Rocket Man Tex aka poop sender, did you not get the gist of my message or are CAPITALS NOT EMPHASIS ENOUGH? My message is that it does not seem rational to be offended by that song IF YOU LISTEN TO IT WHOLE. I think the song, relative to most of pop music in the world is good and positive and has some meaning. Tupac did some of that...Jennifer Lopez does not. I'm trying to make some analysis here. Anyhow, no, I am not Jewish. But in trying to throw that as to reasoning for why I dissagree is a poor attempt to argue man. By the way, my coworker is Jewish and he likes the song and is not offended. But that shouldn't make a difference either. Argue the ideas, not the source. And the idea is that he was making a point against racism and violence and prejudice and used the word "Jew" to demonstrate that in his song. That is why I don't understand why people would be offended and attack him IF THEY LISTENED TO THE WHOLE SONG. Micheal Jackson ain't no slim shadey here.
It's not like she actually wrote the song or anything... that takes talent... ------------------ So you run and you run to catch up with the sun but it's sinking, Racing around to come up behind you again. The sun is the same in a relative way but you're older, Shorter of breath and one day closer to death.
Exactly, some African-Americans don't even like to hear it from other African-Americans AT ALL! Its also an issue amoung the African-American race as well. Thus, either it is a racist bad word to you or it isn't and don't give me that context crap either! "Oh, well, ya know, Old Dirty b*stard said it so its ok, but J-lo ain't even black"... That, in my opinion (and thats all we have here are our opinions), is hypocritical and discriminatory. Or as Old Dirty would say, "Ni$$a Please"! ------------------ This space left intentionally blank... [This message has been edited by mr_oily (edited July 13, 2001).]
As a Canadian largely ignorant about this issue, let me ask a question. Did it offend you when Quentin Tarantino used it in Pulp Fiction? I'm guessing not, but correct me if I'm wrong. The word only has meaning because people give it meaning. By making a joke out of it, like Tarantino did, I think the power is taken out of the word. If you take it too seriously, aren't you allowing yourself to be controlled by an anachronism? ------------------
Nah, just being a hypocritical ass. I gotta go with Mr. Oily....If they truly despise this slur, then come out and condemn ALL usage of the word including by high profile black artists, at every opportunity. Do not wait for a high profile, non-blacks use of it to play the racism card and grab the spotlight. Where was the press conference on the Shyne song "N***as Gonna Die" which not only uses the slur but glorifies cold blooded murder. This guy gets a pass because he's black? This doesn't inflame hatred? Of course, I mean, they can't play the racism card there. Not quite the media stir. Not enough face time. Just being pragmatic? What a joke.... [This message has been edited by stringthing (edited July 13, 2001).]
Agreed. What if I was not black but was part of the "black" culture? J-Lo seems to be completely in with the rap crowd. What about Eminem? He says it all the time and nobody accuses him of being a racist (although he does have a number of other problems). ------------------ I hope, when they die, cartoon characters have to answer for their sins.
I think this has already been explained, by Codman: See? I think that's pretty clear. It's all about perception. If a black person is called the n-word by another black person, they may or may not be offended by it. If they are called the n-word by someone of a different race, they are much more likely to be offended by it. You can call that inconsistent or hypocritical if you want, but that is simply the way it is. All the spokesman was trying to say was, "Heck, we think it's bad enough, but given the likely reaction from most blacks, it's even worse that it's coming from a non-black". The spokesman was just being pragmatic. There's no use in him pretending that the reaction to the n-word doesn't differ based on who's saying it. It does differ.
Nope, Achebe, didn't misunderstand you. I completely agree with you. She has no talent whatsoever. Skank City USA. ------------------ "Blues is a Healer" --John Lee Hooker
Eminem uses the word? I don't really listen to his music, but I remember seeing a special on MTV about three derogatory terms commonly used in music, and they said that unlike most rapper, eminem doesn't use that word. ------------------ [This message has been edited by Steve_Francis_rules (edited July 13, 2001).]
Are you sure MTV wasn't talking about Will Smith? Will Smith doesn't cuss in his raps. ------------------ New Order, Electro Superstars
LMAO. The answer is simple. J Lo needs a spanking, and I am just the man to administer the discipline. ------------------
mr oily: Colby already explained why there is a difference. Calling another black person the N word is one of the few autmoatic privelages that we get in life. There aren't many. I would gladly give up that right for various other privelages that we are usually denied. JayZ750: I have both of Eminem's CD's, and I don't ever recall him using the N word. He came close once, but he said Wigga ("who thinks I'm some wigga that tries to be black cause I talk with an accent and grab on my balls......."). The Freak: The problem I have is that nobody "outside of the culture" knows or understands this. The average person thinks "they say it, so it's okay for me to". What about kids? Do you think a young kid who hasn't formed an opinion on race is going to understand this? All that's going to happen is he's going to hear people saying the word, and think it's acceptable (and possibly get his butt kicked for it). Try explaining this to a child..I imagine it's not easy. Using the word 'affectionately' is counter-productive, IMO. The majority of the people that I know outside of the culture know not to address me by using that word, even if they hear others of my race do it. As far as a kids understanding goes, kids don't understand a lot of stuff. That's what growing up is all about.....YOU LEARN. Little boys don't know that they aren't supposed to go into the female bathroom until someone tells them otherwise. This situation is the same. It dosen't take that long to explain something to somebody. ------------------
Man, I want my race to have an exclusive inflammatory word non-offensive to my "own kind"! Ya know, I could be walking down the street and I see one of my homies, "Wuzzup my Wetback?" "How ya doin my Spic?" Guess theres no way around "my peoples" inflammatory terms. Guess I'm just jealous ------------------ This space left intentionally blank... [This message has been edited by mr_oily (edited July 14, 2001).]
mr_oily: It all depends on how you look at it. For example, women call other women the B word, and it's usually not a problem. I can't use it without offending anyone, but I don't complain about it. ------------------
I feel ya, I just don't think its an exclusive word. Baaah this race crap! I think the big difference is the ending of the word "a" VS. "er". Those are pronouced and meant as two different things. The slang used with "a" is just that, a loosely used slang word. Probably used too much. The "er" ending, well, only a true bigot/racist would pronounce it and mean like that. ------------------ This space left intentionally blank...
I don't really want to get into this discussion, but I thought I'd point out something here. Ali says that it should be used by "no artist, no matter what ethnic group you are a part of". If Ali were truly backing up that statement, the group would be going against ALL artists using the word, not just non-African American artists. Again, I don't really care at all about this, but I thought this was somewhat inconsistent because of Ali's specific statement that no one should use it. ------------------ I'm looking for a job, so hire me "And I just have to smile and say 'well, I hope so' while I'm really thinking inside how I'd like to just strangle them and take their job."
TheFreak: I haven't seen/done it all, so I can only go by my personal experiences. I went to a predominately white elementary school (River Oaks), a predominately white middle school (Lanier) and a very diverse college for grad school (UT-Austin). I don't ever recall any student of another race, of any age, thinking that it was okay for them to address me with the N word. Therefore, I conclude that parents are either teaching their kids, or either I was just around a lot of kids with common sense that oick up on things very quickly. There is only one situation that comes to mind, and it happened to me while I was at UT. There is a white member in our fraternity (the only one) and he slipped and said the N word one day, but then he quickly apoligized. No one got mad. ------------------
Any parent making that argument has no business reproducing. Why can't I say it? WHY WOULD I WANT TO? And I don't buy the arguement that it's the intent of the word or the context of how it's used. If my best friend calls his brother the n-word, it's simply not the same if I do it. It carries hundreds of years of bigotry, ignorance, and intollerance, no matter how I said it. j ------------------ Some days you just can't get rid of a bomb!
***** Please! -- I've heard the song -- I can't quite remember the lyric in question but it was in reference to J-Lo's group of friends. I don't know. I'm a Halfrican (Props to Codman for the cool new biracial buzzword ) -- I've never really understood why any African would want to address a friend with "*****" but I guess I lack the cultural heritage that goes behind it. ------------------ Hey now, Hey now, don't Dream it's over...
You know what's sad? There's a segment of African Americans that's trying to end the use of the "N" word and there're dumbasses that have to use it everyday as the 3rd word of every sentence they say. I feel sorry for the former group; they're not winning. Take most gangsta rap. If I don't hear an "N" word nowadays in gangsta rap, something's definitely wrong. When asked why they use the "N" word, the usual response is "that's the way it is in the hood". Yes dumb****, that's the way it is, but there are people trying to make it "not the way it is" and here you go promoting it to kids. I've never agreed with the argument that "when black people say it, it means something different". Right. It's an ignorant, derrogatory word used to connote stupidity in a race; specifically African Americans/blacks. No one's given me an argument that's made me say "yeah, ok, then it's cool". It's not cool. It's ignorant. And to those of you saying "it's just a word", you're right. I suppose you'd never even think twice if someone just walks up to you and introduces you as "a b****", addresses you as "b****", and says "here b****" every other sentence. I'd love to see that happen in the workplace most of all. Sure... you wouldn't even flinch because "it's just a word". The fact is the "N" word does have a meaning and it has a history and that's something that's not easily forgotten. It hits like a ton of bricks for someone like me who's not even African American. ------------------ "I'll tell you this, the older I get, the less I trust people. It's true. It's damn true." -- gr8-1 going through some growing pains.
