it's not that you can't trade your 1st rounders, you just can't have no firsts for consecutive years. We're getting one back, so it doesn't matter
It is really strange that people think our first round Draft pick is a worth a great deal- unless of course we suck even this year. We were a play off bound team- and we will be this year a lot better. I would doubt we will have a pick higher than 15 next year. Now- the question is what would you do this year- not a year from now? And what is a 15 th Pick be worth- In my opinion the odds favor my argument that we will not miss out on a franchise player for sure! Why not get a good contributor this year? I am not sure next year's draft being so different than the one when we picked Yao- check what we would have gotten for #15 in that year? Not exactly a franchise savior!
Why wouldn't the Raptors just take Aldridge and resign James? That seems like a more talent for them than Magloire and Williams. As far as I know, other teams are not looking to help out the Rockets. You are not going to be able to trade a #8 and future considerations for a #1.
Actually, the rule is that you can't trade consecutive FUTURE first round picks. If you make a trade on draft day for your first rounder it is not concidered a future pick so you can trade this years and next years on draft day.
Actually you are incorrect. The rule states that you cannot trade away two consecutive "future" first round picks. The nuance is that you can trade your first round this year and then trade away your first round pick next as long this years first round pick was already traded. This rule is to prevent a club to gamble their future away for one player that may not pan out.
Big monkey-wrench in this whole thing is that Charlotte is going to take Roy at #3.. A whole lotta gyrations for a big fat nothing. The only trading we need to even be considering is trading downa couple of spots, hope some sucker is crazy over either Carney or Brewer, trade down and take the other one. Or, if someone falls completely in man-love with somebody like Douby or Ager, we can take advantage that way.. but trading up, this year? No way.
Because they don't want James. And that's not the deal for Toronto. For Toronto, it is essentially the #1 pick for Marcus Williams and Magloire since they don't want James back. They get their point and a big man.
Have you been paying attention at all at how teams like San Antonio and Dallas have built their franchises? San Antonio took Tony Parker at #30 and Manu Ginobili at #57. Dallas took Josh Howard at #29. So obiously every draft pick has value, but especially in a year as deep as the 07 draft. And yes, it is very different from the year we picked Yao. That draft was weak. Further, we're not looking for franchise players. We've got those. We're looking for quality roleplayers, and incidentally, I don't think many of us consider Brandon Roy to be much more than that. So in my mind, you're proposing we trade two possible quality role players for one possible quality role player. Fantastic.
Next years draft is going to be a lot stronger then this years. We can not give that pick away just to move up 8 spots. Who knows how many of the "potential" high school players who will go to college for one year and then be available next year. If we draft smart this year, we can get two players who can fill certain roles for next year. I know everyone is high on Bargnani, but there is as much chance if not more that he is the next Tskitishvili or Darko, and not the next Dirk.
He's actually not suggesting we trade this years pick + next year's pick to move up 8 spots. We'd have to deal with Toronto to do that. He's suggesting we give up both this years' first round pick and next years to move up FOUR spots.
Why is there an urge to replicate what Dallas or SA does? As Long as we understand their strengths and Match up we will be an elite Team? Seriously, I dont think Tony Parker, Josh Howard or Manu- were touted as the All Star calibre talent- they rolled the dice and did their home work and it worked. I just dont think we have a history with our Drafting skills of late! I would not understand the terms "weak" and "Strong" - they are relative. Yes IF I have the number 1 pick next year sure, who does not want Oden? The important thing to remember is IF we dont get our act together this year- that would be 1 more year wasted with Tmac and Yao together- if you are talking of opportunity Cost- I will take my chances this year than wait for 1 more year for deliverance. It does pay both business wise and strategically speaking to do something this year. If we do get our act together we are Solid team, but you take Tmac out just imagine what our chances are.
I am not sure if anyone has percentages- but I think it would be interesting to have a statistical bench mark as to how many Foregin Born players make it to the elite level for each one that enters the draft, my guess is that The chance of that would be pretty much the same as that for talent here. We feel more comfortable with people we know! Darko is not done yet- he got screwed in Detroit he has talent. And rememer no one really heard about Diaw either before this season- Skita will get his shot under D' Antoni. A lot of people were sceptical about Yao- do you remember? ( and Gasol and Nash and Etc etc).
Some have mentioned we trade our pick for N.O. 2 picks, which would be reasonable since we traded 3 for a #7 a few years ago(don't remind me). How about we trade #8 We get N.O.'s #12 OR #15 and their next years 1st(top three protected) I don't expect a great season out of N.O. next year and they might welcome the challenge/risk, so to speak. On another note, what about drafting Patrick O'Bryant, who is projected in the mid-first. We were the best defensive team in the league when we started Cato with Yao. It was quite effective as I remember. Having two 7 footers closes off driving lanes and forces teams to settle for outside shots. O'Bryant is a legit 7 foot, averaged 3 blks a game, and has a decent offensive game. He scored 28 points in the tournament against Pitt. and a good center in Aaron Gray. Imagine Cato with a jump hook.
The urge to replicate what Dallas and SA do comes from the fact they're two of the top teams in the league. San Antonio in particular is the model of how a team should be built and maintained. Despite the fact they're a small market team, they've managed to be a top tier team year in and year out for about ten years now due to their excellent drafting, coaching and player personel decisions. Sometimes they make mistakes, but they make enough of the right choices that they always do alright. Besides that, my point was that regardless of where we finish next season, our draft pick is a valuable tool in becoming and remaining a team to contend with. We'd all love for the Rockets to acquire Brandon Roy, but personally I think giving up next years first round pick to move up four spots is outright foolish. More importantly, I don't think we'll be a serious contender next year regardless of who we pick this year. That being said, it's important that we continue to add pieces until we are. The draft is the best way to add affordable talent. By the time players are free agents, they're looking for big deals. It's a whole lot more difficult to find good value players in free agency than it is in the draft and with us being over the cap, the draft is our ONLY chance at adding exceptional talents. The mid-level exception pretty much gaurantees mid-level or worse talent. In the draft, you can sometimes find an All-Star in the second round. As for our drafting skills as of late - That's irrelevant. This year we have Morey contributing to the draft process. If we (Rockets fans) are lucky, our drafting luck is all about to change for the better. But we're not going to know how well Morey drafts for at least a few more years when we can start saying how his picks are turning out. Well, it's obvious you don't understand the difference between a weak draft and a strong draft. If you did, you wouldn't be proposing we get rid of our pick next year to move up four spots in the draft for a player who hasn't proven he can contribute in the NBA. As per Oden, interestingly enough, we're pretty much the one team who probably doesn't want Oden - unless they think he can play power forward for us. Nonetheless, there are guys on that are currently slated to go around 13 that I would love to have (Spencer Hawes) and they have no idea who is or isn't going to come out. They don't know what freshmen will come out and shine that nobody has ever heard of ala Tyrus Thomas and Joakim Noah. Now, if Portland wants to give us their first round pick next year for our #8 and our first round pick next year, NOW YOU'RE TALKING! Impatience isn't going to help us. We've got to find a middle ground between what is best for us in the long-term and what is best for us right now. Otherwise, we might as well hire Isiah Thomas as our GM.
JMWillimason I can defintiely extend the discussion. But I guess we will have to disagree. Why are you assuming that MLE does not get you much? We still have Stro who can definitely be added to the mix and the TE's. If we wanted we could add 3 good players within the limitations we have- this year. Frankly I am upbeat of what can be done to the team this year- if it is next year- then it will be a repeat of the Steve Francis era! San Antonio does a superb job with talent/scouting. They got Michael Finley for nothing- this guy is a Starting Shooting guard on most teams. Manu and Parker were very good picks. Bruce Bowen is an unsung hero. Dallas has a owner that is willing to spend. And they are good with Picks - Devin Harris, Marquise Daniels and Josh Howard ( with Josh Powell, Rawle Marshall, Mbenga in the wings)- yes they do make the occasional blunders like Dampier! If Morey is our ace in the hole- and it is just statistics- I would start praying right away!
Stromile Swift is exactly why I'm not optimistic about the type of players you can acquire with the MLE. Most people thought we couldn't even land him for the MLE and look at how well he turned out. I think the Phoenix Suns may have been the only team that really came out ahead with their MLE signings last season. Everybody else found themselves disappointed. Aside from that, one of the key reasons we're lacking quality depth now is due to the fact we've traded away so many picks in previous seasons. I'm sick of seeing that happen. I'm ready for the Rockets to start making use of their picks.
That sounds great but im still not convinced roy is that much better than carney and carney has the chance to be a lock down defender something roy does not possess but i will be pissed if we give the mle to mj if we bring him back it better be sign-n-trade! Harrington or maggette makes us best in the west!!!
How about we dont and say we did Outlaw is a bum this team doesnt need potential they need proven talent ala stro! Go get a big timer it takes three to tango.
