http://www.epa.gov/oms/consumer/f99017.htm http://www.epa.gov/otaq/tr2home.htm ------------------ Houston Sports Board Film Dallas.com AntiBud.com
Now that cracks me up. Seriously, I have often wondered why some gas stations have the accordian like casings over the gas gun nozzle, and then some don't. I would think that would be the first step in helping. Make that a requirement. There are sooooooo many lost fumes and liquid gas spilled because most do not use that device. ------------------ In the end there will be no judges...only witnesses to my greatness.
mrpaige: Look at the language. The document only says that such standards were proposed. I do not believe they have been implemented, or will be implemented shortly. I'm fairly certain that only CA has definitive plans to require equal emissions standards for SUV's and cars in the foreseeable future. In fact, the Boston Globe ran an article just 3 days ago lauding CA for implementing these standards. ------------------ I would believe only in a God who could dance. - Friedrich Nietzsche Boston College - NCAA Hockey National Champions 2001
Mention the X5 and I drool. Oh man, that is the ONLY SUV I'd probably ever buy. It has a beast of an engine and performs like a car. It also has a beast of a pricetag. I love Acuras, but the MDX really didn't do anything for me. As I said, very few small or mid-sized SUV's do anything more than a station wagon would do except maybe tow a bit more. Most of the smaller ones are just built on car frames or just use a car's engine anyway. I admit that for the price, the MDX is a pretty good buy, though. ------------------ NBA Draft Lottery is May 20th. Start praying now.
Last time I checked Honda does have an SUV. But, like I said last post, pollution is a whole different topic than what I was debating originally. I will admit that I am contributing to the pollution of our environment, but unless you live in a plastic bubble, so do you. And even if you did, you would still be contributing because someone had to manufacture the plastic in the first place. I digress.. The point I was trying to make is that you can't just sit there and say "Nobody needs to ever, ever buy an SUV." Who made you God? You don't have any idea about my driving needs, where I live (I just mention this cause you keep bringing up urban vs. rural up),how many kids I have to haul around every day, or the amount of materials I haul every weekend (I'm doing some landscaping on the side). And your original points were fairly weak. Anyway, speaking of the kids, I got to run. Maybe we can continue this tmr. It's been kinda fun so far. ------------------
Heh... of course everyone is responsible for some measure of pollution, it's really a matter of containing how much we cause. If one takes mass transport, one is responsible for less. I recognize that's not possible for everyone, so I think it's best if they drive smaller cars. Some people *are* going to need trucks - there's no getting around that. I just think that as many people should drive the minimum polluter feasible. SUV's though... they don't really hold THAT much more stuff, do they? My uncles' never seems to hold that much more stuff than my mom's aunt's (counting her trunk), but who knows... ------------------ I would believe only in a God who could dance. - Friedrich Nietzsche Boston College - NCAA Hockey National Champions 2001
Yeah, I can see how "The U.S. Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) is announcing more protective tailpipe emissions standards for all passenger vehicles, including sport utility vehicles (SUVs), minivans, vans and pick-up trucks. This regulation marks the first time that SUVs and other light-duty trucks--even the largest passenger vehicles--are subject to the same national pollution standards as cars. And, for the first time, we are treating vehicles and fuels as a system. Simultaneously, EPA is announcing lower standards for sulfur in gasoline, which will ensure the effectiveness of low emission-control technologies in vehicles and reduce harmful air pollution. When the new tailpipe and sulfur standards are implemented, Americans will benefit from the clean-air equivalent of removing 164 million cars from the road. These new standards require passenger vehicles to be 77 to 95 percent cleaner than those on the road today and reduce the sulfur content of gasoline by up to 90 percent." sounds like it's just proposed and not adopted. And: "Today's action finalizes a major program designed to significantly reduce the emissions from new passenger cars and light trucks, including pickup trucks, vans, minivans, and sport-utility vehicles. These reductions will provide for cleaner air and greater public health protection, primarily by reducing ozone and PM pollution. The program is a comprehensive regulatory initiative that treats vehicles and fuels as a system, combining requirements for much cleaner vehicles with requirements for much lower levels of sulfur in gasoline." And the fact that they were published in the Federal Register as complete and adopted. I guess you're right, these are just proposals that aren't adopted yet. I wonder what the EPA was thinking putting these things in the Federal Register as adopted when they clearly aren't? ------------------ Houston Sports Board Film Dallas.com AntiBud.com
Check the EPA's Green Vehicle Guide, which ranks all 2000 and 2001 models according to tailpipe emissions. A 2000 Chevrolet Suburban 1500 with a 5.7L engine has an overall rating of 0, meaning it emits between 63.8 and 121.1 Pounds of Smog-Forming Pollution Per 15,000 Miles. Compare to a 2000 Honda Civic with a 1.6L engine. The Civic has an overall rating of 6, meaning it emits between 12.3 and 12.9 Pounds of Smog-Forming Pollution Per 15,000 Miles. Best case scenario - a 2000 Suburban emits over 5 times more pounds of pollution per 15,000 miles. [This message has been edited by jamcracker (edited May 17, 2001).]
Mr. Paige You didn't include this: " The new standards are expected to be adopted by California and are consistent with those proposed in Europe giving manufacturers the advantage of using a single engine or machine design for all markets and avoid the added cost of multiple versions. Small businesses were consulted by a Small Advocacy Review Panel, the first one convened by the Agency under the Small Business Regulatory Enforcement Fairness Act. In response to the panel's recommendations, several flexibility provisions were adopted in the final rule to minimize cost impacts and assist small businesses in implementing the program." or: " EPA proposes Tier 2 tailpipe emissions standards beginning in 2004the first time both cars and light-duty trucks are subject to the same national pollution control system. The new standard is 0.07 gpm for NOx, a 77-86 percent reduction for cars and a 92-95 percent reduction for trucks beyond the NLEV agreement. EPA also proposes a reduction in average sulfur levels to 30 parts per million (ppm) (maximum of 80 ppm) to achieve the full performance of vehicle emission control technologies. As part of these new standards, EPA has included several measures to ensure maximum flexibility and cost-effectiveness. These flexibilities include: allowing averaging to meet both the car emission and gasoline sulfur standards; allowing extra time for larger vehicles between 6000 and 8500 pounds and smaller refiners to meet their respective standards; and allowing for a market-based credit trading-and-banking system for both industries to reward those who lead the way in reducing pollution." Certainly sounds to me like they're not sure yet. Besides, Jamcracker is right about it being much worse anyway. They still guzzle . Sorry if I managed to arouse your ire, I just don't think you're correct. I know I have a tendency to be a little heated in discussions, and I apologize for htat. ------------------ I would believe only in a God who could dance. - Friedrich Nietzsche Boston College - NCAA Hockey National Champions 2001
Heavier cars cause more wear on roads as well. My boss says he remembers a time when the annual vehical registration fee was tied to the weight on the vehicle. Heavier vehicles cause more road damage - so they had to contribute more to road repair funds.
97' Blazer and I love it. My only complaint though is with the tinted rear window backing up at night is a little difficult. ------------------ Ceo of the Walt Williams and Lisa Malosky fan club. atheistalliance.org
I'm glad to see someone got back to the original topic of this thread. I have a green 1994 Silverado and I'm thrilled with it (of course, I've only had it about a week ). ------------------ Isabel,clutchcity.net lurker since 1996 All your base are belong to Heypartner.
I drive a 2000 BMW M3. Bought it about 6 months ago. I love this car, its sporty and luxury. Cost a whole alot of money to get it. I need some help with prices. Im most likely going to buy a bike soon. The Bike that I want is a Yamaha R1. I dont know how what price is good and bad. Can someone tell me what price range is good to get a Yamaha R1? ------------------ "Break off the block like Maurice Green" --- Steve Francis President of the Moochie Norris fan club.
And when was the last time you took 6 people to the lake while towing a 4000 lb. boat in a Civic? ------------------ In the end there will be no judges...only witnesses to my greatness.
1998 Ford Ranger 4X4 Flareside Kick-ass off roading truck. Only downside is the 15 mpg in the city. ------------------ "Oh No..." -Bill Walton in 97 just before Stockton's buzzer beater
I really, really like my Audi A4. I'll probably buy the new design within the next year or so. Of course, the problem with Audis (and many other European cars) is that it is hard to find people to fix them when they need it. And it's hard to get in for service at the dealerships (even just routine maintenance) because the cars popularity has exceeded the repair capacity at most dealerships (and having all scheduled maintenance paid for by the factory for the first 50K miles also adds to the problem since many people who would normally go to the Jiffy Lube for oil changes go to the dealership instead to get the free oil changes). ------------------ Houston Sports Board Film Dallas.com AntiBud.com
I currently own a 00 Lexus GS 300 and a 00 Toyota Avalon. The GS is the best car for its money. Screw a Benz and Jag with their high maintenance costs. I am the worst person with directions so I got it with the navigation system which is absolutely BAD ASS! The Avalon is probably the best car below $40K. ------------------
No arguing that. The GS 300 is a good car, but the real deal is the 430. ------------------ NBA Draft Lottery is May 20th. Start praying now.
loaded 2000 Nissan Maxima SE -- love that car. Too bad it's my wife's I drive a 1994 Nissan Pathfinder. Could be in line soon to get something else but not sure what I'd want. ------------------ NOTHING BUT .NET CLUTCHCITY.NET
