...the Suns game earlier in the season: Shaq was rendered completely useless, and Bill Walton kept mentioning how much of a non-factor Shaq was in the game. The Suns gave Shaq exactly the same "fronting" treatment they gave Yao. They put one guy in front and another behind him. The results? Shaq scored a whopping 8 points on 2/6 shooting, 4/8 on FTs in 23 minutes of play. I watched the entire game. Shaq's teammates had a hard time getting the ball in to him, and when they finally did get the ball to him, he immediately passed it back out. I remember watching the Houston/Phoenix game on ESPN, and that asshat, Stephen A Smith kept ranting every opportunity he had that "Yao was soft". I would like to hear his opinion on how Shaq didn't fare any better last night. The truth is, in today's allowable defenses, it is easier to take out low-post threats like Shaq and Yao - especially because they are standing stationary in the low block a majority of the time, dependent on their teammate's entry passes befere they can execute their bread n butter moves. "The Suns rendered Miami center Shaquille O’Neal a non-factor. O’Neal played only 23 minutes after getting into second-half foul trouble, attempting only six shots (making two) and finishing with a season-low eight points." http://www.eastvalleytribune.com/index.php?sty=56610 http://www.nba.com/games/20060106/MIAPHX/boxscore.html Suns put foot on gas, fly past Heat By Jerry Brown, Tribune January 7, 2006 If the Suns had known playing in the U.S. Airways Center would be this much fun, the team probably would have changed the name of the building a long time ago. Hours after the name America West Arena was laid to rest thanks to an airline merger, the Suns immediately took flight with a 47-point explosion in the first quarter and never looked back, pasting the stunned Miami Heat 111-93 before a sellout crowd Friday night. Seven of the nine Suns who played reached double figures, led by Raja Bell’s 24 points. Shawn Marion had 19 while Steve Nash added and 11 points and 19 assists — 12 of them in the incredible first quarter when the Suns hit 18 of 25 shots and could do no wrong. “It was a phenomenal first quarter, unbelievable,” Phoenix coach Mike D’Antoni said. “When we shoot like that and all of our guys are active defensively, it’s incredible. When we play like that, it’s going to be hard for anyone.” The 47 points was the most in an NBA quarter this season and the most ever scored in the building, no matter the name, since it opened in November of 1992. The Suns got all 47 from the outside, dishing out 17 assists and committing only two turnovers. “When I was in Utah last year, 47 was a lot for a half,” said Bell, who came up two points shy of a career high. “One person got hot, and then someone else came in and got hot. Everyone who touched the ball was on fire.” Despite wiping the floor with inferior competition all season, the Suns (21-11) still lacked a signature win against one of the NBA’s elite — going 1-7 against the NBA’s top 10 teams. But even though the Heat (19-15) were missing starting guards Dwyane Wade and Jason Williams due to injuries, the Suns made an impressive statement by hitting 12 of their first 17 shots and building a 30-10 lead in less than eight minutes. It was the perfect scenario for the Suns, who coasted home to save a little gas for the defending champion San Antonio Spurs, who come to town tonight. Just five days after setting a career high with 22 assists in New York, Nash set a Suns franchise record with his 12 first-quarter assists — tying the second highest total in league history for one quarter. Bell hit six of his first seven shots — three of them 3-pointers — and the Suns finished the quarter with a franchise-record 17 assists on 18 baskets. It ended with Nash’s 12th assist, setting up Bell for 28-foot bomb at the buzzer to give the Suns a 47-25 lead. “It was just one of those freaky quarters. We were just unconscious,” Nash said. “I didn’t realize until Raja hit that three at the buzzer that we even had 40 points . . . then I looked up.” It was the most firstquarter points allowed by Miami in franchise history — not the kind of effort coach Pat Riley was looking for after a poor effort in Oklahoma City two nights ago. Miami lost back-to-back games for the first time since Riley took over as coach on Dec. 12 and are now 0-2 to begin a seven-game road trip. “I have seen a lot of good first quarters. I don’t think I’ve ever seen one exactly like that,” Riley said. “We got our heads handed to us for the second game in a row. I didn’t say anything to them — I said it all the other night after Oklahoma.” Antoine Walker led the Heat with 22 points off the bench while Jason Kopono, subbing for the injured Wade, added a season-high 16. The Suns rendered Miami center Shaquille O’Neal a non-factor. O’Neal played only 23 minutes after getting into second-half foul trouble, attempting only six shots (making two) and finishing with a season-low eight points.
Exactly. Part of it is that this has less to do with how good the center is, and more with what they can do besides just posting up, and how great of a post entry passer you have.
I think the apparent decline in Shaq's play has more to do with the rules. Lots of things that were legal for centers before -- initiating contact on offence, blocking a penetrating guard near the basket, defending the paint for more than 3 seconds in a row -- are illegal now (at least for anyone named Yao). And lots of defenses that were illegal then are legal now. The upshot is that life for centers is far, far harder today than it was in Shaq's (and Hakeem's) championship years.
Shaq is still the most "dominant" center. It shows how much the game has changed. It's too easy to shut down a post scorer nowadays.
You use the excuse that Shaq is "way out of his prime", which is exactly the ridiculously predictable answer I was expecting. Why, pray tell, is he dominating opponents, picking them apart when he is guarded straight up? I guess it has nothing to do with today's allowable defenses in which 2 guys can hang all over you like a cheap suit before you even recieve the ball?
The same can be said for those who bashed Yao's teammates and coach for not getting him the ball more during that game.
I think we've seen Yao go through this all year. He'll have great first halfs against single coverage and then "disappear" in the second half when the defense starts fronting with the weakside help. I think in past years - YOFs like me probably has a legitimate concern about Yao's touches. This year - that is definitely not the case. The team does look to feed him the ball. It's just not easy to do. Maybe if Yao screams after dunks and pounds his chest - people will stop thinking that he's soft. Shaq is past his prime - but still finished 2nd in MVP voting last year.
I tell ya what I'd like to see: Have Yao play right of the basket. Have T-Mac bring the ball up right of the basket. But only use them as decoys. While they put two men on McGrady's double team, and while they put two men on fronting Yao, we move the ball (quickly) to the other side to slashing power forwards, and wide-open guards. THAT would be sweet!
Exactly, apparently people haven't been watching Shaq play lately. While he's still the best center in the league when he wants to play like one, Shaq is way out of his prime and he isn't nearly the player he was 3-4 years ago. I think Miami will regret forking up the $100 mil contract they just gave him, I just don't see this 'lazy' and out of shape Shaq doing much a couple of years from now. Also, there's that whole thing about the league wanting to destroy the big-man game, and wanting to effectively eleminate 'traditional' big men from the game. The rules are now geared to quick running guards; the Suns are the team the NBA would like everyone to emulate. Yao is playing in a 'hostile' environment.
ya what he said. all that double trouble jumbo mumbo means nothings if dw, da or swift cant hit shots.
Some of you are acting as though Shaq is an old man...HE IS 33 YRS OLD!!...prolly 10 yrs younger than DEKE...he should still be in his prime years right now. If he's not, it's his own fault for now having the discipline to take care of himself and stay in fighting shape....still, as he is now, he'd still dominate any center in league history one on one.
Please, just accept that you do NOT like Yao, then you will begin to see things clearly. The real reason these two didn't play well against the Suns is because they couldn't get the ball when and where they wanted it, Suns didn't allow it. Exactly!
they have different game. both equally dominant. dunks do not equal dominance, the influence on the game does.. yao's easy hooks and quick jumpers are almost automatic all the time... that is also dominance... they both attract double teams consistently more than any other centers in the league(even before they get the balll) and if that doesn't spell dominance i don't know what does.. yao is very good at what he does and the results are extremely effective..
Remember this Yao bashing article? http://nbadraft.net/prevenas059.asp Well, I emailed Shaq's line to the writer today and got this response just an hour or so later. "You got the jump on me here. I was pitching this idea to my editor just as I was checking my email. It totally wouldn't be fair to Yao if I didn't write a similar column about Shaq, or at least mention how he mailed it in after he realized this wasn't going to be his game. The parallels between both games are pretty startling. I would argue that Houston needed that win more than Miami did, but not by much. D-Wade was out, which meant it was on the Diesel to deliver them a big road win. He ended up playing a terrible game, even with Kurt Thomas in foul trouble. I don't know about you, but I found it a little depressing watching Shaq struggle in a game like this. Keep an eye out in the next couple days for something about this game. Thanks for writing and have a great weekend. Nick Prevenas www.nbadraft.net" Though I didn't like his initial analysis of Yao, if he hammers Shaq in a similar fashion, I can accept that kind of fair criticism.
