The recent love affair by this board with Howard and Wesley is cute. Really, it is. Their play has been determined and their refusal to quit throughout this turmoil has been admirable. This has seemingly led to a shift of conventional wisdom evidenced throughout the pages of most threads - that these two vets deserve to stay with a chance to ride it out upon the return of 1-11. All I have to say to this is: Sell high. Particularly in the case of Wesley. It is imperative that management attempts to parlay the expiring deals of Wesley and Norris into some sort of tangible return. If no deal presents itself, I can accept that, but it would be ludicrous to hold back on a deal simply based on the premise that Wesley is of some worth in the short term. The argument can be made against trading Howard due to the fact that he has demonstrated that he can still be a very viable low post option. However, if any deal presented itself in the opportunity to shed ourselves of this long term salary commitment, similar to the potential Cassell trade of last year, they need to pull the trigger. I would sacrifice this short term fool's gold, in what looks like it could possibly set us back this season, in shaping the roster for the future. While admirable, their play is simply fool's gold. Especially in the case of Wesley who will likely burn out once again if we are even to reach the playoffs.
I'm a bit torn on Wesley. I think he's effective as a 2-guard. I think he is abysmal as a point guard. With the team at full strength, I think he is a nice role player. When he has to shoulder more of the burden, we are in trouble. If we can't get anything decent in a trade, why not just wait for his contract to expire at the end of the season and benefit ourselves from the added cap space? I would suspect that we could use the flexibility -- we likely will need to retool after this nasty season.
even if we just let the contract expire that still doesn't put us under the cap i don't think. mcgrady and yao's max contracts pretty much limit us to moves with the MLE or LLE during free agency, which shuold be enough to fill in pieces. i like wesley and howard but cabbage is right, they certainly can't be deal breakers.
I was also about to suggest trading Wesley near the trading deadline. I would be a little hesistant trading Howard because of Stromile's inconsistent performance but I wouldn't be opposed to it we could get a player comparable to Cassell's class. Maybe packaging them along with a 2nd round pick might yield a good player.
You have got to be kidding me! First, both Howard and Wesley bring many intangible things to the Rockets that most posters on the GARM don't seem to realize. The game is NOT all about the box score. Second, when players like them give their all on the court and you trade them you automatically send a message to the rest of the team and the players in the league that you don't have any loyalty to quality personnel. Third, the reason we are where we are this year has absolutely nothing to do with these two players and everything to do with the unprecedented amount of injuries the team has sustained. Bottom line is I don't see any reason to trade them and heartedly disagree.
OddsOn, I agree that both of them bring intangibles and aren't responsible for the position we are in. They have helped us from a total collapse but they aren't getting younger and if the Rockets can get a quality player who could be a 3rd offensive/defensive option then they should look into it.
I think it's prudent for the Rockets to weigh their options. Yes, Wesley's expiring contract is potentially of some worth to teams that will need to throw in the towel near the final third of the season. Whether or not it can be parlayed into a player that will be of much use to us in the long term is far from a given. With Sura and Barry short-term solutions at shooting guard at best, finished for good at worst, management would have to be sure that Head is ready to start in this league (dubious) or get a shooting guard in return. Currently Wesley is not only our most reliable 3-pt shooter but typically is responsible for defending the primary perimeter player. These are assets we would surely lose for the season if he cannot capably be replaced at the position, so if we were to trade him for a forward or point guard it would surely be the end of our season this year. I fail to see any trade value in Juwon Howard. He has a significant contract in both length and dollars, and the team he is most valuable to in the NBA is the Rockets. If we can somehow get something for Moochie, well, great. One way or another, his long strange trip with the Rockets will be over after the season. Strange that David Wesley, who endured offseason surgery, and Juwon Howard, whom it was reasonably feared might never play again, have been the Rockets' healthiest players this season.
Those intangibles won't do us much good in Wesley's case next year when he's providing them for another team after his contract here expires. So you wouldn't have made the Clyde Drexler deal? Or was Otis Thorpe not a hard worker? Where did I say that we are where we are this year because of them? They've played admirably during this stretch. The point is cashing in for the future. You don't see any reason to trade Wesley and Howard? I could take you seriously if you suggested more of a moderate view - not actively shopping them. If you're going to tell me you see no reason to trade them then I have no choice but to conclude that you are joking.
Howard's holding up okay and we can't trade him while he's our best PF and the most professional. Wesley is underappreciated. Still plays good defense in spurts and has a shot. The only problem is that he's playing too many minutes and being asked to do something he's not known for. He's a spot up shooter, not the penetrating playmaker we're asking him to be. We should resign him during the summer to come off the bench for 15-20mpg. That's what the spurs did for Horry and he turned out fresh for the playoffs.
While I dont think Howard is the greatest PF in the league. The thing he's got with me is that he has played with T-Mac for years, and they have chemistry. Sometimes this is more valuable than the greatest talent. Im not as worried about having a stud PF as I am about our team knowing how to get the damn ball to T-Mac. Keep Howard.
I like the thinking. When we've watched players suck and are now impressed with how well they're playing, that's the time to realize that other teams are seeing the same thing -- and might be willing to give us something good in exchange. To get value, you don't trade a player when you wouldn't mind losing him. You trade him when it looks to you -- and your trading partner -- like losing that player would hurt.
Me, too. Younger, longer, stronger. The future is ...in the future. 30-11 just to make the p/o? Maybe. TMac's bac is too iffy to carry the next 41 games.
Well, of course. Only a fool would keep them to chase this season. I don't think you get much for them, though. Maybe a pick, plus take another's teams problem contract. The hard thing to do is identify trade targets. The target will likely be in the east be a playoff contender need vet bench help want to get rid of someone So - I could see Indiana, Miami, NJ . Don't know who else could use our two guys for a late push. I wish we could get Golden State to trade Moochie, Wesley and Howard for Troy Murphy and a pick. They have the young guys behind him, and will eventually try to move his contract, and Fisher's. I'm having a little trouble finding a deal that's good future value to the Rockets. You don't want to take on a LaFrentz, unless he comes with a top pick..
I'm also thinking of other teams in the East whom we can deal with...Chicago? Boston? Atlanta? This team needs another boost in order to continue our Re-Launch and lift off to the playoffs...
I agree in the sense, they should look at their options. But you do have to weight short term worth, long term growth, if there will be chemistry issues (i'm not sure how tight DW is with the whole team, seems fairly tight), where we sit in the playoff hunt (if we are even in the hunt), etc. I absolutely see where you are coming from with the Sell high mentality. And i know it's futile to mention it, but I am about loyalty to the players that play for our team...even though I know for the most part the higher-ups say it's a business. I can't argue with you on getting the most value out of DW's expiring contract...but I am deathly afraid of bringing in another person who is supposed to be able to shoot, and gets the Rocket slump when they get here. I remember a Piatkowski (sp?)?
Tha Cabbage- You make some great points but I don't think you trade Howard unless you get a solid PF in return who can hit that mid range jumper. As far as Wesley goes, I am kind of torn on him. I love his effort defensively and his shooting (when he is on), but his height kills us time and time again. It happened all though that first round playoff series (Stackouse and Howard scored at will over him b/c they are much taller). This season, Carmelo hit the game winner over him.
I agree as well. For the Rockets to continue to add quality talent to the team, trading Wesley's 5M and Moochie's 4.5M contracts could really get us a nice player. We arent going to be under the cap anytime soon. And other than THIS season I dont see us getting a high draft pick. So trying to move contracts to get a longer term contract from another team looking to cut salary is the way to go to add more talent. I wonder if the Pacers are willing to move Stephen Jackson now that they have Peja. If they really want to "re-sign" Peja in the offseason it is going to cost the Pacers some coin and they are looking to TRIM payroll since it is one of the highest in the league. So they are going to have some hard decisions. In reality Peja really takes over Jackson's role on the team as the outside shooter. They would be better off just moving him to clear cap space. Jackson would be a nice fit on the Rockets in terms of a "3rd scorer" and someone to stretch the defense. Just a thought.
Cabbage, BTW, you should include Deke in the same thinking. Given his age he has been an admirable stud for us. Hiis value is still high, especially to a team that is going somewhere this year (not us imho). Sell Deke high, too.
