of heart This should have been the game that exposed one of the Rockets' biggest weaknesses, playing the second of back-to-back games with a point guard who is not really a point guard. And on top of all that, he is hobbling along on a knee that had to have fluid drained from it Tuesday and will be a sore point, literally, probably the entire season. Of course, we say hobbling, but that's in theory only. Sura fights the pain the way he fights everyone and everything. He never shows it if he is overmatched. He shows only heart and produces. That is what has endeared Sura to Van Gundy from the moment the coach first saw him scrapping for loose balls, fighting through screens and knocking down big jumpers in practice. When Sura finally stepped onto the court Nov. 27 after spending the beginning of the season on the injured list following September back surgery, fans were hoping he could be some kind of savior. That was asking too much, of course. That's not him. And he hasn't been the perfect answer. His career-high 35 points Thursday notwithstanding, rare will it be that he can be the go-to point guard logging huge minutes and carrying the team. What he has been, however, is the perfect example of what Van Gundy can point to when players are not giving the ever-important effort to the level they need to give it. Van Gundy calls it grinding. With just two true star-quality players in Yao Ming and Tracy McGrady and big holes elsewhere, this team needed to find a personality and style that will be there even when the shots are not. Case of amnesia Just one night earlier when everything was falling into the bucket in a road win at Dallas, it was easy to forget how this team needs to play to be successful. On Thursday night at the Toyota Center, several Rockets indeed played as if they forgot. Yao played more like the one with some kind of injury on the second day of a back-to-back, and we're not talking about his scoring line, which included only six points and five turnovers. We're talking about the things this team needs from Yao if it is going to win. We're talking about helping on a screen in the crucial minutes, which he did not do when the Nets' Vince Carter blasted through a clear lane to tie the game at 77 in the final moments. Maybe Yao's legs were dead. But so were Sura's. We're talking about Yao taking a borderline offensive foul moments later, giving the Nets another chance to tie it. Sure, it was a bad call, but Yao should not have put the ball on the floor when he caught it on the block. He should have gone straight up and perhaps drawn a one-and-one free throw. And we're talking about grabbing a flat-footed rebound on the defensive end, then allowing Jason Collins to rip it out of his hands and give the Nets another big bucket down the stretch. Yao was not alone in falling just short of "grinding" in the most important stages, but the point is this: Without Sura on the floor this night, the Rockets would have lost. No doubt about it. With his teammates sluggish and McGrady hobbling after straining a quadriceps at the end of the third quarter, it was Sura who knocked down shots over his defender. It was Sura who sliced through the lane and grabbed a huge offensive rebound in overtime. It was Sura who played 43 minutes, showing the pain of his bum knee only in the Rockets' huddle. "I'm going to play the way I always have," Sura said. "I'm not going to make a big deal out of it. I do what I can do. I've only known one way to play my whole life. If I play, I have to go full throttle no matter what's bothering me or what's hurting." He wasn't trying to be a martyr. In fact, when asked about playing with pain, Sura grimaced more than he ever did on the court, uncomfortable, even, with the question. "One thing he's not going to do is give you the NBA drama, where you know that he's hurt, like what is so evident throughout the league," Van Gundy said. "He's not going to make sure you know he's hurting and then try to be heroic." The Rockets don't need heroes. They need more players like Sura. The problem is, even amidst this nice run and in the wake of Thursday's victory, the way Sura is playing has not taken hold throughout the lineup. The Rockets are rolling only because McGrady has been unstoppable offensively and the schedule has been mostly kind the past three weeks. "You either have what he has or you don't," Van Gundy said. "We didn't teach Bob Sura to play like that. I tell him, `you probably were in so many fights as a kid.' ... That's who he his. You need that." In the middle of three games in four days and with a four-games-in-five-days stretch upcoming - top point guards like Tony Parker, Stephon Marbury and Steve Francis on the way - Sura's knee will be tested more than ever. He still needs help, and the Rockets will search for it today when they bring in free agent Rod Strickland for a workout. But until help arrives, Sura will have to continue to grind and show the way. More on this team should follow his lead. It is the only way this nice run will turn into a playoff berth.
Paper: HOUSTON CHRONICLE Date: TUE 01/25/2005 Section: Sports Page: 01 Edition: 3 STAR ROCKETS 89, MAGIC 78 / Rockets look out for No. 1 / With McGrady absent, Barry fills gap against Magic, Francis By JONATHAN FEIGEN Staff In a final irony to torment Orlando one more time, neither the Rockets nor the Magic had Tracy McGrady on Monday. The Magic missed him more. The Magic eventually did get Steve Francis going. But with McGrady attending to a family medical emergency, the Rockets plugged in Jon Barry and could hardly tell the difference in an 89-78 win over the Magic on Monday at Toyota Center, or as Francis might call it, "The House that Steve-O Built." Barry came off the bench to make seven of 10 shots for a season-high 19 points to go with six rebounds and five assists. While he had his best game with the Rockets, four other players also scored in double figures, and the Rockets suffocated the Magic offense long enough to move four games better than .500 for the first time this season. "Coach asked us do we think we have enough in this room to win," Barry said. "Evidently, we did. We played with great urgency in the first half and were able to hold on. "Any time you miss your best player, somebody's got to do it." That got teammate David Wesley giggling. Less certain, however, is how long someone other than McGrady will have to lead the Rockets. The Rockets announced only that McGrady had to miss the game because of the emergency. They did not say whether he would be on today's flight or with the team in New Orleans on Wednesday. McGrady attended the team's Monday morning shootaround and planned to be back for the game when he left Toyota Center at 12:30 p.m. Rockets players did not learn that McGrady would be out until they arrived at the arena for the game. But from the opening minutes, they did not seem in any way undermanned. "I think you underestimate professional athletes in that they think they can win no matter who's there," Rockets coach Jeff Van Gundy said. "So do I. Obviously, you never want to miss someone of Tracy's magnitude over a period of time. But in any one-game situation ... you can overcome anybody's loss." From the start Monday, the Rockets played urgent, shutdown defense. They cut off the drives to the rim with which Francis had torched them in Orlando. Then they got on the boards enough to make all that defense work for them. Magic hit a low The Magic's 27 first-half points were the fewest in franchise history and just a 3-pointer more than the fewest the Rockets have ever allowed in any half. By then, Francis had outscored McGrady by two, the Magic had made 11 of 37 shots and the Rockets had led by as much as 21. "This is a heck of a scoring team," Barry said of the Magic, seventh in the NBA in scoring. "They have a lot of great offensive players. To hold them to 27 is a heck of a defensive effort." To do that, the Rockets had to limit Francis to jumpers. "It takes a little determination," David Wesley said. "You try to stay in front as much as you can. It helps to have good defensive people behind you. I can't take full credit for keeping him out of the paint. He had to see something behind me and said, `I can't get there.' " While the Magic were missing shots, the Rockets scored easily. When Orlando shifted into a zone with the Rockets' lead at 11, Barry hit a pair of jumpers, and Dikembe Mutombo scored inside before Barry sent a no-look alley-oop to Mutombo for a layup. The Magic made just one of their last 10 shots of the first half, with Yao Ming knocking down a jumper and Wesley two free throws to take the lead to 48-27. The Rockets could not maintain that offensive pace. The Magic sent stronger double teams at Yao. The Rockets, especially Rod Strickland, could not hit the outside shots the Magic gave them. But Barry dropped in a 3 and then another jumper to send the Rockets to the fourth quarter with a 16-point lead, so that even when the Magic began scoring at their usual rate to pull as close as seven, it was too late. Barry the key "When you're missing as many points as Tracy's been (scoring) recently, you try to figure out how you're going to score," Van Gundy said. "Jon did a great job giving us a cushion early and also when we were dead in the water in the third (quarter). Making those two big baskets late gave us a cushion going into the fourth." While Barry had his best offensive night, Yao continued his recent offensive surge by making nine of 14 shots for 22 points with 10 rebounds. As he had in Orlando, Bob Sura chased a triple double with 15 points, 11 rebounds and seven assists. And if none of those numbers quite matched typical McGrady numbers, they were enough to let him have a last laugh even on a night he wasn't there.
I respect your opinion but don't think Sura was that much of a difference-maker. JVG got last year's team to do just as well as that season when Sura was playing. Nearly the same record with the same results in Rd 1. JVG was the one that allowed those guys to overachieve.
Tinman, You can find a local article or two to support an argument in favor of just about any player in this league. They all have games that merit a local sportswriter raving about them. Find some articles from national sportswriters or other teams where they rave about Bob Sura. I'm not saying Sura was a bad player, just that he was another guy who wouldn't have started on most other teams but overachieved under JVG's tutelage. Sura is about equal to Rafer. I would probably even put Rafer ahead of Sura as a PG. Sura was a better rebounder but that is about it. He may have been a marginally better defender beacuse of his size but I am not even sure about that. Rafer has weaknesses defensively but he has great hands and plays good team defense. Rafer is the superior ballhandler and passer and has much better court vision. Rafer is closer to what you want out of your PG than Sura. The bottom line is that neither of them are, or were, great PGs and if you replaced Alston with Sura last season, or this season, the results likely wouldn't be any different, and maybe even worse.
On a bad knee, Sura drops 35 points that shows: courage leadership heart toughness aper: HOUSTON CHRONICLE Date: FRI 01/14/2005 Section: Sports Page: 1 Edition: 3 STAR ROCKETS 94, NETS 85 (OT) / Sura steps up to ease pain / Rockets follow lead of injured guard to put a hurting on Nets By JONATHAN FEIGEN Staff Bob Sura and Tracy McGrady hobbled across the court as if a tough game of shuffleboard would be a challenge. Sura dragged his right knee. McGrady shuffled along trying not to use his pained left thigh. Those heady days of flying past the century mark were long gone. Instead, the Rockets limped. But while McGrady walked like Sura, Sura shot like McGrady, until the Rockets finally put away the injury-staggered New Jersey Nets 94-85 in overtime Thursday night at Toyota Center. With the win, the Rockets moved two games past .500 for the first time this season. Beyond that, they began a game as they had so often, falling behind 17-3 before they seemed to notice. But in grinding out a win, they might have left behind the dreary early months of the season spent losing such games. "We get out to that rough start and a month and a half, two months ago, it would have gotten worse for us," said Sura, who had a career-high 35 points. "To be able to bounce back, play better, this was steps for us." But the problem is those steps could remain labored and painful. Sura's sore right knee continues to hang over the Rockets' season; McGrady left a third consecutive game because of an injury (a strained left quadriceps). But this time, when he came back he did not appear healed as he had in a fourth-quarter blitz in Denver and second-half roll in Dallas. He struggled through the last 14 minutes and then said he was worried about how long his latest injury would hang around. "This injury right here I am concerned about," McGrady said. "With the toe (bruised the night before), I thought it would be fine today, which it was. "This injury that I'm dealing with now, pretty much I'm concerned with carrying over." McGrady demoted himself to "decoy" and Yao Ming was caught in a funk, but Sura was upgraded to unstoppable. Sura made 11 of 16 shots, with his overtime 3-pointer putting the Rockets in command for the first time all night. With two more free throws, he had 35 points, 11 better than his previous high this season. "We know Sura is a good player, but we didn't expect 6-of-7 on 3s," Nets forward Jason Collins said. "I mean, look at the percentages." Sura had been making 22.9 percent of his treys this season. But he needed to make just one Thursday night to feel as if he would remain on target for the rest of the evening. "I've been playing well of late," Sura said. "Tonight was a breakout game for me. "I expected to play this way. I kind of got rolling last year with Atlanta, was able to play great. The last 10 or 12 games, I was able to play really well." He had breakout games before. But with McGrady scoring just four points after his third-quarter injury and David Wesley and Juwan Howard unable to make the shots they had knocked down so reliably in Wednesday's 124-114 win at Dallas, Sura took over as he had not before, seemingly because he had to. But it did look familiar. "He made some shots I didn't think he was capable of hitting," McGrady said. "I didn't think he had them in his game. "But he made me into a believer tonight. He kind of reminded me of myself." But that would not have been enough. The Rockets had wasted chances to win the game in regulation, especially when Yao missed a pair of free throws with a two-point lead and just 37.6 seconds left to play. Nets center Nenad Krstic got free for a dunk that tied the game. After running the clock down to its last ticks, McGrady could not get free. He instead sent a pass to Wesley in the corner for a rushed 3 that missed in the last second, giving the Nets another chance to get their first win since losing Richard Jefferson to a ruptured left wrist. But once in overtime, the Rockets finally found some offensive help for Sura. Howard, who had hit just two of eight shots up until then, began the overtime with a jumper, then spun free in the lane to sink a runner. When he added two free throws, the Rockets led 87-83 with 1:34 remaining. But after a Jabari Smith jumper, the Rockets seemed in control for the first time all night when Sura answered by dropping in his sixth 3-pointer of the night. And for whatever injuries kept them grounded, they were happy to conclude they had seen how to win with a limp. "Bobby is what I call the X factor on our team," McGrady said. "He goes out and lays it all on the line on the court, defensively, offensively. "He's the floor general on this team. He's the energy guy. We just follow his lead." With Sura playing through pain, McGrady might have followed his example too closely. But the Rockets won because Sura also followed McGrady's.
I think a more approprate title for this thread would be... Have we even had a good PG since Sam and Kenny? ...because, truth be told, asking which has been the best when none of them were very good is sort of like asking which apple is least rotten. The obvious answer is Francis because he played PG but we all know that he lacked several key PG skills. I would go with Francis but place an asterisk next to that answer.
That's just wierd logic..."Steve Francis was amazing, scoring 29 points, 8 assists, 6 boards, 3 steals and 1 4-point play. He nailed 3-4 from downtown, played Ironman minutes (45) and did not disappoint. With Cat on the pine, Francis showed his leadership skills by stepping up big time." That was Clutch's recap the of the Mil Hou game the next season...Rockets won that one by 17 points. You are comparing a pumped up veteran (he called Mario to say he was doing that...he looked forward to the matchup...versus a rookie in his first NBA game...Dampier also did the same thing in his first matchup against Yao... 23 point 9 Rebounds and 7 Blocks... who is the better player? By your logic "that's why Damp almost had a triple douple on him in his first meeting." I know what you are trying to say though... Sam is a winner...but his greatness goes beyond stats... to bring that weak arguement up to defend him is discrediting the man... he hit clutch shots when they counted... he turned both a mediocre Wolves and craptastic Clippers into winning ball clubs that went past the first round... He is a legend here... just don't bring up something like one game to prove one player is better... that's foolish... I think this is a close one because of how talented Francis was... but I would give anything to have a 38 year old Sam I Am on this ball club...besides the poll says best since... I go with Francis followed closely by Sura. (Snyder and 2nd pick for Sam) (James and Head plus 1st pick for Artest and filler) That is the shot of B12 the Rockets need in the arm. -V
I've heard of Bob Sura but never seen him play but it sounds like he's a great players. Why was he cut from the team ??
he had chronic injuries. we got him at the end of his career. when he was played, he was a warrior regardless of injuries, he inspired his teammates and was appreciated by the fans.
You hit the nail on the head...because of his fiery attitude he is kept in the fondness of Rocket memories... he played through injuries...he took down Josh Howard after he had a dirty foul on Yao...literally. -V
I see that Francis is being voted on as the best Pont Guard since Smith.Well I want to inform all of our blind voters that the Franchise was more of a showman than a true Point GuardHe was well liked even by me, till it became evident that he had insufficient abilities/or desires to make passes into the Center position.He was not a good Point Guard in as much as he was never a floor general setting up his team mates
And that Warrior you speak of, who inspired others, barely ever started as a pro and all the teams he played on ended up sucking with the exception of the Rockets, who would've been good with or without him.
BrooksBall, you are entitled to your opinion, but try to see things from the other side. You are looking at what Sura has done in other parts of his career vs what he has done for us. It's not his fault that he doesn't get many starting opportunities when he was with other teams. But for us, he was big. You asked how much of a difference he would've made last year? I think he would've totally shut Deron Williams down and given us the 3rd option and intensity we needed to break out of the first round. As a PG, Sura might be just average, but as a player, you can't deny that he's good. Heck, since this thread is about PGs, I would say Sura is the best since Sam and Kenny, since Francis as a PG is definitely worse than Sura. Better player, yes, but lousier PG.
while I admire Brooksball dedication to this year's team. I suspect he is a newer fan of the Rockets.. hence the moniker Brooksball.. not like HakeemBall or RodneyMcCrayBall or JohnLucasBall I would wish someone would give Brooksball some dvds of the games Sura played that season and in the playoffs and have him make his decision on his 'average-ness'. Cause if you watch him play, you are not judging by the nba.com or googling of stats, but of the actual play. Mario Elie didn't have great stats either, but he was a vital part of the Rockets Championship team. Was he average?? Mario Elie was not an all-star but we wouldn't win without his toughness that's for sure.
