Do take a look at his rebounding numbers too. He sucks at that too. He is one of the main reasons Yao picks up so many cheap fouls. Juwan is a cancer. Simple as that.
Again, JVG has said he wants a PF that spaces the floor (ie. can hit open J's). The only people that wants a 'banger' are on this BBS. yawn.
Right on. This has been discussed many times before and I don't get it either. I believe JVG is right this time. When you have the best inside threat in the NBA at C, your PF should compliment him. For the most part, "banger" PFs are a dying breed but some people are slow to accept this. That all said, I wouldn't mind having a younger big body on the team to play a few backup minutes. On the subject of JH hate, it's an unfortunate (and silly) phenomenon that infects a few on this board. I'm amazed at how animated and lengthy some people get when blasting JH. Enough is never enough for them. When you repeat the same exact things 10+ times (especially insults), your point of view is understood as much as it will be.
And sadly, the infection has control of more than "a few". We've got 3 very different types of PF's (4 if you count Novak)...let 'em play. None of them is going to be hitting on all cylinders every night. Battier's the closest to it and he'll get the bulk of the minutes. But there'll be nights when rebounding is premium or a foul line J or 3 point shooting. Tying krosfyah, yours and my sentiments together, the Rox need an Eddie Griffin PF...only w/o the head problems. That's something that's easier to address in Free Agency and numerically high draft picks than trading a $6M contract. IMHO, PF mobility is the key not a "banger" PF.
Why taint your analysis with an Eddie Griffin and his atrocious game metaphor when Robert Horry is a lot more appropriate for both practical and sentimental reasons.
i can never understand all the hate on Juwan. Veteran players on the bench are especially valueable during the playoffs because they can handle pressure (Miami heat for example, has a ton of washup players. anyone remember the game-winner by Payton in the playoffs?)
i would tak it one step further, juwan is not bad even as a starting PF in this league. People often over look what he did good at. What is true is that he doesn't fit well next to Yao defensively. He consistently get out-speed and he suk at rebounding and blocking.
Because Horry is older and at this point in time pretty one dimensional. That's not even factoring in that Horry has a strong history of being a slacker until the playoffs. Unlike most here, I don't have a sentimental streak.
My problem with the current set up is that historically JHo has been superior as a starter (or even more inferior as a sub) and his new role appears to be strictly a support, back up 4 (and perhaps 5?). Thus, my desire is for a b/u who is accustomed to bench minutes and aggressive court time, like Najera, Scallabrine or Cardinal. Scallabrine + Grant('s contract) for Howard seems doable to me from both teams' perspectives.
Juwan handle pressure! LOL! Good one!! And to top it off...you drew up an analogy of Juwan's post-season absence to Payton's long history of success. Payton used to carry Seattle in the 90s. What exactly was Juwan doing all those time? That's right, stinking up whichever team he was on.
Solely for metaphorical purposes - unless you're openly advocating the return of somebody with a Griffin-esque game (horrific defense, horrific outside shooting, very good shot blocking - honestly it doesn't get much more 1 dimensional than that) rather than an Horry-esque one (decent defense, decent outside shooting, decent shot blocking) Although I'd gladly say that even a washed up Horry would be preferable to Juwan Howard playing lots of minutes.
Lot lot LOT better. Horry would still open a can'o'whup @ss on Juwan even though he can hardly jump now. Hell I would even throw in Ryan Bowen.
Never cared for Horry after he was traded and never wanted him back. Sentimentality has a way of tainting reality... http://www.nba.com/hotzones/popup.html Horry has built a career out of being in the right place at the right time for the right price with a minimum amount of seasonal energy expended.
if we're going to compare "hotzones", I'd take a look at Eddie Griffin's or as I call it "Composition in Blue, by E. Griffin"
If I was a betting man, I would bet that there are fewer than 5 games next season where Juwan hitting that foul line jump shot is the difference between a win and a loss. And I would bet that in those games where it is the difference, that over 50% of the time he misses it. I would also bet that rebounding, defense, and the 3 point shooting will be the difference makers in more than 70 of our games next year. I would also bet that Juwan won't be in the game in those situations. It is really simple. If we are in a game that is won or lost on a Juwan foul line jump shot, you can take it to the bank that we have either been horrible from the 3 point line or our defense sucked. Essentially, the more minutes Juwan gets, the more critical that foul line jump shot is going to be because what it means is junky teams are running it down our backs and we are having to hit everything in sight to stay in the game against them. Because we do not have a prayer of stopping an uptempo team with both Yao and Juwan logging major minutes together. You guys keep bringing up the word hate. I'll say it again. I don't hate Juwan. He is probably one of the more upstanding citizens on our team. And he's a good locker room presence. And he don't take no ... on the floor, witness Mike James last year. Those are all admirable traits. But the facts speak for themselves, the play on the floor speaks for itself. When him and Yao are in there together, we are too slow and teams chew us up. Everybody chews us up. Now, I'm okay with him being on the team........I guess........if we can't get rid of him someways. But, he should be playing minutes behind Yao, and if he gets out there and the J is draining, he should get a few more minutes. But if the J is clunking, he should be yanked as soon as Yao has had a blow, or he should be yanked for Deke and bring in Novak to shoot bombs. What is appalling is people on this board think is he okay, or he is a good player that is servicable next to Yao. Or worse yet, guys that think he is "not bad as a pf". You can't name one thing he is good at on the floor. His best traits are all off the court traits. Tell you what. I'll quit saying anything about Howard if everybody else will quit saying he is decent and should start, or he is average, or he is a top 25 PF, etc. etc. etc. It's all pipe dreams and silliness.
If we had a defensive minded PF, we wouldn't have to worry about Yao picking up those extra petty fouls. We've all seen how many times clean blocks are called fouls in this league as it is. Maybe when a guard beats his man Juwan could jump in there rather than Yao. With a real PF, we could dominate the league in rebounds as well as blocks. Then again, Howard is ranked the 35th best power forward on nba.com! link
jopatmc, I wouldn't call you a JH hater. At least you stick to facts without the dumb name-calling. It's just that the repetition and length about him is ridiculous. This offseason there is so much more to talk about than JH it isn't funny. I'm not even a JH defender and I think the rambling tirades against him are stupid. I can only imagine how others feel. The only agreement I'd like to make is let's not hijack any more threads on other subjects into tirades against JH. In this thread, say anything you want about him and take as long as you please. But please don't go off into orbit in another thread when a poster says something good about the guy. Let's try and be adults here and have discussions without trudging up the same garbage repeatedly. Again, jopatmc, you are not a JH hater. But IMO, you focus way too much on him when Yao, Tracy, Battier, Bonzi, Rafer, Head, Novak make better subject material. Of course, you are free to post anyting you like at any time.
