A lil 3-way hypothetical while Melton has a good game: Mets get: CF Jake Meyers P Forrest Whitley Reds get: 1B Ryan Clifford P Blade Tidwell Astros get: 2B Gavin Lux 3B Jacob Reimer Astros playoff roster: SS Pena 3B Paredes DH Alvarez LF Altuve RF Smith CF Melton 1B Walker 2B Lux C Diaz Bench: Dubon, Caratini, McCormick, Salazar SP: Framber, Brown, McCullers, Arrighetti RP: Hader, Abreu, King, Okert, Dubin, Ort, Sousa, Javier, Garcia
I can't see it either. If we're in the race you can't move them if you're wanting to win. Framber would carry the price of a 1 with how he's pitching.
I mean- Framber has been a 1 for the last 5 years. He’s been, in my opinion, a top 5 pitcher in the AL since Covid but inarguably a top 10 guy. Our fanbase slander toward Framber is weird. I encounter it all over the place.
I think it is because Astros fans think of peak Gerrit Cole or JV when they think of top 5 or top 10 SP. Hence, hunter brown seems to fit the “mold”. Frambers results across this time frame are inarguable, but his “style points” are atypical. Inducing grounders at league leading rates is different from striking out the world with overpowering stuff. Mental meltdowns is different from getting hit hard because you lost your location on your 80 grade stuff and it gets hit. It is about the mold of an ace and style points. We are all guilty of it to some degree when assessing/appreciating Framber, but smart fans can get past that and see his true value. Regular joe fans get bogged down in style points and regard Framber as SP2.
I guess, but not really. Fangraphs has 6 different projection systems, 5 of them have Dubon as the better player going forward. And the margin of even the one projection that likes Estrada better wouldn’t even come close to justifying giving up Dezenzo for him.
It’s mostly based on ONE awful game at Arlington when maldy and Joe just left him out there, didn’t even go talk to him during a big blow up inning That, and the fan base here on CF is very pessimistic
I wrote a Framber article and dropped today. Our very own fan from Idaho is doing Hunter brown and andrew is doing the “pray for rain portion.” Topical to Framber discussion here.
I could see this one but only if Dana thinks Meyers will regress to what he has been the last couple of years Otherwise he would be a really valuable piece to give up for a platoon bat, which is what Lux is. Dude can hit RHP and we need that badly but he isn’t playable vs LHP
Reminds me of Keuchel, made his living pitching grounders instead of strike outs. They changed the strike zone to stop him.
Meh, are you referencing some other projections that say Estrada is going to be meaningfully better than Dubon going forward? I would be interested in that.
Yeah Meyers is kind of a risky player to trade, from both sides. If he maintains his current level he’s a star $25M/yr player, but nobody is going to value him that way in trade. He’s almost like a prospect in that regard.
I'm referencing actual play Year before last he hit .271 with 14 HR and 23 SB Year before that he hit .260 with 14 HR and 21 SB And that is in one of the tougher ballparks to hit in. Dubon isn't sniffing those numbers. Doobie does a good job making contact and not striking out which has some value in situations. But he also doesn't take a walk so even though his batting avg looks good to some, his on base is awful, once in a full season has he even reached .300 OBP Now if last years injury plagued season is who Estrada will be from here forward then yea, he is in the Dubon range. At 29 years old and seemingly healthy again, I see no reason to think he has suddenly become what you and fangraphs apparently believe he is. One last thing on this, although Estrada hits from the right side, he has always been a better hitter vs RHP which is exactly what we need. Year before last he had a .766 OPS vs RHP, we both know Dubon ain't sniffing that vs RHP
The projections incorporate those 2 years where Estrada was a roughly league average hitter, along with his more recent (and likely more meaningful) performance. But if you want to say Estrada has a higher offensive ceiling than Dubon, I’d agree, but that doesn’t make him the better/more valuable player. And it certainly doesn’t make him worth trading away Dezenzo. I wouldn’t complain if Houston traded for Estrada, as long as all they gave up was a fringey prospect outside their Org Top 20. But as a rental with sketchy projections he is nowhere near worth giving up Dezenzo, who is one of the 5-7 most valuable young prospects/players in the organization.
Will just have to agree to disagree. Estrada was never fully healthy last year It doesn't really matter anyway, Colorado doesn't trade away rentals at the deadline when they are 30 games back, so Estrada won't be going anywhere anyway.
If we had a stacked outfield I would agree, but Meyers right now is by and far the best outfielder we have both on offense and defense...a team in contention can't rely on an outfield full of rookies and a 5 foot 6 second baseman.
I understand where you are coming from, but because Cam's numbers were so bad early on most don't understand how good he has been the past month Last 30 Days Jake .276/.337 with a .705 OPS Cam .282/.356 with a .715 OPS Cam is showing to be pretty dang good on defense also Having said that, i'm not advocating for trading Jake unless the return was going to have a significant positive impact on 2025, and I can't realistically see that happening
Eh. I would argue they can't rely on Jake Meyers anymore than the dudes you talked about, but I understand your point. I'm fine with Smith in Right, Melton/Chas splitting CF and Yordan, Altuve, Dezenzo chopping up LF and DH. Assuming, you know- none of those guys needs their hands amputated. If they do then it just means Chas plays every day which is also probably ok with me. I don't trust Jake anymore than any of those other things we just talked about.
