So BR released one of their lists and while I can agree with most of those above Dream, but 3 of them I cannot and those are: Kobe, Curry and Shaq. Here’s my case: Shaq needed Kobe and Kobe needed Shaq and later Pau. Dream had Thorpe and old ass Drexler as his 2nd man for those 2 trophies. Plus skill wise and taking both sides of the floor into account, then both of those + Curry are not better. Shaq 1-on-1 would lose plain and simple and only had his power, Dream had everything else. Curry got KD for 2 of the 4 rings. Compare Dream’s teams vs Curry and the latter had easily the better team for 3 out of 4. Olajuwon’s defense is all-time great vs Curry’s offense all-time great, which cancels each other out. Now Olajuwon offense vs Curry defense to me is easy who takes that. Unless you argue that somehow Curry’s gravity on offense and elite shooting is better than anything Olajuwon did on defense or even offense and I’ll counter with: footwork + creative moves on offense and defensive accolades. And to add one more for Kobe: he was not elite enough on either side to warrant a place above Dream. Thoughts? And who would you agree Dream should be above those 3? Or do others deserve in top 10 over him or are others in the current top 10 who should be lower than Dream? Please make your case if you believe so.
I don't care who you take out but Hakeem NEEDS to be in the top 10. Arguably one of the top 2 or 3 two-way players ever.
I only accept Hakeem at 12 because this list explicitly states that it takes everything into account, from championships to "cultural impact". With that criteria, having someone like Kobe ahead of him makes total sense. But if I'm assembling a team to win a basketball game and I can have anybody at the peak of their powers, no way in hell there are 10 guys I'm taking over Hakeem.
Casual fans and many national media just look at Rings + Offense and never really go in depth when ranking. You need casual fans to click your website. Offense, defense, team support, competition, peak, longevity and era rules as well as counting and advanced stats paint a much better picture and look at everything holistically. I value playoff performance over regular season and peak equal to longevity within reason personally. But it will likely never get that deep for casuals or national media. Rings and offense typically are what do it for those lists as well as echoing other previous takes. Many can't even rank players defensively or even look at that side of the ball. Btw, greatness and resume is one thing, which is very much based on team support, competition and rules of the era. Championships are a team accomplishment not individual, so why not go all the way and analyze the team/situations imo. But as an individual two way player and holding a microscope to players, Hakeem is top 5 all time and the GOAT center for me personally.
Prime Hakeem is a top 2 or 3 all around player of ALL TIME. The argument against Hakeem - and I think it's valid, is that he wasn't Prime Hakeem for very long. The guy who could dominate every aspect of the game defensively, and every aspect of the game offensively was probably a 4 year window into his early 30s and he was still figuring out parts of the game before that which is incredible because he started playing basketball at 15. He was a great player in the 80s, but he wasn't dominant from the start like young Shaq or young Lebron and it took a while before Dream was a one man wrecking crew every night. I also think Magic is probably a little overrated here considering how terrible he was defensively for much of his career but no doubt he changed the game in a profound way as defining what a dominant playmaker could do to help a team much like Curry defined what being an dominant shooter could do to to help an entire team. These lists are always prone to bias when they aren't specific to what the criteria is. I think 10/11 is about right for Hakeem to me all time for his career but I would put him up in the top 5 along with Jordan, Lebron, Bird if we are talking about one player's peak to go win a game with a bunch of rando dudes.
Dream is definitely top 10 (probably top 5)....as is Jokic. Duncan and Curry shouldn't be there. Doc should be higher too.
One could make a strong argument that Dream had a greater cultural influence than Kobe considering he's the first guy born in Africa to lead his team to an NBA championship and paved the way for acceptance of foreign players in both college and the NBA as well increasing the prominence of hoops in many countries. Admittedly, he did not have the US marketing impact of Kobe--something which often gets conflated with culture.
I will die on the hill that Hakeem is better than both Shaq AND Timmy Duncan It's harder to compare him to guys like Bird, Wilt, Kobe, Steph because they played different positions and/or different eras. (Yes Duncan was listed as a power forward, but come on.) I think it could go either way with those guys, though of course as a Rockets homer I would take Hakeem. But objectively, sure, I can at least see the argument. Hakeem was nearly as good as Shaq on offense and MUCH better on defense (it's not even close IMO), and had much less help over his career. He was better on both ends than Duncan and only didn't have as much playoff success because he wasn't gifted with a HoF supporting cast throughout his career the way Timmy was.
Dream is the greatest all around 2-way center. Whether that puts him #3 or #17 doesn't really matter to me. Dream is a better Mutombo rim protector, WITH Gary Payton steals, AND Rodman rebounds. While giving top 5-10 scoring with one of a kind post-play fluidity
Needs more respect as a two way player. Steph for example while best shooter of all time is a negative on D and relied on multiple other all stars, including a recent MVP to help get titles. Dream was one of the leagues best scorers while also being the best defender for majority of his career. I also fail to see how Duncan can be over him. Yes he won a lot but far inferior defender and had excellent supporting cast while never touching Dreams offensive numbers.
some people just have no appreciation for the fact that the game is won or lost on both ends of the court... if u look at all of these players contributions on BOTH ends of the court - Olajuwon is prob top 5. Curry? lol... u can be the best offensive player ever, but if u r a liability on the other end... then ur only half of a great player. but its like when some folks on here were insisting that "defense doesnt really matter in today's NBA" and it was all about the 3 ball... lol... yeh, good times... lol
Stop making friends with people that get their basketball knowledge from YouTube and TikTok professional shouters. Moreover, one can’t even pretend that starement is true unless they only watch offensive possessions and box scores. Get less dumbass friends. Or stop hanging out with autists. Asked for a friend - answered for you.
