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[NY DAILY NEWS] Good piece on Billy Wagner

Discussion in 'Houston Astros' started by wrath_of_khan, Jan 16, 2006.

  1. Nick

    Nick Member

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    The bottom line is that Wagner eventually wore out his welcome here in Houston with his comments, and his lack of clutchness if we were playing any sort of meaningful game... and he proceeded to do the EXACT SAME THING in Philadelphia.

    If it only happened once, that's fine... but Philly got SICK of his constant criticisms (when he himself was either hurt or struggling), and his constant b****ing about his contract extention, and he was only there for 2 years.

    I'm not against elite closers... but I do believe there's a better source for them than FA... unless you're talking about the super-elite. I've already established that Wagner was never considered among the top 3 closers in baseball, yet he's made a salary that says he should be.

    But, I'm comforted in knowing that for every Billy Wagner and Jason Isringhausen that are signing big-time free agent deals, there's a K-rod, Brad Lidge, and Bobby Jenks in the minors just waiting to show you what a young/live arm can really do at this level.
     
  2. candlegreen

    candlegreen Member

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    BH Kim was not exactly a great closer, especially after the WS that he pitched....

    Who did Florida have when they won the Series a couple years ago? I believe Urbina had a 6.00 ERA that October and a 4.19 season ERA.

    There were some "good" closers in the mid-90s, but nothing that really stood out. John Wettland was great at the time, Rivera was actually the setup guy. John Rocker had that one year, and Wohlers was good before then, but that might just be the pitching coach every time I think about what they became.

    Mitch Williams was pretty good at one time, but he wasn't really anything special that WS year. His era was in the mid 3s.

    Jose Mesa was pitching for Cleveland for 2 WS appearances, but he was decent at the time, but got shelled in both WS appearances.
     
  3. candlegreen

    candlegreen Member

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    no one's saying that having a great closer does not help. Of course, being able to shorten a game to the 7th or 8th inning is a great weapon to have, as it gives the starting pitcher less pressure to extend his outing to the later innings. However, it's one of the smaller issues, in my opinion. Having a couple shutdown setup men could warrant a greater necessity for a team making a playoff run. Atlanta was known for having great SP in the 90s, but those series that they lost were always done in the late innings. Those losses to the Yankees in 96 were a great example. Denny Neagle had a 6-0 lead, only to have that wiped off in 2 (nonconsecutive) 3-run innings. One was on Neagle, the other was on the bullpen.

    One thing that I've noticed though, is how we just don't see those wild scores anymore that was quite common in the 90s. Those 6-7 run innings in the world series that made the game a shootout.

    Nonetheless, I love the idea of the Astros having a decent closer, but there are other needs that needs to be filled beforehand.
     

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