I feel this was the thought pre-injury, when Yao averaged 8 or 9 rebounds a game and didn't seem to be as active defensively. I feel the Yao that emerged at the end of the season doesn't need an enforcer. Maybe 4 years of being the only big man finally got to him. Regardless, i think offensively a player with some range at the 4 would go alot further to help the team and Yao. With the double teams he will command that player will be left open alot more. Yao has already been grabing almost 13 boards a game since the all-star break, and there is no reason to think he can't average 11 a game next year.
i agree. we don't need a big stiff taking up space down low. not only will yao be more easily double teamed but it will make it harder for tmac to get to the basket with two big guys covering each block. i would like to see: - yao down low with everyone else around the perimeter making some backdoor cuts to the basket. - yao and tmac PnR at the top of the key with 2 shooters in the deep corner with maybe the PG on the wing so he can get back on defense. if there is (for example) kelvin cato at the 4, there is no room for cutting to the basket while yao posts up. there is basically no one open if yao is double teamed by the 2 bigs. PnR won't work because yao and tmac would be heading into a big defender.
The purpose of the proverbial "banger" at the 4 is not offense, it's for defense. The West is loaded with superstar-quality power forwards. Yao can't guard them, and shouldn't even if he could due to foul trouble. By the same token, you can't put Juwan Howard or Scott Padgett on Dirk or Elton and expect not to get ravaged.
ya but even without it our defense has been top 10 since Gundy been around, our offense is what has been struggling
We now need some good shooters to hit open shots and get good spacing on the court. But A good 4 with some range is a big plus. YAO might still get into foul trouble in the second half when his fatigue kicks in. Damn. Last night TD had 31 points, but only 11 from second half and nobody mentioned. I remember YAO had 36 pts game with MAVs and only 9 from second. BSPN said it again and again
At the point, I'd say no. Honestly, who can defend the likes of Brand and Garnett on any day? Other than Ben Wallace, a younger Cliff Robinson, or Kwame Brown on his good days there really aren't any effective 1-on-1 "non-MAX" post defenders in the league anymore. Dominant low-post scorers are going to get theirs no matter what we do. Van Gundy's team defense is usually enough to keep opposing low-post players to more earthly numbers. Most of the time, it's jump-shooting big men like Camby and Miller that have career nights against us. At the 4-position, I think we need someone mobile that can step out on defense...and can hit the open 15-footer with consistency. In the end, we'll have Yao in the low post against the scrub centers of the West to offset whatever damage the elite power forwards can do. More often than not though, it's not really the opposing big men that kill us...it's opposing guards. We desperately need to do something about our perimeter defense.
What I mean is that in Shelden,you get the banger and much more.He can drop out and pop the short j.Also,his deceptive length combined with his great coaching alows him to get into the defensive and offensive flow.Williams will rebound and block shots on the NBA level.With all the guys leaving school early and coming from all over the world,we might just have a 10 year starter fall to us here. As to how he combines with Yao.......like peanut butter and jelly. ...I used to have issues with his athleticism,but no more.Williams has the pedigree.(and the length and strength) Hey,if Carlos Boozer can put up numbers in the Association then so can Shelden.
If we end up with mosty scrubs like last season then we DO need a true Power Forward who can both defend and keep the likes of Duncan and Brand occupied defending him on the offensive end,instead of Yao Ming! At the present we have Howard as our starting PF and he demands very limited attention.
It depends on what other teams have on the floor. Nobody stops Elton or Duncan. You can only play defense well enough to make them less efficient and take away good looks on the pass outs. I think that is why Van Gundy is so insistent on improving the perimeter defense and then play good enough on Elton to force him to take shots outside the paint. That's the best we can do. Along with that, it looks like Van Gundy is really committed to the uptempo game with faster, quicker players. If that is indeed the case, then rebounding becomes less of an issue because the opponent is concentrating on getting back down the floor. We saw a lot of plays towards the end of the season where everyone was scrambling back after the shot went up and Yao is left alone or battling one opponent for the defensive board. Yao's rebounding statistics are up largely due to this factor. There are fewer players under the bucket to fight with.
I take Dirk =\ or a defensive minded player like Wallace hMMm, but Wallace have on offense... Maybe someone like Boozer?
I never really thought Yao needed a "banger". On offense, Yao's needs a PF who will stay out of his way, can hit mid/long jumpers and make the opposing PF play defense. On both defense and offense, Yao needs someone with good rebounding instincts. Stro fails on all counts. JH used to be OK at jumpers but he's on fumes now and he never played any defense. Drafting Sheldon Williams will be just as big a mistake as signing Stro. KG and Dirk will make mincemeat out of him just like they do Stro and JHl. Plus, Williams' power offensive game doesn't mesh with Yao. Williams' limited skills fit perimeter centers like Brad Miller and Raef LaFrentz. Carlos Boozer is a much better player than Williams. Don't equate them just because they both played at Duke.
It's a moot point. At this point, debating whether or not we need a skilled '4' or a 'banger' is completely irrelevant. Debating whether or not we need a shooting guard more than a power forward is completely irrelevant. We need something. It doesn't matter what it is. I would gladly take anyone because right now we are playing 3 on 5 out there on both ends of the court. Anyone with any ability whatsoever would be a huge help.
He has never needed a banger. Sure he does get torched by athletic/outside shooting 4's every once in a while, but who doesn't? Instead of a banger, here's an idea. We only have one 1st round pick, how about using it on someone who can actually play perimeter D for a change? People always magnify the impact of quick 4's on Yao's foul troubles when in reality it's the guard penetration that does the most.
If the choice is between a "banger" 10-12 PPG/10-12 RPG PF vs. a "shooter" 15 PPG/5-7 RPG PF i'm going almost always take the "banger". With the way this team is set up and considering the likely route we will go this off-season of upgrading the SG position and hopefully landing a player that can actually shoot, I think it makes the most sense to have a traditional, close-to-the-basket PF that can concentrate primarily on rebounding and creating extra possessions. Think about the players this mystery PF would be out on the floor with: PG Alson - Known for jacking up countless three's SG ____ - Will likely be a perimeter oriented player capitalizing off of double teams and open looks SF T-Mac - Can score from anywhere but seems to prefer playing on the perimeter anymore C Yao - Will need need somebody underneath the basket collecting misses We're looking at a lot of shots from the perimeter when Yao isn't touching the ball. In that case, I think it makes the most sense to go for a glass-eater who can box out, rebound and create other opportunities for his teammates. This is where my draft dilemna comes. I really think Shelden Williams can become this "banger" type of PF we need. The problem of course, is we already have so much money sunk into Howard and Swift with a precarious situation at SG. I fear that upgrading the PF spot isn't considered a top priority because of the contracts and how JVG is so high on Howard. On the other hand, I don't think Swift has a future on this team under JVG. He clearly doesn't trust him and there's really no need to hang onto him when we'll only be using him for 15 minutes or so off of the bench and since he still has some trade value. I think Swift will get dealt, the question is for what? Could we possibly swing a deal with New Orleans for my boy J.R. Smith and maybe others like Macijauskas and Johnson (R=$'s idea as mentioned in a different thread) for Swift and the Knick's second rounder? That could make drafting Shelden Williams look like a very solid pick. PG Alston/Head/Spanoulis SG Smith/Bogans/Macijauskas SF McGrady/Johnson/Bowen PF Williams/Howard/Hayes C Yao/Mutombo Split the MLE on Spanoulis/Bogans. Not a bad looking team.
First of all I'm not simpleminded enough to equate them because they both played at Duke.I do see a valid link though in that they both are 4's who have class/pedigree...and both have had questions about their athleticism coming into the draft.With all the high schoolers and foreign players coming in guys that might not be flashy,but can be counted on for long NBA careers are slipping.These players are usually steeped in fundamentals after having put in 3-4 years at a top flight NCAA hoops program.Said players are oftentimes high school all americans that are rated near the top of their class...See Williams,Boozer,etc.These are safe,solid picks...perhaps without that sexy upside,but you never know.Williams strikes me as not only solid,but as an overachiever too.His receptiveness to coaching and knowing his role should bode well for him in the NBA.I look at his footwork and great touch,his length,his ability to step up in the tournament,and the aforementioned class factor as indicators to how good he'll be.I'll tell you what,let's make a bet to the tip jar. $100 says Williams puts up at least 12 and 8 for his first year.
The whole key is Van Gundy. If he is going through a slight metamorphis and is understanding that the rule changes allow for more offensive freedom, then he indeed may see the need to have a PF that can shoot the ball, create space and be a scorer as opposed to a down low garbage man. If so, we need to hit the lottery and take Bargnani. The whole thing with the draft pick is this: If the dude we are drafting ain't going to come in and start IMMEDIATELY, I don't want him. We have to get a 30 minute starter out of that pick. Otherwise trade the pick for a starting SG or a starting PF.
It does seem that JVG wants to go with a lighter, faster team, which would mean Yao as the anchor with a lot of outside shooters/passers/slashers. It is very likely that we will package this draft pick for a player that can really contribute now. Depending, of course, on who we can nab. On 610 some dude (I'm not good with names) said JVG had wanted to field a team that went quick and lethal, say, Stro at the 5 and TMac at the 4, that sort of thing, and that Odom would be a good fit for that sort of team. The Lakers were contemplating an Odom for Boozer swap; were the Jazz interested? Could we send the #8/JHo or Stro and use the TLE to make a 3 team trade (I don't think the Jazz wanted to trade for Odom). Think about it: a 4 who passes, rebounds, shoots the outside shot. The Lakers have outside shooting in Brian Cook, and passing in Luke Walton, so a deal is somewhat possible, IF they think they've improved at least as much as we have. TMac, Odom, and Yao. Expensive but nice to have. Hey: JVG won't play a rook, let alone a Euro rook.
