Make no mistake...I'm praying to the one you're praying to. I'm not telling you it's not a big deal to understand the nature of God. And I don't believe anyone else is coming but Jesus. I don't believe I'm making a theological statement by praying simply to God with other people....because the truth is, even amongst Christians we have different views of who that God is and what the particulars mean. But closing myself off to other people in addressing God doesn't help that in any way. And opening myself up to praying with other people doesn't stop it in any way.
I think the point is that they thanked their God exclusively. And were very grateful to the non-Christians and invited them to thank God also. As far as it being an exclusively Christian holiday, I don't support that or care. To me I think we are free to give meaning to days as we choose. I celebrate Thanksgiving and Christmas as Christian holidays. I don't expect everyone else to have the same context and purpose. I do believe it is important to realize the origins of the holiday are religious and for that reason it isn't unreasonable to see how a Christian might give this holiday more significance than a non-Christian to the point of feeling it is exclusive to his own faith. I don't thank Buddha on Thanksgiving not out of disrespect to Buddha, but because Buddha has no context or significnance for me on that holiday. So for me Thanksgiving holiday is exclusively Christian, though I am certainly understanding of others who would give it meaning that fits their own context. Christmas is exclusively Christian for me, the celebration of the birth of Christ. I do not oppose the merchandising of the holiday, but I would oppose the merchandising of Christ. Something Christians would be more prone to do than non Christians.
In the long run, do you think this helps non-Christians to come to Christ? I know many practicing Buddhists and some Muslims, but I struggle with how to reach them in that if I go this route, it would seem like an endorsement of their belief that Christ is not the way to heaven. The issue of prayer in a mosque or Buddhist temple is something I am umcomfortable with because of the story of Solomon.
You know I understand that side, but why get upset with all the people who think Christmas is all about shopping. I don't expect them to feel any other way in our culture. I am more opposed to Christians making it all about consumption than non-Christians... at least that is what I meant. It is the merchandising of Christ in the church that disgusts me, I don't understand why Bibles are sold for profit... or any other message of Christ (books, tapes, etc) What is it with making a profit off something freely given by Jesus Himself?.... Sorry, derail rant.
Read the entire book of Acts, there are plenty of examples that speak precisely to your points. Paul also addresses these issues specifically in 1 Corinthians and 2 Corinthians there are more passages in the bible about these issues. Paul was running into all kinds of different religions. Just check out how he handled it.
I've read Acts before, and from what I recall in most instances where the believers encountered pagans, they gently rebuked them and told them that what they believed in was wrong. I'll go through it again at some point later on. But first I'm going to go through 1 Corinthians
i agree...i think as Christians though, we have a bit of responsibility to stay away from the materialism that's overrun the holiday.
Then you're apparently making an assumption about my spiritual beliefs that may be very inaccurate. JMHO, but I would be very cautious about any type of non-inclusive actions I would attribute to Jesus.
thanksgiving was not just for pilgrims, it was also for polytheistic tribes that were already here. Furthermore, I'm not sure about what interfaith services are like at the ones you've attended, but at the one of the largest ones(marble collegiate in NYC) they have Christian sermons, Jewish ones, and Muslim ones. They aren't excluding anyone. The Christian sermons are definitely centered on christ. The others. Christ's message was certainly tolerant, and he didn't exclude people who didn't follow his message either.
I apologize then, but for some reason I thought I had seen somewhere in your previous posts where you identified yourself as non-Christian. I think the vice versa of that should also be true though I'm all for being inclusive but not to the point where I feel that uncompromisible things are being compromised.
"The Kingdom of Heaven is within you." Pretty hard for anyone to pray to a different diety than the one you believe in when the "house of worship" is your own body. At least, that is how I have seen it for years.
He drove out the moneylenders, or people who were using the sacred place of worship as a place to do business. I don't recall a single passage where Jesus talked about driving people of another faith out of a temple, a particular piece of land, or anywhere else.
I would never see it appropriate to drive out someone or turn someone away from a Church simply because they're not a believer, that would be extremely wrong. That said, it would be wrong for someone who doesn't profess Christ as God to practice their faith in His house. Everyone is welcome to stay and question and discuss, I think more of that needs to go on IMO, but I think it would be improper to allow the open practice of another faith in His house.
No problem, but you may have picked-up on others' assumptions about my religion. Or you may have picked it up from some of my synicism of much organized religion, but that has nothing to do with my spiritual beliefs. I was thinking the same thing when I wrote it ; but I would venture the odds are better on 'inclusive' than 'exclusive'.
Execellent example- will post a couple others in time in reply to Hotballa- While Paul was waiting for them in Athens, he was deeply troubled by all the idols he saw everywhere in the city. 17 He went to the synagogue to reason with the Jews and the God-fearing Gentiles, and he spoke daily in the public square to all who happened to be there. 18 He also had a debate with some of the Epicurean and Stoic philosophers. When he told them about Jesus and his resurrection, they said, “What’s this babbler trying to say with these strange ideas he’s picked up?” Others said, “He seems to be preaching about some foreign gods.” 19 Then they took him to the high council of the city.[d] “Come and tell us about this new teaching,” they said. 20 “You are saying some rather strange things, and we want to know what it’s all about.” 21 (It should be explained that all the Athenians as well as the foreigners in Athens seemed to spend all their time discussing the latest ideas.) 22 So Paul, standing before the council,[e] addressed them as follows: “Men of Athens, I notice that you are very religious in every way, 23 for as I was walking along I saw your many shrines. And one of your altars had this inscription on it: ‘To an Unknown God.’ This God, whom you worship without knowing, is the one I’m telling you about. 24 “He is the God who made the world and everything in it. Since he is Lord of heaven and earth, he doesn’t live in man-made temples, 25 and human hands can’t serve his needs—for he has no needs. He himself gives life and breath to everything, and he satisfies every need. 26 From one man[f] he created all the nations throughout the whole earth. He decided beforehand when they should rise and fall, and he determined their boundaries. 27 “His purpose was for the nations to seek after God and perhaps feel their way toward him and find him—though he is not far from any one of us. 28 For in him we live and move and exist. As some of your[g] own poets have said, ‘We are his offspring.’ 29 And since this is true, we shouldn’t think of God as an idol designed by craftsmen from gold or silver or stone. 30 “God overlooked people’s ignorance about these things in earlier times, but now he commands everyone everywhere to repent of their sins and turn to him. 31 For he has set a day for judging the world with justice by the man he has appointed, and he proved to everyone who this is by raising him from the dead.” This is a good example of Paul in the D&D of his time.
