2nd Game in a Row: No Center in the 4th

I agree. I hadn't even thought about Willis until the last minute or so when they showed him in the huddle. I think Rudy likes the "best players play regardless of position" philosophy, and I agree. Almost every mismatch works two ways, and we can effectively play without a center.

If we're willing to play PF's at the C position, this should also help out when Taylor finally gets healthy. Another thing I noticed today is that Cato is at least trying when he's out there. He may not always play well, but he's putting forth effort, which is more than can be said for him in the past. If he keeps doing that, I don't see Willis getting too many minutes at all, except maybe against teams with dominant or multiple big men (which there are fewer and fewer of).

 

heypee,
how much do you think NY and Indiana both sporting long, lean, not-'true'center-types factor into Griffin seeing more minutes at the '5'? I'm not trying to be sarcastic. Personally, I would love to see Rudy continue to play Eddie at the '5'. I just wonder if the PT equation's as simple as you make it.
Still, I'm not going to argue with six blocks.

 

I really think that is easily our most devasting lineup, when we have Griffin and Kenny Thomas out there together. I'd still like to see Rudy go wtih Griffin a little earlier in the second though, replacing Cato or even Walt if need be, because them damn blocks are fun to watch! Wow!

 

I've said it before that this team is built for the eastern conference. In the west, and i'm not just talking about shaq, but our 4 spot is getting done in. For all the stat checkers who like to focus on last yr, check our record last yr and this yr against the west. The lineups that we normally go with just doesn't work in our conference. There is just too many good big guys that can take advantage of Kenny and Griffin. In the future, hopefully Griffin will be our big guy to take advantage or at least play the Wallaces,Webbers, Garnetts, McDyess, and the Brands in our conference. If not, then when we do start making the playoffs, we'll be 1 and done like the Suns and T'Wolves have for the last couple of yrs.

 

I would sacrifice Walt minutes for Willis minutes any day. Put Walt on the bench and keep our centers in the game. That gives better rebounding which has to be one of the key for us to run which I assume is on the agenda.

 

If things work out as MJ seems to want Wallace will be with the Wizards real soon and Kwame Brown will be in Portland and then we can watch Griffin dominate Brownd four games a year for the next 20 years!

 

Lee, I do not know where you get your info from. Left to me when the game is on the line, let's say in the last 5 min of the game. I want Willis at 5, Eg and KT at the forward and Francis and Mobes. The Frontline in my opinion is competitive with all those in the west except LA.

 

Rock not to start a argument, but that lineup against Minn, Dallas, or Sac isn't even close. Why do you think those teams whipp our ass? Do you even like that line-up against the spurs? The blazers or even potland? I don't have to get stats to prove that we already know, just check the record.

 

The Kenny and Griffin combination was rocking tonight.

While I still think Cato and Willis should be the ones called upon to defend the physical post presences in the league during crunch time (I'm excluding Kenny because he's inherently at a disadvantage against opposing, physical post players), that combination has a lot of potential.

The key, imo, was more sporadic playcalling for Thomas postups even with him being hot (the offense often times becomes stagnant from an overindulgence of play calls to the post). The offense was more balanced because of this, as evidence by the 25+ points scored in the first quarter despite only executing at an average level for the most part on the offensive end.

Kenny really impressed me with his lack of timidness on his shot, which was something that plagued Moochie during the early part of the season, and cognizance of approaching pressure on the ball; he didn't force it nearly as much as last game, likely a result of him being placed at the top of the key for his drives. When his jumper is on, he's tough to stop.

We're lucky to have him; some of you are just spoiled by the presence of a plethora of skilled power forwards on this team and look to diminish his strengths by overrating his deficiences; his strengths FAR outweigh his weaknesses imo.

What a weakside block on Camby! I know they called it a foul *clean*, but he can be a pretty damn good weakside shot-blocker when he puts his mind to it. Jermaine twice, off the glass on Bibby, and now against Camby.

But the thing I love most about Kenny; he boxes out. Focus on him every once in a while and you'll see the 4 years of college experience and 260 lb frame at work. It's his natural boxing out instincts that impress me. He gets a body on his man without having to physically turning around, which is easier said than done.

Griffin:

I think his play speaks louder than any compliments I could delineate on this bbs. It's unreal how calm and composed he is in the clutch.

I was pleasantly surprised to see he's already added new wrinkles to his offensive arsenal, with the most important progress for him on that end being the one dribble step in shot from the arc that he's quickly becoming effective with. He looked like a deer in the headlights putting the ball on the floor earlier in the season to create that shot. You can tell he's been working on it.

Defensively, I knew his timing was unreal for a player of his experience, but my God, he is NOT just a weak-side shot blocker. In fact, most of his blocks came off straight-up defense tonight. He's also learning to use his height as leverage against opposing players. He's also running the floor HARD now when in the games, as opposed to his early season canter up the floor.

There's got to be a way the coaches can implement some kind of matchup zone with KT, Griffin, and Taylor forming the lower pyramid of the zone. If the Wolves can run it with a front-line of Garnett, Nesterovic, and Trent, not to mention the slow-footed Wally Szcerbiak, then there's no reason this team can't do the same.

Great game!

 

I just got through watching a tape of the game tonight, great win for the Rockets. I'll give it to KT, he was solid tonight and and played very well. Great ending to the game as well with Moochie hitting the three. On the point of no center being in there in the 4th Q, although Cato played well in the 3rd, I don't believe that he could have delivered the defensive presence Eddie provided tonight. I just can't put into words how impressed I am with this kid. This kid is special. I can't emphasize enough that he is 19 freakin years old. Someone said that he has the potential to be as good as KG, I believe he can be better than KG. The guy is awesome. I love watching him play. The Rockets don't win tonight without him and his defensive play down the stretch.

 

I wonder how much longer until Eddie takes a swing at someone in the locker room....

 

Legend- I know what your saying about the T'wolves comparison, but Garnett is actually a 3 for real. Its just the fact he's 7ft tall. thats the advantage is that he can guard a 3 unlike any of the 4's we have on this team. He's a good post player although he doesn't just camp out there. Joe Smith and Rasho compliment each other, but the thing that makes it go is Garnett.This is the first yr I've seen Garnett even attempt a 3pt shot , but you don't ever see him camped out there because their offense cuts and moves which make him very difficult to guard.

 

Crispee- Sometimes I wonder what the hell your talking about. I didn't say we could run a zone like T'Wolves, I was saying that they, like Dallas have big people that can play small and big. Its not a Garnett or Dirk type player on this roster and that includes Eddie. Have you actually seen Dirk and Garnett play? Dirk is playing center because of a injury, he can make your center pay because he can not only grab the rebound, but he can go coast to coast, pull up for a 3 or post up. Show me a player on this roster thats even remotely close to that. As far as Garnett, he can defend anyone from the 3-5 position because of his lateral and vertical quickness. Show me one our roster one of those type. You did read a thread about when i said if your man leaves you , go to the basket. How do you think Camby scores? How do you think a guy like Dale Davis has been in this league so long without being able to hit a jumper? Its called diving to the basket.

I've never said we couldn't run the T'wolves zone, but what is making them winning is the unselfish basketball they play. Year end and yr out they have one of the top 3pt shooting teams, fg% teams and asst teams in the league. They have guys that can dribble the air out of the ball also, but they don't. They got guys slow of foot, but they play better team defense than us. Its not a matter of playing this defense or that defense, if guys aren't disciplined to it and sacrifice to it, it doesn't work. The easiest defense to score against is a lazy zone. If guys don't have their hands up and looking around playing their areas, the zone will make you look stupid. You should look and read before making assumptions.

 

IF GRIFFIN WAS GOING TO PUNCH SOMEBODY, THEN HE WOULD OF ALREADY PUNCHED OUT ONE OF HIS TEAMMATES. SINCE THEY SEEMED TO REFUSE TO PASS HIM THE BALL - FOR THE FIRST PART OF THE SEASON

 

The thing is that Rudy goes with matchups. The knicks do not have a true center either, so it is comfortable for Rudy to use EG as the center.

I doubt if we were playing the Lakers or Spurs that we would not have had a center in the game.

Regarding Griffin, he plays effortlessly, he is so much a part of the flow of the game. He understands spacing and defense.

This kid is going to be something, heck...he already IS something.

DD

 

Even with a center getting minutes, Griffin has to get 35 minutes plus per game to really exploit his skills, whether the 3 or 4. I put to you that he can play the 3 primarily--defensively, but more and more offensively. We can play Kenny errr MoT and Griffin on the court at the same time in a starting rotation (next year). There will be some matchups problems, but Griffin is a defensive jugernaut (sp?) and more and more becoming an offensive one too. Offensively, he just sets picks and looks for an opening...perfect for this offense.....

I guess what I am saying is the Griffin upside in every 3/4 matchup in the league outweighs the downside. Of all the forwards (power and small) in the West right now, here is who Griffin will have a matchup problem with (most teams have problems with the players anyway); Garnett, Duncan, Nowitzki, McDyss, Peja, Webber and Malone...every other forward can be defended by Griffin. My contention is that Griffin is establishing his defensive effectiveness far outweighs the matchup issues...you are always going to have teams that present this problem. With a guy like Eddie you do not limite his minutes in these matchups, because he can do so many things for you to make up for it

 

My perception of the 4th qtr lineup is different from the other posters in this thread, I guess. The way I saw it, the Rocks did have a center in the 4th. His name is Eddie Griffin. What the Rocks did not have in the 4th was a small forward. This was most evident at the end of the game, when Houston (the player) took the shot that put NY ahead. I thought Cat played him as well as anyone could, but with Houston's height advantage, no one 6'4" could have stopped that shot.

There will be a bunch of people say that Eddie needs to put on weight to play center. He can't bang down low. Horse hockey! EG had 8 boards in 30 minutes, (compared to 4 boards in 45 minutes for Kenny who can bang and blocks out) due to his timing and jumping ability. He is able to tip a lot of balls he doesn't get credit for rebounding. He does this when he is boxed out and avoids foul calls. So, he rebounds down low and blocks shots. The only thing he doesn't do a conventional center does is get most of his points down low. So what? Is anyone unhappy with his scoring lately?

Everyone says no center. I say no small forward. Mooch hit the game winner last night, but I don't like the 3 guards in the 4th, because the defense suffers. I think Mobes defense is really improved this year, and I didn't think it was bad last year. But you can't expect him to stop someone with 3,4, or 8 inches advantage. NY was smart enough not to try to take it into Eddie. All Houston has to do is avoid getting stripped of the ball. I'll take that matchup anytime.

IMO, the Rocks did have a center in the 4th, but his name wasn't Cato, Willis or Collier.