New Poll of Iraqis: 82% Oppose US Occupation. 1% Think We Make Them Safer

I have no idea what you're talking about. Please explain your "logic."



Keep D&D Civil.

 

By "in rememberance of all those who lost their lives," does he exclude those hijackers? How about other criminals who died on that day?

As for my badgering his sig in GARM, here is the thing. No matter how you look at it, the 1st half of his signature has a strong political overtone. He always has the option to turn his off sig when posting in GARM. The fact is people don't care about *occasional* political skit in GARM. And I could care less about his sig. My post, "70 insurgents killed by coalition forces in iraq" (which BTW was big news on that day), in that Rockets game thread was a mockery to DaDakota's irrelevant post that was supposed to belong in the Astro forum. Space Ghost elected to offer his unsolicited opinion about my one-liner. Normally I'd accept somebody's nosey advice without any objection in this situation, fully realizing my unintentional post might have crossed line, to some viewers. However, upon seeing his signature, I instantly knew he was just trying to be an ass.

As to his 1st post in this thread, there are just too many holes not even worth my time to debunk one by one.

 

I think there is an issue of sequence here. The civil war in Iraq will break out when/if we leave. The Mexicans and the British had nothing to do with out civil war.

 

It is his opinion, which is shared by a lot of people, whether you agree or not. I have a close relative working in Iraq, and recently for a long stretch in Afghanistan, who repeats the very same argument. He travels widely in country, which worries us, of course, but he has an important position. He has had numerous positive experiences with Iraqis, many of whom work closely with him in a professional relationship. According to him, if they feel strongly against our occupation of Iraq, they are doing a damned good job hiding it.

In my opinion, my relative/friend in theatre is getting a skewed sample of Iraqi feeling about our presence there, but it has been his experience, regardless, and I know and respect him, so I certainly respect his opinion. Why should Space Ghost's opinion be subjected to abuse? A "back and forth" about the issues disagreed upon, but why the attitude? Why the insulting demeanor? Besides, although I don't think so, he could be right.

I don't get it, and the signature obsession with you is just, sorry, juvenile. He pays homage to the victims of 9/11. In my opinion, that trancends politics.



Keep D&D Civil.

 

Me obsessed with his sig or him obsessed with 9/11?

Does he wear 9/11 on his sleeves, have 9/11 bumper stickers on his cars, paste 9/11 pictures where he works and lives, just as he includes reference to 9/11 in a basketball forum whenever he posts?

I tell you what, there was a perfect place for people like Space Ghost, that is, Mao's China. The Chinese had such slogans as "Never Forget Class Struggles!" and "Cultural Revolution Forever!" all over China, religiously. There was no place where you could not see them.

 

Ok, so i couldn't resist holding out on the ignore.

First and foremost, keep your ASSumptions to yourself regarding these matters. You have no basis to call out my signature. If you must insist, I posted that in my signature a few hours after the sept 11 2001 attacks. It has been there for over 4 years, untouched and unedited. This was before GWB was the great western evil b*stard. This was before the war in Afganistan and Iraq. This was even before America had a real clue on what happened that day... so no, politics has absolutely NOTHING do to with my signature. And yes, an apology is due.

Everything you post is for a dramatic effect. Posting "70 insurgents killed ..." in a thread with a bunch of gaming scores reminds me of a certain signature someone once had, "Kent State: 0 National Guard: 4".

The only fact is that your statement is an opinion.

It was quite obvious that this was not an "accidental post". You further admitting that it was not an accident shows that you have/had trollish intentions.

 

As someone who's more connected to the whole thing then I would wish upon my worst enemies, I'd rather not see it in someone's sig on a basketball forum, but whatever, people can do what they want and generally just let these things go - I do.

 

ok so they want us out. lets leave and let them defend themselves.

 

what the heck is wrong w/ giving remembrance to those who died on 9/11? i dont see it as a political issue.

technically, i dont know if you need to give remembrance to those who survived since they are still alive, but what do i know.

 

OK I'll take your words for it, just as I were to believe President George W two-term mandate Bush never politicizes 9/11. So, ghost, upon some deep reflection, I regret mischaracterizing your sig.

 

As much as I disagree with the Bush Administration on everything that they do, I can't believe that only 1% think the troops make it safer for them. They either polled only Sunnis, or they're making it up. I doubt the Kurds in the country share the same opinion. This is a flawed poll.

 

The issue is Space Ghost's sentiment "civil war is much worse than an occupation;" historical cause-effect is besides the point.

 

Whats there not to believe, the troops do a heck of a job, but the cowardly knuckle heads that attack kids at schools and innocent people in the street make it unsafe for people. Remember the troops do not do 24 hour patrols. The troops cant be everywhere all the time. People are scared because once the troops leave to patrol another area, the cowards come out, threaten and kill. It is unsafe, escpecially when you never had to go through this before. Yes i am sure Saddam killed his foes and ruled with an Iron fisk, however I do think that was in the minority not the majority. It happens even in the US. Maybe in different ways though. I really hope we can get these people back on their feet. We will never be able to do it alone though.

 

Why is everyone getting worked up over a "secret" poll described in a tabloid rag like the Telegraph?

 

Typical Bush thinking. do you think Bush's puppet would allow such a poll
to appear on Major Iraqi media?

 

Great,

Let's leave then, and let them commence to fighting amongst themselves.

 

Of course we'll need to leave a quarter of the troops behind to guard the oil wells.

 

...and a couple of military bases to make sure US strategic interests are protected...

does anyone think the US government would actually allow a real independent democracy to break out in Iraq given the assets at stake and the constituencies involved? If you look at the regimes that are our allies and our enemies, it has less to do with whether they are free and democratic than whether or not they do what the US says.

 

I would have put it that it's not that they "do what the US says," but that they act in accordance with our national interests. They frequently don't do what we would like (see Saudi Arabia), but if they ultimately do what is paramount for our national interests (keep the oil flowing), then we pragmatically look the other way at their oppressive, "royal" dictatorship.

We did the exact same thing with Saddam's Iraq, another "royal" dictatorship (Saddam acted the part, why not treat him as such?), until he crossed the line and attacked our fundamental national interests by invading another "royal" dictatorship, Kuwait.

Historically, we tend to hold our nose and hypocritically "ignore" these kinds of governments' picadillos, so long as they serve our vital national interests. Oh, we make the occassional fuss over their internal policies, for our own public consumption, and that of the world, but we basically just look the other way.

Doesn't make us look so great, does it? Great powers have a tendency to act in that fashion. I don't like it, but I can at least understand the underlying rational. Invading Iraq blew that long-standing rational to bits. In my opinion.



Keep D&D Civil.

 

Yes, that's a frequent justification given for conspiracy theories - ie, since a regime in power supposedly controls mass media, any conspiracy theory must be true.