At least this won't be the start of WWIII. Here is the link. http://www.nytimes.com/2001/04/11/world/11CND-CHINA.html ------------------
Are you a NY Times salesperson? I appreciate you not pasting the whole article here, but I can read your link...it is asking me to register... *sigh*
Poor Ali. So misunderstood. Here's a link that is freeeeeeeee : http://www.cnn.com/2001/WORLD/asiapcf/east/04/11/air.collision.07/index.html ------------------ "So you say you want some intelligent responses? I say give me something intelligent to respond to." -- Dimwits beware, B-Ball freak tells it like it is. Sing it bro! [This message has been edited by Dr of Dunk (edited April 11, 2001).]
Hate the NYTimes online. Try this one... http://www.cnn.com/2001/WORLD/asiapcf/east/04/11/air.collision.07/index.html ------------------ And then, depression set in...
Jeff, quit double-posting my responses... lol. Scary. ------------------ "So you say you want some intelligent responses? I say give me something intelligent to respond to." -- Dimwits beware, B-Ball freak tells it like it is. Sing it bro!
China's position is still very unclear to me. How can we be blamed for being run into? The 24 guys were in one of those bigass planes that take like a mile just to turn 5 degrees and the Chinese guy was in a very mobile fighter jet! Regardless, I think in the end the situation on the American side was handled well. I mean, who doesn't regret the loss of life. ------------------ Haha.. you fool! You fell victim to one of the classic blunders. The most famous is: Never get involved in a land war in Asia. Only slightly less well know is this: Never go in against a Sicilian when death is on the line!
Dealing with China is a lot like dealing with one's wife. Sometimes you have to say you're wrong even when you aren't. ------------------ Houston Sports Board
Good to see you back. So, I guess we send up another spy plane and repeat, lather, rinse? Good day! Surf ------------------
The nytimes site rocks. Just use "guest" and "password" as the login/password. That combo has worked for at least 5+ years.
LOL -- thanks jamcracker -- IT DOES WORK! ------------------ "Up and down, inside out, outside in, some you lose some you win" -- DMB -> "Sweet Up and Down"
Step 1 - Get our people back - Completed Step 2 - Get our plane back Step 3 - Recover the cost of repairs from the Chinese gov. Step 4 - Resume reconaissance flights ------------------ "Of course, thats just my opinion, I could be wrong" -- Dennis Miller
Sorry! I didn't know that it didn't work. hehe. I forgot that I had registered. here is a copy of the article: U.S. Air Crew Departs China, Ending 11-day Standoff By CRAIG S. SMITH HAIKOU, China, Thursday, April 12 - Twenty-one men and three women boarded a Continental Airlines plane this morning for the first leg of their trip home, ending 11 days in Chinese custody that began when their spy plane collided with a Chinese fighter jet and made an emergency landing on Hainan island. They lifted off at 7:29 a.m. from this city's Meilan-Haikou International Airport for Guam. Word spread early Wednesday that the American crew would be released after journalists across the country who are mid-ranking Communist Party members and above were called to attend secret meetings at which they were ordered to stick to official New China News Agency accounts when reporting the news. The message, according to people who attended one meeting, was that America should be blamed for the incident and that the struggle would continue because the American surveillance aircraft will remain on Chinese soil. The $100 million EP-3E Aries II, which was heavily damaged in the collision with the Chinese F-8 that was tailing it, is sitting on the airstrip where the American crew's pilot brought it to rest after a harrowing 15-minute ride that aviators describe as just short of miraculous. The Chinese announced late Wednesday afternoon that the crew would be released, and broadcast the word nationally at about 7 p.m. The Continental plane that will bring the crew back left Guam this afternoon with a team of military officials. There were also doctors and psychologists on board who will conduct preliminary examinations of the crew. A chartered commercial airliner was used because the Chinese insisted that no military aircraft be used to pick up the crew, government officials said. Once the plane returns to Guam, a military C-17 cargo aircraft is to take the crew to the Hickham Air Force Base near Honolulu. The Pentagon planned to keep the 24 crew members at Hickham for more thorough examinations and debriefings on the flight and the crew's detention. The Pentagon hopes to learn more about the collision itself, the crew's success in destroying sensitive intelligence equipment and codes aboard and the degree to which the Chinese questioned the crew. ``It's like a crime scene,'' one government official said in Washington. ``You want access to them as quickly as possible while their memory is still fresh.'' President Bush himself ordered the crew members to be back home by Easter, forcing officials at the United States Pacific Command in Hawaii to curtail the crew's stay in Honolulu and prepare to fly the crew members more quickly, the officials said. The decision to release the crew came after delivery of a diplomatic letter to China's Foreign Minister, Tang Jiaxuan, from United States Ambassador Joseph W. Prueher that contained carefully parsed words meant to allow both sides to claim victory in resolving the diplomatic impasse over the crew and plane. The letter was the culmination of more than a week of near round-the-clock negotiations between the two capitals during which both sides blamed the other. China demanded an apology and an admission of responsibility from the United States. State media began preparing the nation for the crew members' release by announcing Tuesday evening that hope was dwindling that a maritime search here would turn up the missing pilot of the Chinese jet that crashed after the collision on April 1. The search, already the largest and longest in Chinese naval history, has not been called off, however. As of Wednesday evening, 95 ships, 107 planes, more than 1,000 helicopters and 56,000 people were involved in the search for the pilot, Wang Wei, according to state media. In the hours after the government's announcement, a crowd of 60 or 70 angry people gathered in a light rain across from the military hostel where the Americans were housed. Loud debates rose and fell among the crowd as they waited to see the Americans, whom many people blame for the loss of the Chinese pilot and see as representatives of American aggression. ``We're not satisfied,'' said a shirtless man who identified himself as Wang Min. People pressed around him agreed. Like many Chinese, he asked why the Americans should be allowed to go free if they were spying on China, as the media here has charged. ``America came and struck us on our doorstep, but we can't strike back,'' complained Mao Yunzao, 32, a laborer who spoke with the staccato accent of Mao Zedong's native Hunan province. ``If Mao were still around there'd be a war.'' One man at a sign shop opposite the hostel's gate wrote in large characters in red ink on a plywood board, ``We Oppose Hegemony, Give Us Back Wang Wei,'' a reference to the missing pilot. He carried it across the street and set it up in front of the hostel gate where a small crowd gathered around it before plainclothesmen carried the sign into the hostel compound. Another sign bearing the same message, this time in black ink, was soon lifted above the crowd in front of the sign shop before a plainclothesman pulled it down, and another sign was soon made to replace it. When asked if the sign makers weren't afraid of trouble with the police, one man replied, ``China is now a free country, we have human rights.'' But again a plainclothesman took the sign away and soon an official arrived to order all of the shops along the street to close and pull down their metal gates. ``The government should wait until we find Wang Wei before they let the Americans go,'' cried another man. When yet another called for America to pay damages, he shouted back, ``Compensation is no use. We lost a man. Can money repay the loss of a life?'' Zhao Ling, who owns a neighboring bar and who wrote one of the signs, drew applause from a small crowd when he declared, ``China is too tolerant of America.'' Shortly before dawn, the steel-bar gate to the small concrete compound opened to allow in a convoy that included two mini-buses with darken windows. About 5:45 a.m., the buses pulled out onto Airport Road, carrying the crewmembers. A group of journalists keeping vigil across the road scrambled for taxis to follow the bus to the airport, where a Continental Micronesia jet was waiting to start the crew's journey home. The crew were kept incommunicado for three days after their plane landed at a military base on the south end of Hainan Island. Finally, they were moved to the island's capital, Haikou, where they were allowed to meet for 40 minutes with two American officials, U.S. Army Brig. Gen Neal Sealock, the United States' defense attache in China, and Ted Gong, a senior consular official from Guangzhou. The two officials met with some or all of the crew four more times over the following two weeks, providing them with underwear and books, snacks and e-mails from home while their detention ballooned into an international crisis between Washington and Beijing. ------------------
------------------ Im too drunk to walk ... Im driving home! [This message has been edited by Space Ghost (edited April 12, 2001).] [This message has been edited by Space Ghost (edited April 12, 2001).]
I'm glad these people are back home with their families. Thats good. Also, don't forget a chinese pilot lost his life, weather or not of course he's a commie or not, this is a loss nonetheless to another family. I guess I care less about World politics than the rest of the U.S., but when they were being detained, it was like "bring our boys home" BOO-HOO! The attitude was as if this were the Korean or Vietnam war and they are POWs or something. Oooh, did they keep 'em in a bamboo cage and torture them? How many days did they bake in solitary without food or water? Geeez, how long were they "prisoners" for, oh maybe a week? And the news reported, "they got to stop in Guam to shower and shave"...oh, THANK GOD and GO BLESS AMERICA! What suffering to go without shaving! Hell, my father was in Vietnam and wasn't around when I was born. Hes told me stories of cleaning out cargo planes from dead bodies and the stench it carried. This is a total overreaction in my opinion. True it was a tense POLITICAL situation with China and our relations with them, but what, are these guys gonna get a parade or something. Should I get my American flag out and hang it in front of my house, for "our boys"? Relations with China need to get better, dialogue needs to happen, this is what is news. Well, thank goodness for the families and this business is over, on to sports... ------------------ Whatever you want to do, you have to do something else first.
woa...there partner.....thems fightin' words! ------------------ Everything you do, effects everything that is.
The article above that Ali Cat posted is interesting. That guy from china is ready to go to war in the name of opposing hegomoy or becuase one life was lost, yet murder and strife are abound everyday in his own backyard. ------------------ [This message has been edited by ROCKETBOOSTER (edited April 12, 2001).]