Desert Scar says, "Welcome to Planet Bizzarro." Bibby's FG percentage is higher because he took almost twice as many shots as Jason Williams. Bibby's three-point percentage may be higher than Jason Williams's, but Bibby also didn't have to take those three point shots against playoff defenses. Regarding Bibby's higher assist average -- what else are you going to do if you can't legitimately score. [See my Jason Kidd reference.] Bibby has higher scoring and rebounding averages because (1) Jason Williams plays with more talented players (than Bibby) and (2) defenses are not set up to stop Bibby -- at least not in the regular season. Jason Williams not playing "meaningful" minutes has less to do with his effectiveness and more to do with Adelman's incompetence/need to have things done his way. (Adelman Dierker-ed the fourth quarter rotation.) Q: On what freakin' planet is Mike Bibby considered a better player than Jason Williams? A: Planet Bizzarro University (S) Blue
Planet Bizzarro is where the JWill supporters are from. JWill's shooting % and assists should have been BETTER because he plays with better shooters and players around him. Bibby, playing on a worse team, would have more difficult shots to take. Look at it this way, Bibby's shooting was more than .015 higher than the rest of his team, JWill's was a pretty massive .042 lower. You wonder WHY Adelman had to put in No J Bobby Jackson?
I don't really understand the "Bibby didn't take shots against playoff defenses" argument. Both of these guys were in the Western conference. Both played the same teams the same number of times during the regular season. JWill certainly has played more playoff games than Bibby, but I don't think Scar was comparing playoff numbers (impossible). So how has Jason Williams played against harder defense?
Player: "Coach, who do we play next?" Coach: "Vancouver." Player: "When do we start practice on defending Air Bibby?" Coach: "In the off-season." University (Summer Time) Blue
Player: "Coach, who do we play next?" Coach: "Vancouver." Player: "When do we start practice on defending Air Bibby?" Coach: "We're not playing defense." University (Didn't know the Cowboys played in the NBA.) Blue
Player: "Coach, who do we play next?" Coach: "Vancouver." Player: "When do we start practice on defending Bibby?" Coach: "When he gets at least one cool nick-name." University (Bizzarro Bibby?) Blue
I see, and I suppose the conversations against the Kings went something like this: Player: "Who do we play next, Coach?" Coach: "Sacremento" Player: "How are we going to defend Webber?" Coach: "Webber?! Screw him, we have to stop that unstoppable scoring machine Jason Williams! Don't let the shooting percentage fool you. He is an amazing shooter, but for some reason, every team in the league defends Jason Williams much better than, say, Mike Bibby!" Player: "Whatever you say, Coach"
Not every team -- just the ones in the playoffs. University (Simon says, Jason Williams is miles ahead of Bibby.) Blue
Let me just finish out this run: Coach: "We will double him, get the ball out of his hand, and slack off others" Player: "Do we double off Vlade??" Coach: "No that is not quite what I am thinking" Player: "Do we get the ball our of Christe's hands??" Coach: "No, that isn't it either" Player: "Do we slack off Peja??" Coach: "Hell no, don't give that guy an inch of space, try again" Player: "What then could we do??" Coach: "We double off White Chocolate, we slack off him begging him to shoot, and at all costs put the rock in his hands for him to try to make a play 3x more difficult than necessary considering the offensive skills around him. Player: "Oh, I got it!!!!"
For all you misguided souls who think it's harder for a point guard to put up numbers in a no pressure situation on a bad team, 2 words for you Damon Stoudamire Bibby is a poor man's Damon, Damon is more active defensively and has twice Bibby's explosiveness and scoring ability
look university blue and kobe shaq you can have jason williams and continue to pray he has his head on straight but ill take the better producer, in this case mike bibby both of your logic doesnt fly blue: defenses didnt sag off of bibby any more than they did jason williams, you have to do better than that and if adelman is such a bad coach how come he has the 2nd or 3rd best team in the league kobeshaq-stoudamires situation isnt the same, he had only a marcus camby able to score on his team at the time, bibby had dickerson and rahim getting 16-20 apiece as well
I dis-agree. Teams approach playing (bottow-dwellar) Vancouver and (playoff-contender) Sacramento differently; defenses approach playing "White Chocolate" differently than "what's-his-name." [Confidential to Raven Lunatic: Playoff defense is played at a higher intensity.] ... Adelman is a bad coach, to say the least, because he took a young, up-and-coming, talented, and gifted PG and reduced him, psychologically, to self-doubt and questioning his role on the team. The question isn't why Adelman is a bad coach if he has the second/third best team in the league. The question is why isn't Sacramento the best team in the league? But, I suppose, if you're Sacramento and you do not mind settling for second or third best, Bibby is the right choice. University (New Astros Coach: Rick Adelman?) Blue
University Blue, Why do you think that Jason Williams is that good? Hell, he is only the 3rd best Jason Williams to play basketball. The top 2 being Jason Williams of Duke and retired PF Jayson Williams, formerly of the Nets. Do you think that running down the court with a 3 on 1 fast break and seeing JWill fire up a wild 3 is a good play? There's no question he has the talent, but he has never shown one time that he wanted to work on his game. Maybe he really hated Rick Adelman and Sacramento, but I guarantee you that probably the whole King team is glad to have Mike Bibby instead of JWill. Why, in the hell, did Bobby Jackson play so much in the 4th quarter of Kings games last year if JWill was so good?
"Guarantee," huh? Why did Jackson play so many minutes in the fourth quarters of games? Like Dr. Laura, Adelman is NOT a psychologist. How well did Adelman's fourth quarter rotation work against an LA team that had poor transition defense? University (.60 posts/day) Blue
Manny, a little advice that I have known for a while now, but have neglected to follow myself...and I am ashamed of that. Do no argue with University Blue over Jason Williams. He has this nice little situation set up in his mind where Jason Williams is one of the most talented PGs in the league, and somehow all failings are someone else's fault. Somehow one single NBA coach has managed to turn the guy into a basket case, mentally. Somehow, the fact that this happens doesn't tell him that Jason Williams never HAD the mental toughness necessary to compete at the highest level. But UB is a smart guy, at his core. When you try to argue with him, he comes up with little things like "playoff defense", which is completely intangible and unprovable by just about any statistic. And he will argue with you over it to the bitter end. All the while he inserts little pithy, wity sayings in his posts belittling you in his own, subtle way. You can never get him to admit that he picked the wrong horse long ago. You can never explain that he is merely following that horse into mediocrity, and eventual career death...when someone finally takes pity on the horse and shoots it in the head (cuts him from the team). But you never feel like anything has been gained when you argue with UB, because everybody loses. Every time. Just some advice. Take it for what it is.
My opinions: 1.Jason Williams is extremely talented, and anyone who questions this is stupid 2.Jason Williams has very bad decision making and loses focus, and anyone who questions this is stupid Rick Adelman was the wrong coach for Jason. Instead of trying to stop his wildness, he should have tried to harness it. Jason, without a doubt, has great handles and passing skills. Everyone knows this, but the obvious problem is that sometimes he'll forget it's the NBA, not the playground. Highlights are nice, but winning is what matters. We all know he shouldn't be throwing up these bombs, but do you remember the Phoenix series in last year's playoffs. When he makes those shots, he looks crazy. HE needs to find a middle ground. If he ever does, he really can be one of the top point guards without a doubt. The bad things is I don't think this will happen when he's playing for the third worst team(GSW & chi). His stats do look nice in the PRE-season, but we'll see what he does in the REAL season. I'm sure if he controls himself, everyone will be jumping on his bandwagon.
Bibby is easily the most overrated PG in the league. He was a nice college player, but he lacks something to be a great player. He doesn't seem to be that athletic, nor is he great at any single aspect.
we arent debating mike bibby vs the marburys and francis's of the world its him vs jason williams, for this kings team mike bibby is a better fit-jason williams has talent but please the mans head is not there all the time-if im a team trying to win a championship ill take mike bibby over jason williams anyday of the week-we arent talking about a stud pg with a great work ethic and attitude(ie francis) we are talking about white chocolate, who jacks up crazy shots, only cares about being flashy and doesnt listen very well to coaches thats all i have to say on this matter
"Yeah, Cato too. See how many rocket fans are holding their breath?" Gettingbranded- THe difference is Cato has athletic talent which IM means he looks like a NBA player. Jwill has basketball talent, but it is untapped potential. He can do all the crazy stuff (no look passes, 3 point shooting). Plus Jwill has fuun on the court while Cato seems to think getting on the court is his obstacle to getting a paycheck. Jwill's problem is he doesn't understand (or won't do) what it takes to get better . He doesn't like playing D and makes alot of mental mistakes. Cato just doesn't care.
