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need advice from any guitarists/musicians out there....

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout' started by Surfguy, Nov 27, 2001.

  1. Surfguy

    Surfguy Member

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    If your a guitarist or semi-well-rounded musician, then you may know about this product. The problem is....I don't. It's called the Pod (or Pod 2.0 or Pod 2.0 Pro) and its made by Line 6. You can get all these amp tones and digital effects from it or make custom sounds. It's my understanding you can only run one digital effect at a time. Supposedly it offers superb sound with good quality...no distortion or "noise" I have heard from many other effects processors. Anyway, I have read some reviews claiming many musicians use it in the recording studio, on the road, and the like....basically, like it's a really good product. It costs about $300. Foot pedal and stand for it is optional.

    I guess I'm wondering if this is for me. Seems really cool because I will be able to hook up to my PC(if it doesn't flake out:)) and Creative Live! drive to play and record guitar...can use my Klipsch high-powered PC speakers. Never really done this before but it could be cool. Off the PC, I have a Gallien Krueger 250 ML amplifier and a Jackson guitar...a decent set-up...not the best. I am worried that it won't mesh well with my GK amp, i.e. trying to get a certain amp tone from a GK amp...hmm. I guess it could be good.

    I guess I was just wondering if any of you BBSers have ever come across one and what you thought of it. Jeff could possibly have seen or heard one. Any semi-serious guitarist may be at least familiar with it. I have bought effects processors before and they all make a lot of background noise. Therefore, I tend to steer clear of them all together these days. But, if this really is a quiet, superd sounding product....then I may just put it on my Christmas list :).

    If you have experienced one, then please let me know what you think. I know there are some guitarists lurking who are in the know. Cool or fool? Either that....or I go for a entertainment cabinet from Boltz....I really like these expandable items.
     
  2. BobFinn*

    BobFinn* Member

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  3. Ninja Sauce X

    Ninja Sauce X Member

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    The POD is an extremely good investment if, like me, you can't afford a 1000 dollar amp. It's basically a glorified multi-effects dealie, but the quality is very very nice. Get just about any sound imaginable. I wouldnt recommend the computer thingy unless you really know what you're doin, i thought i could just plug my axe into the back but i found i had to buy all sorts of extra adaptors, hardware, and other crap. But again, very good investment, a buttload of fun. 10 thumbs up!
     
  4. Ninja Sauce X

    Ninja Sauce X Member

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    or if you have about 1300 bucks to spare, get the Fender Cyber Twin. It actually changes into the actual amp you are trying to emulate. Some really complicated stuff, i dont really know for sure, something about a bunch of speakers that reconfigure themselves. But i tried it out at guitar center, its quite nice.
     
  5. Bigman

    Bigman Member

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    I use a Digitech RP5 (an old one). It's digital so theres no noise. I just go stereo out and plug in to my souncard adapter. For recording, I bought Cakewalk Guitar Tracks. Its a 16 track software and includes some basic drum processing capabilites and some basic effects. Theres lots of other programs that have up to 64 tracks and possibly more. I've used a couple of shareware versions that I downloaded off the internet and they do the job nicely. No noise issues at all. The Line 6 product is probably better than what I've got since my RP5 is about 7 or 8 yrs old. As for the tone of your amp, nothing digital can match the tone of a tube amp (if yours is a tube).;)
     
  6. KellyDwyer

    KellyDwyer Member

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    After a while, guitarists find their one true electric sound, and rarely do you hear it coming from one effects processor and little else. If it does come from a processor, it comes a series of rackmounts that (with 24 things working together) get one sound. Eventually, everyone heads in a simpler direction, and especially with a hot Jackson, you'll find the guitar and your touch doing the work for you after a while.

    I had a couple of billion-effect rackmounts in my day, but eventually I scaled down and let the guitar (Brian May model Guild) and my fingers do the talking. That's really where 95% of it comes from, REGARDLESS of what you send it through.

    Ten years into playing, I'm going straight into my amp (rackmount 60-watt Fender tube head) and my 4X12, with nothing else clouding my sound up. I'm not exactly looking for clean, but I am looking for myself, and I don't plan on finding that in anything made of silicon (unless I'm seeing my reflection in some Carmen Electra's bosoms).
     
  7. TraJ

    TraJ Member

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    If I had an electric, I'd definitely want a POD.
     
  8. Surfguy

    Surfguy Member

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    I hear ya, Kelly. And, thanks everyone for the feedback. I consider myself a decent guitarist and never really had the time or put in the effort to be a serious guitarist. I like to play alot of cover material and learn music by ear. I have some books and like to learn new stuff, like scales and arpeggios, every once in a while.

    I think one of the problems with my setup is I only get that one GK sound out of my setup. Even with adjustments, the sound doesn't vary all that much. The only momentum that seems to keep me going on guitar is my ability to learn music by ear and play what I hear with practice of course. Since I don't have a band, I typically play against the radio or CDs....I guess some kind of macho thing that tells me...."hey...I can play that song a few different places on the fretboard(neck) against a guitar god like <fill in name here>!" . My bro plays keyboards so, when we jam together, we do some original stuff that sounds pretty cool even if its just spur of the moment.

    In the end, I'm sure it all boils down to how good you are, i.e. that your style and play is really where it is at. That still doesn't account for the unique sounds you get from emulating high-priced amps and adding that special effect, like delay, you may need while sealed in that Pink Floyd moment :). I like the idea of being able to add new sounds which emulate my favorite artists.

    As far as hooking it up to the PC, I have all the inputs on my Creative Live! Drive and it shouldn't be difficult. I think I could even run it to my PC and then run it from my PC to my Home Theater. This Guitar Studio 2.0 software seems like a good addition after reading that review Bob posted above.

    I think I will go for it. As far as digital versus analog effects, I swear I have used digital effects processors that made alot of background noise as well. I think the early digital effects processors just were not that good. The one I used to play on was a Roland and the noise introduced into the signal was enough to make me not want to use it, even if I could make my own sounds and combine effects.

    In the end, I'm sure I will have fun experimenting with this product. Once I add the pedal, then that will make it all the easier to change between sounds. If I remember, I will update this thread with my thoughts on the product after Christmas.

    thanks, Surf
     
  9. Jeff

    Jeff Clutch Crew

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    Just found this one. Let me take a stab at it.

    I have both the POD and the POD for Bass. I run a Paul Reed Smith through the POD though my primary instrument is bass guitar.

    I've worked in studios for nearly 20 years and the POD is FAR AND AWAY the best direct-out preamp I've ever heard for guitar. It is NOT a mult-effects processor though it does have some onboard FX, which are slightly better than average, but with the way digital recording and technology is today, you can get a TERRIFIC rackmount FX unit for under $300 so that isn't a big deal.

    The POD is THE preamp of choice in nearly every studio in America. Since it was invented almost 5 years ago, it has quickly become a staple of major recording studios. Many guitarists have used it EXCLUSIVELY in the studio for sounds or mixed sounds from the POD with live amps.

    Using it in conjunction with the computer/midi software really increases the things you can do with it but I don't do that much. There is a plug-in called Amp Farm that is used with the POD for apparently unreal results.

    The thing that I love about the POD is that it really does create the sound of speakers. It's one thing to make a good sounding preamp. Lots of companies have done that for the guitar. It is another altogether to create one that you can literally plug in direct to the board and away you go.

    I have heard terrific things about the Line 6 combo amps and heads too, but have never tried them. Depending on what kind of music you like, you can get just about anything out of the POD. In fact, basically every electric guitar I've recorded in my studio over the past 2 years has been with the POD including replacing amps guys have brought in to use. The POD blew them away.

    Of course, no one has walked in with an old Marshall Plexi, a Bogner or a Boogie lately, but that is just nitpicking! :)

    One thing about the POD if you are running direct is that it won't feedback without speakers designed to do so. If you monitor though your headphones or through studio monitors, you will have a hard time getting feedback. Unlike some processors that artifically create feedback, the POD works just like an amp. Feedback is produced as a result of "standing waves" created between the pickups of your guitar and the speaker which is why standing in front of a Marshall stack will make your guitar go SSSQQQQUUUUUEEEEEEELLLLLL, especially if you have a Strat or something with single coil pickups.

    The POD will feedback if the speakers allow it but it won't artificially create that sound.

    By the way, I would suggest, if it is possible, running the POD through some tube preamp prior to going direct to digital. Tubes are essential to warming up digital equipment. You can get an ART Tube MP for about $100 and it is fine. Just something to warm up the signal on the way down.

    <b>After a while, guitarists find their one true electric sound, and rarely do you hear it coming from one effects processor and little else. If it does come from a processor, it comes a series of rackmounts that (with 24 things working together) get one sound. Eventually, everyone heads in a simpler direction, and especially with a hot Jackson, you'll find the guitar and your touch doing the work for you after a while.

    I had a couple of billion-effect rackmounts in my day, but eventually I scaled down and let the guitar (Brian May model Guild) and my fingers do the talking. That's really where 95% of it comes from, REGARDLESS of what you send it through.</b>

    I think you misunderstand the POD. It is not an effects processor. It is a preamp that includes a really incredible speaker emulation module. I agree that, live, it won't cut it by itself. Nothing can substitute a great amp and speakers, but it is hard to beat in the studio.

    And, I agree that your instrument and how you play greatly determine the outcome of your playing, however, there is no instrument more impacted by signal processing, amplifiers and speakers. Unlike acoustic instruments or even bass, which is rarely effected or altered on the way down, electric guitars transients are dramatically effected by what it runs through.

    Additionally, rock music requires even more external support for the guitar because of the wide range of required sounds from clean and distorted to overly effected, etc.

    <b>Ten years into playing, I'm going straight into my amp (rackmount 60-watt Fender tube head) and my 4X12, with nothing else clouding my sound up. I'm not exactly looking for clean, but I am looking for myself, and I don't plan on finding that in anything made of silicon (unless I'm seeing my reflection in some Carmen Electra's bosoms).</b>

    While I understand your philosophy, that doesn't work for everyone. I'll give you an example from my own practice. I had been playing bass about 8 years in a wide variety of situations - rock, jazz, blues, hard rock, pop, r&b, etc. - and I found it very frustrating that I couldn't find a way to create a great sound for playing with my fingers as well as slapping with my thumb, which I used a lot in some situations.

    The problem was that finger-style playing really required more midrange than slapping does. If you listen to Limp Bizkit or Korn, you hear that heavily scooped out bass sound they use - lots of lows and highs with virtually no mid range whatsoever. That's fine if you are playing with a pick or playing funk and striking the strings really hard but I wanted a way to do that and still be able to add mid's for playing with fingers because it helped cut through the wash of guitars and drums.

    Well, I went to the NAMM (National Association of Music Merchants) show in Chicago in 1990 (or was it 89?) and saw the prototype of the ADA MB1. Many guitarists were using the MP1 but this was it's bass preamp cousin. I thought that it would be perfect because I could switch sounds via midi from one to the other on stage with a footswitch.

    I got the 39th one of the factory line and found that, once I got it, there was one preset that sounded so good, I never changed it. I actually still have it in my setup today (11 years later) though I have modified that one sound a bit.

    The moral here is that, quite often, it is the perfect blend of the right instrument and the right amp (or effects) that creates the comfort level needed to be at your best. Basketball players won't wear sneakers they don't like so why should anyone play something that makes them uncomfortable? Your best playing is done in an environment where you are enjoying yourself. For you, it might be just your Fender amp and cab. For someone else, it might be a Gretch and a Vox AC30. For others, it might be a rack full of effects running direct or a synth guitar. To each his or her own.

    Just my 2 cents.
     
  10. Surfguy

    Surfguy Member

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    Thanks Jeff! Did you happen to upgrade to the Pod 2.0 Pro chip? If so, then is it worth it and what did you gain by that? And, will the Pod emulate amps well on any amplifier, like my GK?

    Also, I noticed you mentioned a ART Tube MP? I guess I'm not understanding what you mean by "warming up the signal". Would this benefit my set up or is this something that only professional recording artist need be concerned with?

    Last, do you recommend ART effects processors as an add-on for multi-effects in addition to the Pod(maybe at a later time)? I have no experience with ART....I have heard some say they are the bomb and others say they suck. Just wondering your professional opinion. I have not actually heard an ART effects rack in operation but I have always been weary of multi-effect units because of my previous bad experiences with a Roland unit and single effects Bose pedals....which seem to add noise to the signal in almost all cases.

    thanks
     
  11. Jeff

    Jeff Clutch Crew

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    I don't believe I'm using 2.0, but I've been told that there is a marked difference between 1.0 and 2.0.

    Anytime you run into a PC or a digital recorder, the signal is transformed from an analog to a digital signal. The machine uses an A/D - D/A converter to do this. Most typical soundcards have 16 or 20 bit converters (20 is fine) but they do not have the resolution of better converters and interfaces like the kinds used in pro studios.

    Even with the higher end converters (which can run into the tens of thousands of dollars), most engineers and musicians who've been around studios can hear the difference between a sound recorded with tubes and one without. Tubes add a certain amount of depth and "transparency" to sound that is sometimes lost in the conversion process if tubes are not used.

    A tube MP is a desktop device that has a single preamp tube in it and a volume knob. It just allows the signal to pass through a tube source adding some of the depth and transparency I mentioned. Most digital studios have as much tube outboard gear they can get their hands on and tube preamps can cost thousands of dollars for the good one's.

    Because you are using a PC with a low-end sound card, you'll probably want as much help going down as you can get. You can upgrade to a decent interface for around $500 if you want later to help improve that as well. In addition, decent recording software has come WAY down in price over the past few years.

    To be honest, I avoid external effects gear. My digital recorder has built in 24-bit effects processors. They, on many occassions, outperform the rackmount versions unless I'm willing to spend a ton of money. Because of the advent of digital technology, FX units have come WAY down in price, but their value has also suffered.

    Most computer recording software packages offer FX plug-ins that blow away even some of the very high end FX units.
     
  12. mrpaige

    mrpaige Member

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    Back in my day when I played guitar often, I just plugged my Jackson strat-body directly into my Fender Dual Showman halfstack and played. For recording, I'd stick a mic up to the cabinet.

    It was a good heavy metal sound, which is all I played at the time.

    Stupidly, I sold the amp and the guitar several years ago. I could probably replicate that sound relatively easily, but I miss the bid ol' half stack, and I really miss that guitar (it was a great guitar. Maple fretboard, fast neck, active electronics, ugly-white/black crackle paint job and reverse headstock. Very 1988. I believe one was required to mousse one's hair and wear acid washed jeans while playing that guitar).

    But I'm still living in the mid-to-late '80s guitarwise. I've got a Kramer Baretta (also with a really bad paint job) and a Charvel Model 3, both of which I bought off eBay a few years ago.

    I'm so completely lost when it comes to all this cool digital, computerized, fancy stuff. I feel so left out.
     
  13. Surfguy

    Surfguy Member

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    Well, I didn't like the idea of being confined to one effect at a time. Also, since the unit requires an optional foot pedal at another $200 or so....I decided to just go with a foot unit made by Digitech...the Digitech GNX2 . This unit has received good reviews as well. It can emulate amps and has many effects where you can combine up to 11 effects at once. You can do the MIDI stuff, create combined amp/cabinet sounds, has 64 factory pre-set sounds and you can store up to 64 sounds, it has stomp boxes emulating all the popular distortions, and....best of all...it's a floor pedal unit with a delay pedal, expression pedal, etc. . I think this is more to my liking. Obviously, since it is a foot pedal, it is better equipped for performing than recording. This unit costs $399.

    I can't wait until Christmas to play with my new toy! I love getting new guitar stuff. I may have to upgrade my amp next as my GK 250 ML is a pretty old model....may have to go with a stack or something. This is sweet...I may have to get semi-serious on guitar now. The bottom line is I just love to play and the more you play....the better you are.

    Anyway, thanks for the advice and info all. Happy guitaring!

    Surf
     

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