This notion of practice during the regular season is garbage. You don't learn at practice during the regular season. Players aren't going full tilt, coach is installing game plans, etc. etc. etc. You learn during practice in training camp and after that you have to learn in the games. We were up by 30 last night. JVG could have called timeout and gotten his bench including VSpan at least 6 minutes. Better yet, he could have put in VSpan a little bit earlier and let him run a few plays with the first unit. That's how you develop players during the regular season. It was obvious from the start of the 4th quarter that we weren't playing Pheonix or San Antonio or any other team that could come back from a 29 point deficit in one quarter. VSpan played 3 minutes against one of the 3 worst teams in the league, in a game where we were leading by 29 points to start the 4th quarter, Alston shot 4 for 15 from the field, and Alston and Head combined to go 2 for 8 from 3 point land. It's pretty obvious that he is in the proverbial "doghouse".
Spanoulis doesn't seem to be very happy on the bench. Everyone else is cheering and jumping out of their seats. Spanoulis looks kind of mopey to me.
jopatmc - I agree there comes a point where a guy has to figure it out in game situations. VSpan and Novak are not there yet. Things like defensive concepts and rotations, and offensive spacing can (must) be learned in practice. They both have shown they don't really have half a clue of what's going on when they're in the game in terms of rotations and play. For example, I saw a couple of occasions in the garbage time last night where Padgett was telling Novak where he needed to be. That's why you'll see Novak in for one possession plays where JVG can tell him "stand here" or "stand here, set a screen here, and go there". Honestly, I expected Novak to pick it up a little better...but watch him out there. Watch him on defense - he looks like Bambi on ice skates hesitating back and forth. Spanoulis is actually a little better on both sides of the ball Further, you can recognize what is lack of game time (like the pass to Hayes VSpan got a turnover on, is a very slight adjustment that he corrected 2 plays later), and things that need to be philosophy shifts - like his defensive strategy and awareness... Edit: As far as the intensity of practice...you don't think guys like VSpan and JL3 will be going hard in practice at each other? IRockU - I'm through with you. You just don't get it. For someone who appears shocked and appalled when others "attack" or say "silly" things in response to your arguments, this is yet another attempt by you to be condescending. You're hopeless. You apparently don't watch Rockets or NBA basketball, and you have no concept of the difference between picking up a foul 25 feet from the basket and a foul that prevents an easy basket. The Rockets are near the bottom of the league in fouls committed for a reason - it's part of their successful defensive philosophy. The foul problem has nothing to do with the potential for VSpan to foul out. It has everything to do with VSpan's inability to play within the Rockets defensive concept to date. Once again, this is not to say Span won't fix it eventually. The NBA is just different. Battier was a fantastic defender in college (I think DPOTY even), had 4 years at one of the top programs, and was lit up for 56 his rookie year by Kobe. He had to adjust. A couple years later, and he's a stud defender in the NBA. Like Battier, and virtually every other player in the NBA, Spanoulis has to adjust. This isn't Europe, and nothing he did in Europe matters here.
Well, he got that same sullen look when he was pictured in the millionare-pro-athletes-volunteering-for-community-work grocery packing photo-op. I bet you rarely see a joyous Head, either. He and Spanoulis are among those deadpan expressionless type of players, which are not to be molded into the same stereotype as your every day NBA ballers.
I agree with you on Novak. He looks like a JV player tossed into a varsity game. Still, we were up by 29 against one of the worst teams in the NBA to start the fourth quarter, on a night when Rafer and Head weren't exactly lighting it up. And I'm not advocting giving him 30 mpg right now. But 3 minutes in a blowout when the game was effectively decided in the 3rd quarter? Even Novak should have gotten more minutes. My wish would be to have one game where both Rafer and Luther are injured and JVG is forced to play VSpan with the starters when McGrady and Yao are healthy. Just one game. Have we forgotten what happened to Luther last year? The best thing that happened for Luther's development were those injuries. JVG freely admits that there is no way that Luther would have gotten the minutes he got except for injuries. But look at how Luther developed? Does anybody really believe that Luther would be the player he is today if he hadn't gotten all those minutes last year and had just rode the bench and observed and played in practice??? And no, he isn't going to learn much playing in practice against JLIII. Honestly, he's probably not going to learn much playing against Rafer. He will learn more by playing in an actual game with McGrady and Battier telling him where to go and what to do, then he will learn in 10 practices going up against JLIII.
I used to....I covered the Spurs under Larry Brown for KSAT 12 in San Antonio...and he is right, most in season practices are really a joke....it is about protecting your body and going over offensive and defensive sets....not at full speed mind you...but at about half speed. There are exceptions, when teams have 3 days off, generally the middle day is a more aggressive practice, but that doesn't happen often. V-Span will not be able to prove anything in practice, or very little.. Look, Hayes was doing great last year in the preseason and in practice and JVG still cut him..... And for whomever said that Tony Parker's numbers were significantly better than V-Span's in November and December, that is a joke, right? Tony Parker was starting and playing with GREAT players...V-Span is playing occasionally....AND...out of position. DD
Going over sets/watch game films, etc have a certain value, or at least coaches seems to believe that it does since many teams opt to keep their young players with the team rather than sending them down to the DLeague for that very reason (or at least so they have said publicly). I also think there are assistant coaches who work with the young players on a more individual basis and report their progress back to the head coach (like Thibodeau does with Yao). I would imagine the 2nd round picks don't get as much attention as Yao, but there has to be some monitoring. Novak said he had a meeting with JVG in which NOvak asked what he needs to do to get some PT. He said JVG gave him a list of very specific goals which he has been working on. Perhaps Spanoulis has a similar set of goals he's working on.
Did you just call me a RACIST? I simply said that he did not understand the saying I used because English was not his first language....it is a very common american saying. Waht in the holy hell is racist about that?? I hope you have a legitimate reason for that accusation because you cant be further from the truth if you tried. as for losing your respect.....I have no desire to be respected by someone who will take a statement like that to level a most serious charge against my name and as for you IrockU...enjoy yourself during what time you last here, I have no further desire to interact with you. You are unable to even understand what I'm saying to you, therefore wasting my time and the time of everyone who was forced to read our exchange.... I'll not make that mistake again. .
I would hope VSpan was smart enough to get that list. But, it would be interesting to see what it contained. How does anyone prove anything unless they are on the floor. VSpan's list would obviously start with cutting down turnovers. Just can't prove that in practice when you are playing with the scrubs.
My guess it starts with doing well aginst "the scrubs" in practice, maybe meeting some fitness milestone, then playing well if you are in games during mopup time.. then if you get a chance due to injury, show up and beat out whoever is in front of you for some minutes. Again, I am not certain about this, but I think there are ways to improve even if you are not playing in a real game. Yao credits watching a ton of film during rehab partly for his 2nd half improvement, for example...
<object width="425" height="350"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/GeM-jB0eJtI"></param><param name="wmode" value="transparent"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/GeM-jB0eJtI" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" wmode="transparent" width="425" height="350"></embed></object> Just watch this and TELL me he is not already a better passer than Rafer. V-Span is our PG of the future.....only.....if he gets a chance to get his confidence. I would hope that JVG would develop him a little bit to where this year is not a complete waste. Play V-Span 10 minutes a game....let see what he can do...because it is clear he is going to be WAY better than Rafer.... DD
go back and read the whole exchange. I did NOT use language as a argument...that much is obvious to anyone that actually read it. I dont think you did. did you? you picked that statement out from a post adn didnt bother to go read what led to it...adn then you haev the AUDACITY to accuse me of something that sickens me. If my skin was a little thinner I might report you for your constant unfounded accusations of racism. but I wont since I frankly think any other reasonable intelligent members here sees this for what it really is....and Clutch is already busy enough without having to look in to this accusation from you. if you got more to say to me, dont hold it in.
On a team that moves without the ball does the PnR and sets screens and passes the ball, he is NAILS ! He lead an average GREEK team to beat the US in the World Semi finals....and he beat....Wade, Lebron, Battier, Howard, Melo....basically ALL NBA superstars. V-Span can play...and with the right team he would be tearing it up.....RIGHT NOW ! DD
<object width="425" height="350"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/hyMrm8R_8fE"></param><param name="wmode" value="transparent"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/hyMrm8R_8fE" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" wmode="transparent" width="425" height="350"></embed></object> Rafer is a way better passer than VSpan. Just watch, the backboard pass to Arajuo is plain sick. Its not clear to me that he'll ever be better than Rafer. He's aggressive for sure but he doesn't have a shot, might not be 6'4", is an average athlete with an average handle. Old saying, if the kid could play he would play. Right now he's got too many limitations to let him have more playing time than mop up minutes in a blowout.
Rafer rarely passes on the PnR, because he sucks at it. He has good handles, but NO finish at the rim....his only benefit is that he is a decent 3pt shooter. BUT, with all the WIDE OPEN looks, he should be shooting WAY better than he is..... Rafer is a WAY WAY WAY WAY below average PG.......and the stats bear it out. V-Span.....clearly has been struggling with his shot, but his turnovers are NOT all that bad, he is about 1 turnover a game....and his assist to turnover ratio is not terrible for a 2 guard...but he should be playing PG...... I would like to see V-Span get some minutes at the position he translates to in the NBA....PG...since ours currently sucks balls. When is the last time Rafer took a charge, or stayed in front of his man? Rafer is good at stripping the ball, but worthless as a one on one defender.... DD
THat was me and I was mostly speaking to his efficiency and shooting ability. He only had one game in his first two months with 5 turnovers...while averaging 25-8 mpg. Further, the fact that he was starting on a team that was 21-7 at the end of November should say something. Also at point for them - Antonio Daniels (more points in 3 fewer minutes), Terry Porter (old but putting up 5 and 3 in 20 mpg), and crappy Jason Hart (puting up 2.5 ppg and ~1.5 for rpg and apg in 9.2 mpg). Do you think VSpan would have started over all of them, considering his numbers are about equal to Hart's in more minutes (10.5)? I don't think it is fair to say he is Parker or Ginobili because his game is nothing like theirs and they are both All Stars. Span's defense could develop to be like Manu's but that is really about it as they are just too different. He needs time to develop into a role player, so no need to get carried away on the all star comparisons.
