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Win now attitude is a big mistake.

Discussion in 'Houston Rockets: Game Action & Roster Moves' started by Possum, Jul 5, 2006.

  1. don grahamleone

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    Don't forget, we're calling these moves, 'win now'. Not the Rockets organization. Win now is a mistakes because it makes you desperate. Moves made when you're desperate end up in a bad way. I truly believe that this offseason has been a moneyball offseason, not a 'win now'.
     
  2. barbourdg

    barbourdg Member

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    Battier is not an old, and he 100% has trade value in this league. Sixers wanted him in a Iverson trade, according to ESPN.

    How long can we dwell on Rudy Gay. The guy still has a shot of being a bust, as much as being a starter (or star) in this league.

    I was just as pissed trading him, but Boston preferred Telfair to him (and others), Minny said he gave a piss poor workout for them and had some weird altercation afterwards, and their was something that the Rockets did not like.

    Should the Rockets have gotten more for him, Yes.. But how many threads are we going to start on the same subject. :)
     
  3. mag

    mag Member

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    Who says good quality players want to come here? Let's face it, players go where the money is.
     
  4. ima_drummer2k

    ima_drummer2k Member

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    Totally agree. Yao and Tracy are no longer "young" by NBA standards. I'm not saying they should retire in the next 2 years, but at some point you have to face the fact that the future is now.

    We have a 2 or 3 year window, like you said. With TMac's back problems, you never know, he may never be the same player he was in 2005. Big men like Yao tend to break down earlier in their careers than smaller players.

    Again, I'm not suggesting that either one is done, I just think the window is much smaller than a lot of people here seem to think it is.
     
  5. RocketForever

    RocketForever Member

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    Get it right. Three years later, Yao will be 28 and Tracy will have just passed his 30th birthday.
     
    #25 RocketForever, Jul 5, 2006
    Last edited: Jul 5, 2006
  6. rserina

    rserina Member

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    I think moves like trading for Battier or signing a Mike James rather than keeping Gay and signing a Marcus Banks are bad moves assuming McGrady's back will never be healthy again, the current team needs another high-powered scorer or two to augment Yao, and the goal is to use a draft or two worth of lottery picks to add some star quality.

    But here's the kicker: the current lineup assembled is no worse that the 52-game winner of 2005, while the possible additions of guys like James, Lorenzen Wright, Marcus Banks, or the like make it a more athletic, equally as deep, and roughly as experienced team as in 2005, but with far more versatility. So, the win-now strategy which worked by surrounding two young stars with guys like Sura, James, Wesley, and Barry a few years ago and was within a game of advancing to the semis despite injuries to Howard and Sura and a lineup that included Bowen as our starting four, now has a more versatile and athletic group around those two stars. A couple of sound moves from now and we could be looking at a real contender for the next two years.

    And, just assuming the worst-case scenario occurs wherein McGrady's back cuts him to 47 games again next year, then we'll be in the lottery again, but with a much better draft lot, so much of this discussion is moot. But does anyone expect that to happen? I know the Rockets front office does not, so why would they plan that way.
     
  7. Manny Ramirez

    Manny Ramirez The Music Man

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    The more I think about it, the happier I am that we traded Rudy Gay. I like him a lot and I want to see him become a star in the league, but that NEVER would have happened for him playing under Gumby. So as much as it sucks that one of my favorite players was a Rocket for like 5 seconds only to be traded away, it was the best thing for him. Now the best thing for the Rockets would be to get rid of Gumby and his puppet, er boss in CD. Then maybe this team would really have a chance to fulfill its potential at being a contender instead of first round fodder for the Mavericks, Suns, and Spurs.
     
  8. eSwoosh

    eSwoosh Member

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    I actually said past three years, meaning more than three years. Past three years Tracy would be 31 and Yao would be almost 30...
     
  9. Possum

    Possum Member

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    This is not a rehash of the Gay trade! :) Its about the strategy that the current management is using. They just made moves that could make or break this team for the rest of our star players time here.

    The cons of going for broke this year greatly outway the pros. Just the opposite could be said of next year. In other words (IMO) there would of been less risk and more reward had we been patient and waited one more year before applying the win now game plan.
     
  10. thumbs

    thumbs Member

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    "Win Now" is always a philosophy the board can support.

    However, IMO most Rocket fans want a "win now with an eye focused on winning in the future" philosophy.
     
  11. gifford1967

    gifford1967 Member
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    Add to this, Yao has progressed significantly since the 2005 season.

    I have to say I'm torn between the win now and build for the future camps and it all hinges on T-Mac and his back. If he has another 2-3 good seasons left in him, we need to take full advantage of that. If he doesn't we're screwed and need to start planning for that.
     
  12. thewaterox

    thewaterox Member

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    That's why I can't understand how Mike James wants to come back to Houston especially for less money. :confused: He has his own bad experience here where he was traded away for a less talented player. He had a great year with the Raptors.

    He doesn't have to look to far for guys who got screwed by Houston's MGT. Just look what happened to Swift after he signed a MLE deal with the Rockets. There must be other benefits besides the team that he's considering like his family being in the Houston area.
     
    #32 thewaterox, Jul 5, 2006
    Last edited: Jul 5, 2006
  13. giddyup

    giddyup Member

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    It's always going to be tough to find 2-3 guys every year who can faciliatate a run to the title. If we don't keep and develop our own young players, we will always be desperately searching.
     
  14. declan32001

    declan32001 Member

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    C'mon man I was going to let Eswoosh's post go, because if I spent all my time replying to rookies I'd go insane. But you?

    You would do well to remember how many great centers hit their prime at 30. At the very least you should remember Moses and Dream. This idea that "the time is now" because we have T-Mac is short-sighted as hell an indicative of the moves we've made for two years.

    What if T-Mac's merely above-average (or worse) two years from now and Yao's an MVP candidate and we have a roster with the same weaknesses we have now? And yes, to me the trade and re-acquiring Mike James is retrograde thinking.

    I firmly believe Les is going to sell, and I hope CD writes a book.
     
  15. Dei

    Dei Member

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    "Win now" is alright. We have T-mac and Yao in their primes. If we didn't try to win now, we'd be p*****s. BUT, I don't agree with the methods they're trying to achieve this. Stupid choices. Gay AND Stro for just Battier? Raped. Period.
     
  16. Major

    Major Member

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    We've been "building for the future" for the past 8 years since we got Mobley & Francis. Then Cato was the future. And Shandon Anderson. And Mo Taylor. And Eddie Griffin. And Yao. And McGrady. You can't just keep getting younger every year and keep saying "well, let's build for the future". In the NBA, very few players stay with their own teams for 10 years, and very few teams look anything like they did even 5 years ago. Look at the Rockets - none of these guys were on the team even 5 years ago. That chances that Battier, Gay, or Stromile would have been here in 5 years is pretty low anyway, so why worry if a guy is 19, 23, or 27?

    At some point, players want to win now. And if you don't try to win now, you're going to lose your players and/or your fans. The Rockets are at that point now. Another wasted year of losing will cause more fans to leave the team and may start rumblings by McGrady being tired of the losing and wanting out, as he did in Orlando. Then you have to restart the whole damn process.

    Building for the future is a great idea in an emotionless team where you're not dealing with real people. For players who came here specifically to win now, you don't keep subjecting them to that. Besides which, McGrady, while young in real years, is not young in NBA years and his injury problems may give him a 2-3 year window to win.
     
  17. Possum

    Possum Member

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    Well put thumbs.
     
  18. thunderkyss

    thunderkyss Member

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    what is your idea of "filling in the necessary players??" ARe we going to put allstars at every position?? Let's say a Gary Payton at the point, Antoine Walker at Power Forward... Jerry Stackhouse can be our Small forward.....We've already got Yao at Center, TMac as the 2 gaurd...... surely we'll win a championship won't we??

    Then we can get Alonzo Mourning, Juwan Howard, Chris Weber, Steve Nash, and Allen Iverson coming off the Bench.
     
  19. jeffpan

    jeffpan Member

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    Totally agree!

    Carl Dawson was too hasty in constructing a champion-caliber team last summer, but his decisions backfired. The task during this offseason seems to be the same as last year's: Find the right role players for T-Mac and Yao. But he is doing the same thing now.

    I am rookie, excited about my first post here. ;)
     
  20. DaDakota

    DaDakota Balance wins
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    Screw the future, let's get er done now. Once you have 2 all stars in their prime you DO not worry about 5 or 6 years down the road, let's win NOW.....we can build for the future with better players, later.

    DD
     

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