Why is Trump covering up the Epistein files and lying to the public?

Alienating 50% of the USA is not going to lead to anything positive and can lead to violence.

The whole point is to govern - an that is how you make changes, not dragging Donald Trump's past into congressional investigations.

 

With conspiracy theories it's always the government cover up, shady players with interest in these things going away, and the lies that makes these things stick over time.

The people who want these things to go away as fast as possible, just raise more suspicion that they have a political or legal reason for them to go away. So that's why when you come on here to be like "NOTHINGBURGER. Move on".... it raises suspicion that you have a political interest in it going away.

Allen Dulles on the Warren Commission.... Vested in interest in hiding the CIA's involvement with Cuban Exiles, and their connection to Lee Harvey

Bill Barr being in charge of handling Epstein between arrest and trial.... Vested interest's galore in ensuring none of the wealthy donors or political leaders in the Republican Party get pulled into this when it goes to trial & evidence is made public.

Alot of conspiracy theories are true nothingburgers like PizzaGate where there's just a made up excuse for right wing nuts to get on the internet and spread theories about the Jews, Hillary Clinton, or the Illuminate being behind child blood rituals, etc. However there are some that do stand the test of time not because they are proven, but mostly because those with a vested interest in them going away start lying and covering up things to the public. THAT is what makes something like JFK stand out from Pizzagate, and Lizard people Qanon crap.

Trump going off on a reporter and trying to bully the media into not asking about Epstein anymore..... Yeah.... that is only going to make this conspiracy theory balloon out of proportion even more.

 

Exactly, surprised @astros123 starting this thread

 

With all due respect, history shows that your theory is very unlikely. When a corrupt, criminal tyrant finally is taken out of power they are typically diminished beyond repair in the end because when someone like Trump realizes he cannot stay in power, they ALWAYS do something incredibly unpopular to try and stay in power, and then their supporters just act like they never supported the guy.

If Trump is NOT diminished, and still powerful over his electorate then I assume Don Jr, and Vance will win, and Trump will continue to be the King of America in an unelected role, and we are truly fcked at that point for the foreseeable future. In 2028 though either he's diminished, or he's more powerful. The whole half of the country we need to coddle bit is kind of irrelevant anyways.

Even over in Russia where Putin has like an 90% approval (apparently) if he was taken out of power either militarily, or democratically, history shows that while Putin might have some supporters, the vast majority of Russians even would not be mourning his demise.

Trump has his cult followers for sure.... but more than anything most of these people are cowards, and nobody wants to go down on a sinking ship. Trump only has the power he has over his people because he's a vessel for them to get what they want out of him. The moment he is seen to be diminished, you will be shocked at how many of his most vocal supporters will act as though they've never heard of the guy.

....

But to answer the question of prosecutions... I think it's unlikely at that point. The Democrats will just want him to go away more than anything, but if/when Trump tries something worse than January 6th to stay in power, you better believe he will need to be held to account even though Garland was a coward last time for not doing it on day 1. This time, a Democratically appointed AG will probably be forced to prosecute him for what we all know he's going to try to do because it's going to be so obviously criminal.

So unfortunately I don't think Trump is going to give a Democratic AG in 2029 any choice... BUT the Supreme Court ruling from last year is likely to keep him out of jail anyways.

To my earlier point about history, most people like Trump when they leave power... yeah.... they don't have a great survival rate... not just politically, but quite literally.

 

Maybe Trump ends up doing something incredibly unpopular at the end of his second term. It is certainly possible as he did at the end of his first term - but he survived and actually became more popular.

I suppose the closest to what you are talking about in US history is Richard Nixon - or perhaps the Confederacy.

Two very stark differences in how supporters handled them.

I am not ready to put Trump in the Putin camp or Stalin, Lenin etc... not yet.

Also, if you go to Russia, there are a lot of people that have fond opinions of Josef Stalin and Lennin as well. The one that is vilified is Gorbachev.

Also - in the cases of these people, their memory was largely purged through direct actions of the state.

People abandon sinking ships - but that is assuming that Trump is going to leave office in handcuffs or some terrible shame. It is very possible that he doesn't run for re-election and the Republicans prop him up like they did Reagan or the Democrats did FDR.

Either way, your point has merit and we will have to see what happens.

 

Crimes were committed and people belong in jail.

There is probably no deep state conspiracy theory where Epstein was running a spy ring and blackmailing all the prominent people in America. He was a playboy running around high on his own supply and it finally caught up to him. If Trump is now deciding to do nothing about it, like everyone else before him, then its a nothing burger.

 

It is because a lot of them are former QAnon people.

 

To the Jan 6th point -

I will note that Trump was rehabilitated for one reason, and one reason only-

Trump had leverage with the hundreds of millions of dollars at this disposal to start a 3rd party that would ensure Republicans wouldn't win a single key race in 2022, or the Presidency in 2024. That is it. That is why the GOP, FoxNews, etc. decided to rehabilitate him starting with Kevin McCarthy kissing the ring in Mar-A-Lago.

Win or lose will Trump still have leverage over the Republican party.... well almost surely because he now is the Republican Party, but it might not matter. He's either going to be a successful dictator or a failed corrupt wannabe criminal dictator. If he fails the Republican Party probably has to be remade or rebuilt anyways.

 

Political mistake. Should have appointed him to lead the United States Children's Bureau.

 

I'm just saying that what you just said... is exactly the kind of thing that gets said that makes conspiracy theories explode more. The more you try and call something a nothingburger, use terms that diminish the severity, etc. the more conspiracy theorists think you have something to hide. At all levels from the AG herself to a simple online activist like yourself... from top to bottom when the messaging is clearly designed to diminish when there are obvious questions not answered.... guess what.... the conspiracy theory gets more interesting, and more life is breathed into it.

Trump is strategically stupid for his little outburst yesterday to try and bully this thing away. It's crazy how in the past 48 hours like I've never seen before, even with Trump supporters, they are now finally starting to think that maybe Trump has something to hide when in the past they've always given him the benefit of the doubt. Simply because he's doing the thing that always makes it worse.

 

It feels like you are going a little soft on Trump here Nook.

 

Do you have any idea how relieved I would be, and how happy I would be to be wrong in that case??

I would LOVE for it to be the case that Trump just leaves office in 2028, but I just see no evidence that he's not going to do what nearly every other person that takes the steps he has taken does.

I also think even if he does technically not run again, if he's alive he's still running again under his son's name, and Vance. However the theory I have IF he does technically not run is that he'll still be the closing act in the campaign. He'll still be the one calling the shots... and if Don Jr, and Vance are elected, I would suspect they'll invent a new role in the White House like "Prime Minister" that he takes that'll supersede their authority in every way.

But I don't think Trump is wired that way, and I don't think he can even fathom the thought of his son having any agency over him even if it's just ceremonially.

Again I will be thrilled to be wrong here, but I see no evidence whatsoever that Trump is not going to try something to stay in power till he dies, and he'll do anything he can get away with... which is now ALOT.

 

related

link will work for everyone

‘People Will Die’ Isn’t the Policy Clincher It Seems
Trade-offs can’t be made to disappear by saying the three favorite words of the anti-Trump resistance.

https://www.wsj.com/opinion/people-...1?st=rL1nqS&reflink=desktopwebshare_permalink

 

Maybe he's right that he's not there yet in term of acts like murder that aren't on his hands yet, but I think he has more money, and military power than they ever had to do something terrible, and he has a mind & moral consciousness that is just as bad as any of them.

Nook is a smart guy, and someone whose opinion I respect alot but we continually see with the smartest of all political strategists here in the US a continual failure of imagination with Trump to anticipate what he has the capacity to do. We've seen it over and over again. You know how many times people here... the smartest ones.... told me in 2019 that I was crazy for stating the theory that I thought Trump would try and create a fake crisis to contest the 2020 election, and use the 12th amendment to call for a House vote to reinstate him as president during a contested election???

Trump went even FURTHER than I thought in that case, and I was called the irrational one by some really really smart people here.

 

I've been to Gori, Georgia. They have Stalin Park, on Stalin Street, with Stalin's birth home and the train car he took to Yalta on display in front of the Stalin Museum. It was a trip.

 

Our (age adjusted) death rates are considerably higher than our peers - all western/northern European countries, Japan, SK, Singapore, Australia, NZ, Israel, Canada. Should preventing more people from dying not be one of the top goals from the Government, given that fact? Seems like a mismanagement problem.

If we were sitting amongst Japan and Spain, I might find some of the arguments made in that article more compelling.

 

Taking revenge on your voters doesn't seem like a recipe for long term success. And we saw how Trump managed to make voters think a prosecution of him was a persecution of them. Maybe someday we will get to see who is right.