It was mentioned in a thread where Yao was burned by this call, and Seattle's season was just ended because of it. Do I not know the rules, because if I am right, this has to be the most blown call in the NBA? It has been blown countless times where it is a simple call to make. It has also decided many, many games incorrectly. Just like Yao is constantly called for this play, I just saw Ginobili fly uncontrollably into Fortson and Fortson was called for the block while he was standing perfectly still (body turned to avoid injury) with his hands over his head. Ginobili then sunk two free throws, while Seattle was eliminated from the playoffs, losing by 2 points one minute later. A ref should be fired for this one. Can you imagine how much money Seattle loses because of this incident? I can tell you that it is probably more than that refs salary for 100 years. Tom Tolbert seemed to be as clueless about the NBA rulebook as the refs were. He proclaimed that because Fortson turned his body, it would be a foul anywhere on the court. NBA Block-Charge Guidelines Once again, the NBA refs blow it in grand fashion.
I thought San Antonio was the beneficiary of an awful lot of calls in tonite's game. I also felt that Detroit got the vast majority of questionable calls in the earlier game as well. In full disclosure, I was rooting for Seattle and Detroit tonite.
Just one more fact: Fortson's feet were set before Ginobili left the ground. No call should have been made. Ginobili is the Shaquille Oneal of guards. He never gets called for offensive fouls as he drives like a defensive end going after the quarterback. He is never in control of himself.
Well, nba has always been biased against certain players... like fortson and to certain degree yao ming....
If Fortson was in the restricted area, then it should be a blocking foul (assuming Ginobili was not Fortson's primary assignment). If Fortson was set and outside the restricted area, then it should be an offensive foul. If there is substantial contact on a drive to the basket, it should never be a no call.
This is one of the truest comments I have ever read at CC. I went down from Austin to SA to cheer for the Rox in the Sunday game where Duncan was out and the Rox left their focus somewhere on I-10. The guy in front of us (trying to impress his date) was going on and on and on about "Manu this" and "Manu that". Finally, I couldn't take it any longer. In a voice I was sure they both could hear I looked over at my friend and said..."After Shaq, no one in the NBA gets more favorable offensive postition calls than Ginobili". Fortunately, their mindless droolng stopped. Unfortunately, the Rox didn't get going.
Actually i think it was jerome james, but i can't remember for sure. And yea, damn tolbert was talking about how ginobili is the best at making contact when driving the ball. Never offensive foul, damn
Ive always felt that the offensive charge/defensive blocking rule is the most blown call in the NBA. In SA's defense, the other night, Duncan made a drive to the basket and was called for an offensive foul, despite the FACT that the defender moved into Duncan's path AFTER Duncan had already picked up his dribble and was only set AFTER Duncan had taken his last step before attempting to put up the shot. MOST BLOWN CALL IN THE NBA BY FAR A defender should never get an offensive foul call AFTER moving into position AFTER the offensive player picks up his dribble. NEVER
Doesn't Ginobili travel every time he drive to the hoop? 1 driblle from the free throw line to the rim?
I agree 100%. I'm sick of seeing guys called for a foul simply because an offensive guy charged into them while they were inside the restricted area. It's crap. Evan
Yeah, that was a horrible call, especially by the rule book. And it was James. It was his 6th foul and that helped San Antonio get the easy winning layup.
That's what I'm talking about.... the rulebook, as far as I can tell doesn't say this. The restricted zone means that no offensive foul will be called. That's it. All the same rules apply for the defensive player's position that do outside the restricted zone I think. If the defensive players establishes legal position, then he should not be called for a foul no matter how much contact the offensive player forces. As far as I know, the rule was created to reduce the benefit the defender has in creating a potentially dangerous undercut situation. It wasn't created to eliminate the benefit of playing position defense. It seems that Francis, Ginobili, and Bryant all use it as a free ticket to the foul line in the forth quarter, and it actually increases the chance of them getting injured because it is super-easy way to draw a foul. If you drive uncontrollably into the teeth of the defense, you are guaranteed two shots. I've also read the rule was created for guys like Shaq who tend to commit offensive fouls on point blank dunks. The league doesn't want Shaq fouling out on those plays. I'm just upset because I don't think out of control guards should get automatic fouls any time they want at the end of games. ESPECIALLY since the NBA doesn't use instant replay. Great players like McGrady are at a lesser advantage when less talented players can get these bad calls. James is right. I can't separate Fortson and James in my head for some reason. They both have the same chunky builds.
I am with you. I think a foul should never be called on a player who has established legal position. It just encourages players to charge hard to the basket without control. That's just bad basketball. If you've ever played against players who do that uncontrolled charging toward the basket, you know what I mean. I hate the restricted zone, and hate even more the constant blown calls.
Good point Doctor. I agree with you. It is hard enough to play defense in this league. A defensive player who established position should not be penalized for it just because he is inside some certain area. It should be a no call at best. The only calls should be if the defender reaches out from vertical (waist, arms, wrists, fingers). They should even be allowed to jump straight up with arms vertical, the old vertical space rule.
Hell . . to be honest I hate T-mac's famous 4 point play I hate the pump fake then jump into the guy thing it is just plain cheesy like the calling a time out in the air on the way out of bounds thing [I was happy when they out lawed that crap] PLAY THE D*MN game stop trying to grease around the rules of easy points Whoever INITIATES contact IMO should be the person getting the foul Rocket River a non contact sport???? NOT BLOODY LIKELY!!
I agree on that one as well. As far as I can tell, that is an offensive foul. If the defender has established position, and jumps straight up.... Contact Situations It is interesting reading the rule book for once rather than relying on dopes like Tom Tolbert to dispense information about it. I also can't find a rule that allows post players to dislodge each other and wrestle for position, which occurs on every single play of every single game (except in the Phoenix/Dallas series). There must be a rule for that? I know we have some capologists... any rule experts around? Too much like reading the dang building code for me...
