I think most of us on the board are in agreement that the Snyder pick up was pretty good for the rockets considering they only had to give up a TE and a conditional 2nd round pick. But now that it seems the Bulls are willing to part with J.R. Smith for 2 second round picks and Howard Eisley, whom the bulls would cut. Knowing these facts whom would you rather have traded for Snyder or Smith. I'm in argument with my friend cuz i think the J.R. Smith deal would have been better for the rockets.
FG%: Snyder 45%, Smith 39% Snyder has a positive effect on teammates' performance, Smith does not: http://www.82games.com/0506/0506NOKP.HTM Snyder lead the Nevada Wolfpack to the first ever Sweet 16 in school history, Smith is doing well at the EBC. Snyder cost cash and a possible switch of 2nd round picks, Smith cost 2 second round picks. Smith is a shooting guard who can really neither shoot nor guard.
i'm guessing the rockets could have pursued and possibly obtained jr smith if they wanted to. they chose snyder. smith has potentially more upside but i think there is a motivational problem with him that snyder doesn't appear to have. all things fairly equal i think the rockets/van gundy are more inclined to take a player with high intensity and try to channel that, then take a guy that they need to get on his a$$ to play harder.
Let's break this down like Dr. Jack: Physical attributes: In terms of size, athleticism and agility, they're pretty close. But I would give a slight edge to Snyder because he seems to use his physical tools more than Smith is willing to. Offensive Skills: I've seen a bunch of video on Smith and I didn't come away impressed with his offensive abilities. All he does is float on the perimeter and spot up for 3 pointers. I didn't see him display any kind of handle, or the ability to move without the ball and shoot on the go. As for Snyder, I haven't seen him play as much, but the reports say that he's a pretty decent slasher, and it seems like Van Gundy thinks he can shoot, so I'll give him the benefit of the doubt. Defensive skills: They've both got the physical tools to be good defenders, but it seems like they've both got problems with consistency. Although it appears that Smith has it worse since he supposedly got into Byron Scott's doghouse because he wasn't playing enough defense (according to the Hornets message board). So Snyder again. Mentality: Here's a good one. Do you go with a hothead in Snyder or a wallflower in Smith? It's pretty much a push since you can find examples of either personality type succeeding or failing in the NBA. So I guess I'm going with Captain Kirk. And don't think I'm just being a homer. I jumped off the Smith bandwagon long before we landed Snyder. I just wish that I could have scouted Snyder as well before mysynergysports went offline. Oh well.
MCable is right. Smith has no in-between game or off the ball movement. He can finish around the basket and knock down open jumpers, but that's about it. Just not there in terms of intangibles. One thing I don't like about Snyder's game is his weak bball IQ. Doesn't take care of the ball well and makes stupid decisions. As long as JVG specifies his role on the team (always look to feed Yao, attack the basket, get ahead in transition and take open jumpers), he should be fine.
I think JR Smith is pathetic and likely to stay that way for a while. Kirk Snyder is much more likely to become a contributing member of our team this year and next.
Agree. I'm very happy with Rockets management on this acquisition. I will give managment grief if, in my opinion (which is insignificant in the world of basketball but mine nonetheless) they make a stupid decision. But, when they make a good one like this, they deserve to have their praises sung.
Of all of the possible two guards we talked about the Rockets getting (outside of Mike James) none are as good as Snyder. This includes Smith, Stevenson, Ariza (if you wanted to use him at the 2), Buckner or whoever. What makes the Snyder aquisition so good in my mind is not just that we picked him up for basically nothing but that I did not think we would get someone as good or as young as him. Could Smith be as good as Snyder some day? Its possible. Is Smith as good as Snyder right now? No and its not even close.
Good stats! I think a lot of people like JR Smith because he is a bit more flashy. He has the "look" of good "upside potential." But when you look at the stats one sees that he isnt really improving. And then you take into account that Snyder basically took Smith's job at SG in NOK. Probably because Snyder played defense whereas Smith just kind of floats around. One thing I like about Snyder, is the guys is thick at 225lbs. He has the length and the weight to be able to body up defensively on any SG in the league and not get beaten down. You can't say that for Head and you can't say that for JR Smith. I think that's a big plus.
I agree with you and prefer Snyder over Smith and don't feel its even close. I would also vote Snyder most likely to punch a fan and in return get his a$$ kicked.
I voted for Snyder. It's possible that Smith has a higher ceiling, but he also comes with greater risk (and considering Snyder is not without risk himself, that's kind of dangerous). There is a reason Snyder took Smith's starting role last season. I think were we a team who was in absolute rebuilding mode (i.e. got rid of our stars and were completely starting over) that J.R. Smith would be the guy we'd want to gamble on if given the choice because he has more potential, but being that we have our two superstars and really just need reliable roleplayers, Kirk Snyder is the clear cut choice. Also, we got him for less than the Bulls are asking.
Some heavy hitters in this thread. I'd personally prefer JR Smith, and i think i'm the only person so far. The stats don't lie, 45% FG is what it is and considering the mentality the Rockets want on the floor JR Smith just doesn't fit into it, JVG doesn't like playing baby sitter. Byron Scott took offense to JR Smith's lack of wanting to improve and his attitude, isn't the first time Scott has had a run-in with a player and it won't be the last, but look at JR Smith's second season. his 3pt% spiked from 28% to 37%, his free throw shooting spiked from 69% to 82% (as piddly as the sample sizes are), this shows me a kid who has worked on his game, on his own terms and got benched because it wasn't the way Scott wanted him to approach it. Smith really has only two modes to his game, throwing down and shooting three's. But he does those pretty damn well you've got to give him that, his shooting stroke is smooth and if he gets an open look he'll hit the open three. He's a young player, Carmelo Anthony hasn't even made complete strides in his game yet in regards to moving without the ball, this kids only 21yrs old and i think Scott gave up on him way too early. This isn't Stromile "i've had six seasons to prove myself and done nothing" Swift, this is a young player who needs a second chance. Considering the coach, system and mentality, Kirk Snyder is the better fit for us. But i think Jr Smith can be a great player in this league, a borderline All-Star or even All-Star in the right situation. I just hope wherever he lands, he takes it upon himself to become a better player, because nothing frustrates me more than wasted talent.
As much of a pleasant surprise as it was to acquire Kirk Snyder I would have preferred JR. Smith. Coming out of HS and watching him perform in the Mcdonalds all star game and early on in his career (he's still young) I felt he reminded me a lot of Kobe Bryant at a young age in terms of their styles and abilities early on. I'm not saying JR Smith is the next Kobe by any means because he doesn't have the proper desire or attitude and work ethic but there's no denying with effort he can be great in the league.
I always worry when things seem too good to be true and I'm curious about these good qualities that you think separate him from other below average players like Stevenson, Smith, etc... Snyder, despite looking like a player that any team would want to hold on to (young, athletic, etc...) has been moved twice in 2 years by teams that needed help at SG and in both cases, the coaches of those teams suggested that he was uncoachable. Picking him up for nothing makes him someone to gamble on, but he seems like a long shot to me...
With effort stromile swift could be KG too. Heartless lazy players are what they are and I hope we never have another one on our roster.
I read (on draftexpress.com) that in the 2004 Predraft camp, Kirk Snyder had the highest draft combine testing score (vertical leap, bench press, lane agility, 3/4 court sprint) of everybody tested there. So, I wouldn't say Snyder has a low upside at all. In fact, between Smith and Snyder, Snyder was the one who made greater statistical improvment from year 1 to year 2, and what is upside but the ability to make improvements? Here's another interest set of stats: 10% of Snyder's shot attempts were dunks, of which he made 93.5%. 9% of Smith's shot attempts were dunks, of which he made 68.8%.
Defintely Snyder over Smith, Snyder beat out Smith for the starting job and was pretty productive, and the price we got Snyder at. Goood Deal. Snyder >>> Smith
2004 Pre-Draft Camp Combine Results Name Bench Press 185lbs Max. Vertical Jump Lane Agility Test Josh Childress 11 reps 36" 11.95 sec. Luol Deng 5 reps 31.5" 11.46 sec. Ben Gordon 12 reps 37.5" 11.28 sec Devin Harris 5 reps 37" 11.03 sec Dwight Howard 7 reps 35.5" 11.21 sec. Kris Humphries 22 reps 36" 11.33 sec. Andre Iguodala 4 reps 34.5" 11.17 sec. Luke Jackson 13 reps 36" 11.1 sec. Al Jefferson 3 reps 30" 13.08 sec. Shaun Livingston 0 reps 30" 10.72 sec. Jameer Nelson 15 reps 33.5" 10.95 sec. Emeka Okafor 22 reps 34" 12.32 sec. Peter John Ramos 2 reps 26.5" 12.61 sec. J.R. Smith 5 reps 35.5" 10.93 sec. Josh Smith 12 reps 39.5" 11.43 sec. Kirk Snyder 19 reps 35" 10.79 sec.
